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  Discussion on Outdoor Arena Help
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Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, Mar 14, 2008 - 10:12 pm:

Hi all I need your brain power again. I want to put together some sort of outdoor arena for summer/fall use only. You guys know our winter weather here! I will probably be using it from May thru Oct. Right now I just use a small flat spot of our pasture next to the creek. I will have to have it be bulldozed to a bigger size. I do want to keep this as cheap as possible, but nice. If I can't use it for a few days because of mud that is fine. Here are my questions....
#1. I think I can get the dimensions to 100' x 200' would that be big enough? I will be using it mostly to practice barrels, fool around with small jumps,pole bending, and to practice getting pretty doing circles.

#2 would grass be OK for footing. That is what we practice on now, but have found it to be slick at times, but really can't afford to go whole hog on footing, my neighbor has grass footing in hers and I have no problems with slipping there?

#3 I would like to have some kind of a visual barrier, but don't think I want to use rail road ties. I was thinking of something along the lines of the wide vinyl strips of electric fence...not hot of course. I will be riding Hank in there and it is more for a visual reference I have no problem keeping him where he belongs.

Any other ideas would be appreciated....keeping in mind my budget is very limited. I've been wanting to do this since we moved here. Keep in mind this will be in a pasture we do use...mostly for the horses and occasionally the cows.

Here is a pic of the area I use I am hoping to have the hill to the left dozed. It has a creek to the right of it and it is probably the only flat spot on the place, close enough to build an arena anyway. Thanks
Member:
mysi

Posted on Friday, Mar 14, 2008 - 10:53 pm:

Hi Diane! I have to say, there's nothing like having an arena to ride in! That area looks like a great place for it.

1)Yes, 100x200 is nice size, thats what mine is and it's great. I would love to have double that size, but it works just fine. I do alot of flat work, gymnastic exercises and jumping. I can't get more than a 4 stride line in there, 5 on the diagonal. But again, for what I do it's fine. Here a pic, I need to take one with the jumps in it so you can get a better idea of the size.
Riding Ring

2)Personally, I think that grass footing is the best footing for a horse, especially for jumping. It has that natural give and cushion as well as firm support. The downfall of it though is that it doesn't hold up well. It gets tore up fairly quick if you ride daily.

3)Your visual barrier idea sound great. Thats a good inexpensive way to go.

Good luck with it, I'm excited for you. My ring was here when I moved in and I am currently looking into getting better footing in it without spending a fortune.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, Mar 14, 2008 - 11:16 pm:

Oh Melissa I would kill to have that arena!!! That looks huge, maybe I don't have that much room I need to measure. I'm kind of undecided about the grass we have slipped in there before. That could be because it is in the bottom and stays dewier OR because it is so small we ride kind of tight on circles. I don't seem to have slipping problems other than doing circles. Thanks for the pic...Very nice.
Member:
paardex

Posted on Saturday, Mar 15, 2008 - 4:51 am:

Hi Diane I have a small lunge ring[20 mx20m] of sand and for the rest I use grass just as you do.
I use electric wire [1cm and white] and poles for temporary fences[without electricity] on it just like you for visualizing the boundaries.
I love grass but do only lungeing and a bit of dressage and some cavaletti work. Jumpers have shoes with holes in it and you can put pins in it when you want to ride[sorry my Enghlish!] Barefooted I never had problems with the grass but then we don't have 'full stops?' though our horses are much less surefooted. I think it will work out for you. Good thing is if it gets muddy you put the 'arena' in another place though for you finding a flat space could be a problem.
One thing I used and was very inexpensive is sand in a circle round pen size for lungeing.
You just put sand on the circle where the horse walks. [hope you get the idea]
I could lunge on the days the grass was to wet.
Jos
PS 'Rail road things' on the ground cost a friend a very good horse: it reared fall backwards and with its back on the wood.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Mar 15, 2008 - 7:23 am:

Jos do you just have one strand of the white electric fenceing for the "barrier"? Could you possibly take a pic of it. I would love to see what it looks like, I can't quite picture it in my mind.

