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  Discussion on Introducing new mare
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Member:
Tangoh

Posted on Thursday, Apr 3, 2003 - 2:41 pm:

We have just purchased a 5 year old mare who was 'middle of the herd' in a group of 3.

We started by keeping her across the fence from our 6 year old mare and 7 year old gelding for a full week. They could visit without interacting too much. There was the usual kicking (solid fence) and biting and squealing but nothing too dramatic.

We have since opened up the two adjoining paddocks and turned them together. Nothing too dramatic, except at meal time. She's allowed to eat with them if we watch them. As soon as our backs are turned they chase her away. She can eat quietly from a separate pile without too much bother from the other two that are joined at the hip!!

The big dilemma is that we are experiencing nasty spring blizzard conditions, high winds, snow and cold for this time of year. Our new horse is not allowed into the 3 1/2 sided barn, even at the doorway. If she sticks her nose in, they chase her out, even though we have started feeding them at the other far end from where we've tried to feed her. They will not allow her access to the barn under any circumstances. We've had to feed her outside. She is a little on the thin side, so getting enough feed is problematic enough, we have to stand and make sure she gets her share because the other two are virtual vacuums and will eat theirs and then eat what she hasn't eaten yet. They have pretty much shed out already so a place out of the weather during a blizzard like this is important too, especially I think for a hard keeper. She has a few minor war wounds, nothing serious.

Does this all sound normal? Should I just let them sort it out while making sure she gets enough feed? Do you think they will eventually let her into the barn? We've never introduced horses to each other before so we're new at this. They've been together for only 5 days. I'm contemplating locking her in the barn but the gate on it is not solid and I worry about someone getting their feet caught if they decide to fight. I'd rather have her out in the cold weather than a horse with a broken leg.

Any suggestions?
Member:
Cassey

Posted on Thursday, Apr 3, 2003 - 3:50 pm:

Maybe a water proof turn out blanket so she can stay out but not be too cold?
Member:
Leilani

Posted on Thursday, Apr 3, 2003 - 5:32 pm:

5 days isn't that long for them to adjust especially during feeding time; she may always be at the bottom of the 'food' herd. Even the best of buds can get alittle anoyed with each other when there is food involved. They should learn/grow to tolerate each other in time. Sounds like you're doing what can be done (don't lock her in barn), she'll figure out when they want her around and when not. Good luck
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Friday, Apr 4, 2003 - 4:15 am:

Pretty normal behavior for horses. If the conditions warrant shelter for the horses, I would build a seperate run in shed for the horse. She may just continue to try and get in with the others however.
DrO
Member:
Suzeb

Posted on Friday, Apr 4, 2003 - 9:53 am:

Hi Sherri,
I'm chuckling over the run in shed idea as I know what the weather brought. How about a "Snowfort". You probably haven't built one of those since you were a kid. You might want to build another one eventually anyway in case you have to put somebody in solitary confinement. When you feed your horses, are they eating from one pile or do you give each horse their separate ration? You might try 4 or 5 seperate piles of hay so that everybody has their own and 2 more for Tulsa to go to if Tango and Jazz are chasing her off. Good Luck with the building project! Cheers, Susan B.
Member:
Tangoh

Posted on Friday, Apr 4, 2003 - 10:26 am:

Well, last night we weakened. It was so cold and windy and still snowing, we put Tulsa in the barn so she could have at least one night of peace and quiet to enjoy her feed. If she wasn't too thin already I don't think any of this would bother me. She has the full run of the barn and can still visit over the gate with the other two. She seemed quite happy actually. But Tango on the other hand was really miffed. He literally was grabbing the gate with his teeth trying to get in with her. We'll let her out today of course but I think we may have to build another 3 sided run in for her.

Hi Susan, nice weather, eh? This is getting ridiculous. We've got snow banks in front of our house the size of our truck!!! Hopefully mother nature will take care of it next week, it's supposed to be warm. About your idea of the 4 or more piles of hay....good idea....and we'll do that..but with the hurricane force winds we've been having it's really just a waste to do that as it all blows away. Now that the wind has subsided a bit though we will do that again, it seems to work, although it's one big merry go round. Wherever she goes, Tango goes and chases her away. He wants complete control that's for sure. I'm so surprised, because he's a gelding!!!

What about removing Tango to experience being alone, and leaving her to 'pair-bond' with Jazz for a week or so? They seem to be fine together. Would I just be putting off the inevitable one-sided fight that has to happen between her and Tango?

