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  Discussion on Festulolium and ??? Endophytes
Author Message
Member:
mitma

Posted on Thursday, Oct 18, 2007 - 10:59 am:

Hey Everyone,

I'm trying to buy seed to plant our pasture and I have a question about a grass known as Festulolium... apparently, it's a hybrid produced from fescue and ryegrass; now, usually, it's produced from "meadow" fescue vs. "tall" fescue and a perennial form of ryegrass. I've looked at most of the info from Dr. O's articles and I've searched the internet, but what's NOT clear to me is whether or not festulolium contains endophyte, similar to fescue... Overall, I plan to plant a mix of primarily orchardgrass with a little bit of ladino clover and maybe some other things; I can certainly buy individual types of seeds and mix them, but there are commercial mixes available and some of them contain the festulolium... One mix I found online that I'm interested in is the "Mid-Atlantic Grazer Mixture" produced by Pasture Perfect. It contains 35% Tekapo Orchardgrass, 15% Profile Orchardgrass, 20% Duo Festulolium, 20% Tonga Tetraploid Perennial Ryegrass, 6% Starfire Red Clover, and 4% Jumbo Ladino Clover. Since I may adopt another pregnant mare this year, I really wanted to avoid fescue... even the endophyte-free type... Thanks for any info!
Martha
Member:
ekaufman

Posted on Thursday, Oct 18, 2007 - 12:29 pm:

Hi Martha,

Pasture Perfect seems to have a good website. I didn't see that mix on the homepage, but they advertise several mixes as endophyte-free. I don't know whether that means that it stays free forever or just ships that way and can become "infected" later on. They have a place to submit questions directly. I also know that endophytes vary regionally.

If I were you, I would call my local repro. vet and agricultural extension office (if there is one). My extension office here keeps lists of safe seed mixes for cattle and horses that will also grow in this climate.

Good luck!
Member:
mitma

Posted on Friday, Oct 19, 2007 - 2:15 pm:

Thanks for your input... well, I've talked to both my local "crop & soil" extension agent AND a representative from the Pasture Perfect/AMPAC seeds company... and, guess what, I got two different answers! Nonetheless, because the company scientist stated that the Festulolium would NOT be susceptible to endophyte contamination in later generations, I decided to go with the products from AMPAC seeds... I ended up getting them from a nice, family run distributor in Iowa who is mixing a special formulation for me. I'm getting 40% Orchardgrass (Tekapo), 20% Perennial Ryegrass (Tonga), 20% Festulolium (Duo), 15% Timothy (Tuukka), and 5% Ladino Clover (Jumbo). We'll see what grows from this...
Martha
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 - 10:54 am:

Hello Martha,
So the company rep says that the fescue/rye grass hybrid is not susceptible to endophyte infestation? Does the county extension say he has proof the other way? And I wonder what is the advantage of including this hybrid in the mix? Since it cannot reproduce from seed is it a heavy rhizome/tiller former?
DrO
Member:
mitma

Posted on Saturday, Oct 20, 2007 - 4:16 pm:

Hey Dr. O,
No, my extension agent did NOT say that, rather, he basically postulated that if the festulolium grass "goes to seed" then the resulting new growth offspring might be susceptible to endophyte infestation... Overall, he seemed a bit unaware of festulolium characteristics. And, of course, the company scientist stated that subsequent populations resulting from seed propagation would NOT be susceptible to endophyte infestation. Since then, I've done alot more reading about plant/grass reproduction and cultivation (it's really kinda embarrassing to have an undergraduate degree in Biology and to have forgotten so much basic plant biology)... It seems that when any endophyte-free species is planted and then, years later, the field "reverts" to an endophyte-infected population, it does so because "volunteer" seeds (that may be infected) land in the field from other areas... So, really, it's not like a "mature" blade of grass gets infected from endophyte blowing through the air, but rather, an endophyte-infected seed has to grow and be more successful than the original seed planted. Regarding the issue of the festulolium reproducing from seed, apparently some cultivars may do that... I stumbled across some (difficult to read) articles published in crop science type journals that discussed ways of making festulolium cultivars more fertile for seed propagation... And, everything I have learned online says that though the perennial ryegrasses are classified as bunchgrasses, as is the festulolium (unlike traditional fescues which appear to be more sod forming types???), the fescue parent genes convey a higher rhizome/tiller forming capacity to the festulolium hybrid, relative to the perennial ryegrass parent, which I guess facilitates "vegetative" reproduction in the plant... Basically, the festulolium is supposed to be much more palatable (and nutritious?) than fescue to horses and cattle, but is much more hardy than perennial ryegrass, so it should tolerate the close grazing of horses better. Also, it is supposed to produce a better crop yield than other perennial ryegrasses, as well as fescues. I know I have probably over-analyzed this little project to death, but because at times I will have a high horse density (possibly 8-10 horses) and only a 5 acre pasture, I wanted to make the most out of what grows. There's some additional information at www.ampacseed.com/duo.htm, just click on the "PDF-SPEC sheet" link at the upper right side of the page or the "festulolium facts" page link at the bottom of the screen. There's also some info at the company I purchased the seed at, www.welterseeds.com, just click on the seed catalog link. Also, we're in the process of finishing cross-fencing which will allow for 6-7 areas within the 5 acres, so I can practice an effective rotational grazing system.
Martha
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 - 10:17 am:

If that is your extension service's concern, I agree with the plant scientist: if the festolium is resistant to endophytes and goes to seed, it seems unlikely that the next generation would be susceptible. However there should be great heterogeneity in the next generation and I am surprised that the hybrid is fertile enough to form viable seed. Most plant and animal cross-species hybrids are either sterile or when they do mate form less robust versions of the original hybrid. However considering your situation, seeding out is an unlikely event.
DrO
Member:
mitma

Posted on Sunday, Oct 21, 2007 - 11:14 am:

Thanks Dr. O... you're right, having 8-10 horses on 5 acres, even with good rotational grazing being practiced, it's NOT likely that I'll ever have a portion of the pasture "go to seed"!
Martha
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