The rail road things were used where Hank was broke out and I did not like them.

Another thing I was thinking would work is plastic PVC pipe elevated slightly of the ground. I'm torn between the 2 choices, that fit my very small budget.
Member:
ekaufman

Posted on Saturday, Mar 15, 2008 - 10:55 am:

Hi Diane,

If you only need a visual edge, why not carefully lay a chalk line and spray it with Round-Up to give you a dead-grass line? Then you could use your money for something functional. Or just set out milk jugs filled with sand or water for corners?

Grass can be slick for something like barrels. I prefer a not-to-deep sandy footing for anything where they may slip. If you decided to do that, the cheap way is to confine your horses temporarily to the arena so they eat down the grass, and then spread your sand on top.

Jos is right that horses that compete on grass typically have screw-in studs to prevent slipping. Those can cause their own set of problems.
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Saturday, Mar 15, 2008 - 10:55 am:

Diane,

My arena is grass and I think it is 125 feet by 80 feet. It's big enough for what I do, and has the toughest grass turf I could buy here. It can be slick, and I do have to stay off of it when it's really soft (don't it seem like we spend all our time waiting for it to thaw, then dry up, then for the dust to settle, etc?)

I have a round pen that is half sand and half grass just because there is sand behind the barn. I find the sand freezes hard and rough, and I no longer want anything but grass for my working areas outside. Remember I am in Upper MI, so weather is like yours. I left my cones in the arena, and they are 18" tall, I can just see the tops now!

I use 2 strands of Horse Guard fencing for both the arena and round pen. Two strands is fine. I DO NOT like if for the round pen as I've had horses take it down when initially saddled and putting on a rodeo, but I like if fine for the arena. You could use any webbed fencing just be sure to use t post covers if you use steel posts.

If I could afford it, my arena would be the Centaur wide vinyl fence, with square wooden posts. And my round pen would be with the steel panels! Won't happen, but it's a nice dream I have!

You could do just the PVC pipe; I 've seen people do that, and put plastic mesh on the bottem...let's see, a combination of wood, pvc pipe, and some plastic mesh. Comes in handy if you have cats or dogs that decide to come and visit you will working in there.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Mar 15, 2008 - 11:36 am:

Thanks I don't think I want to go with sand, the animals graze their also. I don't think I will be letting the cows in there because their manure is like ice no matter how much I harrow it. WELL I guess that ans. my question as far as a fence goes I need something to keep the cows out!! The cows are electric tape fenced trained so I don't think they would bother the tape if it wasn't hot. They are not in that pasture often...but when they are that seems to be the only place they poop!

Would maybe just killing the grass off completely and having the dirt as footing be a bad idea? HMMMM. I have a harrow to keep it kinda loose and not packed...I think I like that idea. I suppose dust would come into play then, but if it is outside would that be a big concern??
Member:
paardex

Posted on Saturday, Mar 15, 2008 - 3:09 pm:

Just one strand Diane and I use old stuff and cut it about every thirty metres and attach it again. I somebody jumps through it breaks and it doesn't hurt. It is just meant for them and me to see the boundaries. Can't get a picture uploaded sorry but look at www.gallagher.com electric fences. But I'm sure you know them.
Jos
Member:
mysi

Posted on Saturday, Mar 15, 2008 - 6:53 pm:

Diane, depending on the dirt you have where you are it would probably be fine. You just have to be very careful not to let it get too loose and deep. That is a problem because areas like corners tend to deepen. And you will have to keep it watered in dry times. I have to water my stone dust ring once a week or so if it doesn't rain.