Member:
Tkranch

Posted on Friday, Apr 4, 2003 - 7:12 pm:

Removing the trouble maker for awhile may work. I raise pheasants and they get the terrible testosterone rush in the spring. When one starts being the Alpha and bullying the others I put him in timeout. After about a month there when they are released they are at the bottom of the pecking order. It works for other animals but the timeout periods must be long enough for them to loose their herd or flock status. Good Luck and hope the weather warms up for you.
Kat
Member:
Tangoh

Posted on Saturday, Apr 5, 2003 - 10:45 am:

We've made a revelation. We actually think that it may be the other mare inflicting the nasty bites, it's just that we catch the gelding chasing her so we assume it's him, but this morning we watched the other mare reach across the feed tub and nip Tulsa on the back of the neck.

An old cowboy from here recently told me that us humans sometimes get overly involved in this process and we'd have peace in the herd sooner if we'd just let things be. He told me that unless you witness absolute out and out warfare whereby it looks like someone is going to get the stuffing knocked out of them and possibly go down, to try and ignore the biting and kicking and chasing that results in superficial bites, and bruises and swelling that a newly introduced horse might receive. He said that their skin is 8 times thicker than ours and that it looks a heap worse than it is. He did however agree that it's a good idea to keep them separated for at least the first week, after you've determined that the new horse is healthy and won't pass on anything to the rest. So, any comments on this 'old cowboy's' advice?

Tulsa (the new mare) seems happy, is eating with them with the occasional short chase, pinned ear and nipping episode from one of the other two but she follows them wherever they go and does not want to be alone.

My husband thinks I'm worrying overtime (can't help it...I'm a mother) and that I should let them sort it out. There's nothing really brutal going on, just the occasional chase around the pasture and the odd nip. We have noticed that both mares have bite marks so I think Tulsa is at least sometimes fighting back.

Tango remains unscathed, a beautiful black coat, while the other 2 look like they just got back from Iraq. He's either a 'neutral country', and not part of the 'war' that is going on between the mares, or just has the ability to appear 'saintly' when we're around and is inflicting the bites on both of them when we're away.

I wish I could be a fly on their shed. They all behave like perfect horses when we're there.

A poor attempt at some humor, but my husband refers to them as George W (Jazz), Saddam (Tulsa), and Jean Chretian (Tango)....Jazz being the one who has declared war, Tulsa being the enemy and Tango being our ridiculous prime minister in Canada who wouldn't support the US. I'm not sure I like Tango being assimilated to Jean Chretian, or Tulsa being assimilated to Saddam, but it was funny when we walked away and he said, well, let's go home and let George W, Saddam and Chretian sort things out on their own.
Member:
Hwood

Posted on Saturday, Apr 5, 2003 - 11:07 am:

Sherri,
Go with the cowboy . . . and I like your husband's sense of humor :-)

Holly
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Sunday, Apr 6, 2003 - 8:56 am:

Not having actually seen what is happening I cannot tell if you are worrying overtime, but when it comes to feeding time and limited shelter, some horses do not share no matter how much time goes by. I think your best bet is to insure today everyone has adequate shelter and food and if they do learn to all get along under the same roof all the better.
DrO
Member:
Tangoh

Posted on Sunday, Apr 6, 2003 - 11:14 am:

Well, the war in Iraq might not be over, but it appears to be over in our paddock. George W (Jazz) definitely won and is world power in our paddock having successfuly put Saddam in his (her) place, and Jean Chretian (Tango) just wants to know when he gets fed again.

All kiding aside, Tulsa has actually learned to pin her ears and show a little of her own attitude. I think she decided she wasn't going to take it anymore. The other 2 seem to be respectful of that and we actually saw her move the two of them off from her at her feed tub, however she still knows her place, which is definitely at the bottom of the pecking order. They are co existing without any notable conflict, we've been just hanging about watching them for a couple of days and we see only the normal type of interactions between horses. Now we just have to wait for the hair to grow back! Thank goodness we're not into showing, Tulsa wouldn't be winning any beauty pagents right now, but nothing that won't grow back. George W (Jazz) suffered only minor casulties.

That said, you're right Dr. O., I think we will still build another shelter, as I don't think there's enough room for George W and Saddam to ever be happy under the same roof. Hopefully, George W will allow Jean Chretian back in, in time. Right now though, we have a definite winner and there is once again, peace in the valley!

As for my husband's sense of humor, I certainly hope these little pet names he's given them don't stick! I much prefer Jazz, Tulsa & Tango.
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