BTW: the pic only makes my ring look huge.
Member:
paardex

Posted on Sunday, Mar 16, 2008 - 5:10 am:

Try making the suggested lungering [circle with only the horses footing no grass] first and see how it works my neighbours in Holland did it for their Haflingers and added a little sand if it got slippery. If it works well you can kill all the grass, if not you are not immediately stuck with a big slippery or to heavy part.
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Apr 5, 2008 - 8:44 am:

I measured out how big I think I can get the area for the arena, it seems 130'x 130' is about as big as I can get. Measured out that doesn't look very big, anyone have one around that size? If it isn't worth doing I don't want to bother or maybe look at a different area.
Member:
mysi

Posted on Saturday, Apr 5, 2008 - 9:36 am:

Diane- the ring at the barn I was last at in FL was 140'x150' and it was great. It was a tad larger than what you have but not alot. I think it will be fine for you. You must be getting excited for riding weather! Is your snow finally gone???
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Apr 5, 2008 - 10:17 am:

YES the snow is gone we had a couple in the other night but didn't last long, now the mud season!

I'm glad to hear that is big enough, visually outside it looks small, but everything outside seems smaller. I'm very excited about the arena, though the bull dozer guy can't do it until May.
Member:
paul303

Posted on Saturday, Apr 5, 2008 - 7:43 pm:

I think 130 x 130 is more than adequate. Many trainers use 60 and 90 foot round pens for much of their training. I mean, jeesh, Diane, what are you doing? Headin' and heelin'?
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Apr 5, 2008 - 8:47 pm:

Lee you never know what I might do....Hank does like chasing cattle. I'm not talented enough to ride that small of a circle such as a round pen. Hank can...Diane can't.

So the bigger the better at this time anyway! I do want to run barrels and pole bend Hank has a blast doing that and so do I! I think I have the "fenceing " picked out, but the footing is baffling me. Seems most people around here have limestone or sand or a mix of both. Seems that could get pretty dusty. I don't like grass it seems we slip quite a bit on that.
Member:
mrose

Posted on Sunday, Apr 6, 2008 - 12:17 am:

Our new indoor will only be 100' x 120' when it's built. It will be plenty big for keeping horses fit and to practice. It won't be big enough for roping, team penning, cutting, or jumping, but since I don't do those things anyway, I figure no problem. Unless you are taking up those disciplines, you should be fine, imo.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Thursday, May 22, 2008 - 8:14 pm:

I'm so excited the bulldozer guy is coming next week! I am still undecided about footing. I am considering discing lime into the sod. The bulldozer guy said lime was much cheaper than sand....that surprised me. He said he had a soil finisher (whatever that is) and said he thought it would work ok. Thoughts anyone? Does this sound like an ok footing?
Member:
leilani

Posted on Thursday, May 22, 2008 - 11:03 pm:

Hi Diane,

Friends of mine have an arena with a base of old tires, tennis shoes, etc. It is wonderful to ride in; just enough support and give for the horses. Leilani
Member:
liliana

Posted on Thursday, May 22, 2008 - 11:57 pm:

Hey Leilani,

That sounds so interesting!! My arena is 40m by 20m I have a mixture of old manure and shavings which I hope to cover with grass as it flies away.

But if you could get a photo of your friends arena, I thing many of us would be interested.

Regards to all

Liliana
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, May 23, 2008 - 6:53 am:

Thanks Leilani, I have heard of the recycled rubber footing. One of the barns in the area has an outdoor arena with it. It does look nice, but I don't think it is in my budget.
Member:
canter

Posted on Friday, May 23, 2008 - 7:13 am:

Glad to hear the arena will be started next week, Diane. Check into the recycled rubber, if you can. My indoor has a rubber/sand mix and it is really nice footing for the horses.

Careful about making the footing to deep. It's easier to make it deeper if you need to, but almost impossible to fix if it's too deep at the start.

Enjoy!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, May 23, 2008 - 7:28 am:

Fran where did you get the recycled rubber? Was it expensive? From my research on it, it looks kind of pricey & hard to come by around here.
Member:
canter

Posted on Friday, May 23, 2008 - 10:19 am:

Sorry, Diane - my post was a bit misleading. It's not actually MY indoor arena, it's the indoor at the barn I board at (thus I consider it "mine" ). However, if I see the BO tonight or over the weekend, I will ask where they got it and how much it cost. It's relatively common around here - I've seen it at a few barns that I've shown at or where I've attended clinics. Will let you know.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, May 23, 2008 - 4:01 pm:

As I was walking around my routes today, admiring some peoples great landscaping. It occured to me that they sell that rubber mulch now in different colors. I'm not sure but I think they sell it in bulk also at our local hardware store. That would be the same thing they use in arenas wouldn't it?
Member:
canter

Posted on Saturday, May 24, 2008 - 11:19 am:

Not sure, Diane. The arena rubber is just larger than crumb size pieces; I've only ever seen it in black. How big are the pieces of the rubber mulch are you seeing in the landscaping?

I found pricing for the arena rubber - it IS a bit pricey: $1500 - $3000 for 15,000 sq ft + delivery charges. Your arena, at 100 x 200 feet is 20,000 square feet. I didn't shop around for the above price, so you may be able to find it cheaper or you could mix less in to cut down on costs, but I don't know if that would defeat the purpose or not.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, May 24, 2008 - 1:12 pm:

Fran the landscape mulch is shredded looks just like fine mulch. Here's an example of what it looks like.
I haven't priced it yet, but I imagine the price is comparable to the horse stuff....but think I'll take a look at least I can find the mulch locally, and I like the idea of colors. I imagine the black would be very hot in July's sun. Thanks
https://www.internationalmulch.com/rubber_mulch_colors_rubberific.asp
Member:
canter

Posted on Saturday, May 24, 2008 - 4:53 pm:

Hmmm, never saw the landscaping mulch before. You could get very creative with that stuff! Not sure why it wouldn't work just as well as the stuff sold for arenas and because it doesn't have "horse" attached to it, it's probably cheaper!
Member:
wgillmor

Posted on Saturday, May 24, 2008 - 9:02 pm:

I haven't used or seen rubber landscape mulch, but I'd want to be sure is it not made from shredded steel belted tires. I can imagine the rubber disintegrating and the steel shards entering everything from the frog to the fetlock.

Wiley
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, May 24, 2008 - 9:55 pm:

Wiley it says it is free of metal.
Member:
mysi

Posted on Saturday, May 24, 2008 - 10:21 pm:

They use that landscaping mulch in playgrounds in Florida all of the time. It is the same stuff used in the rings I've seen too. Not sure of the cost, but your right, when the word horse isn't attached it's cheaper! I've been interested in getting it too. My concern at my place is that my ring sits flat but slopes down on 3/4 of it around the outside and with heavy rain and winds it would all wash away.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, May 24, 2008 - 10:51 pm:

Melissa just from some of he research I've done on the internet it SAYS it doesn't wash or blow away. If you can take their word for it
Member:
mysi

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 8:56 am:

hmmm...wish I had the money to throw away to find out. They haven't seen the whipping rain and wind storms I get here!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 11:28 am:

I'm going to go with the crushed limestone at $2 a ton I can't go wrong. I do wonder about dust tho.

For the fence I am going with steel t-posts (cringe) covered with the sleeves and the electric tape. Should look like a nice vinyl fence at a fraction of the cost, and still be safe.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 11:45 am:

I couldn't get the url to work right in my other post, anyway this is what the sleeves look like.
https://www.horse.com/Safe-Fence/Safe-Fence-Vinyl-Sleeve-for-T-Post-BXJ20.html
Member:
dres

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 3:35 pm:

Diane, at first i just had my dressage court in.. but after a couple of babies took me for a ride OUTSIDE my court , we put up the t posts with sleeves... it is perfect..

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 3:55 pm:

Great Ann..thanks for the picture. It is nice looking too. Did your sleeves come with brackets for the fence or did you get them separately? Around here the ones with the brackets on are 7.50 a piece, the way I have it figured it's much cheaper to do it myself....tho I'm sure it will be irritating. We have the t-posts around here, so I think I can get a nice looking fence for around $400. I thought about doing the dressage court thing, but remembered I have to keep the cows OUT!

Thanks again for the pic, it sure helps when you can see a finished product.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 3:59 pm:

Forgot to ask something that I haven't quite figured out, what did you do for a gate?
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 4:07 pm:

Ann you should have never posted that pic,. Now my mind is full of questions. How far apart did you put the posts? Hubby seems to think 10-12ft would be ok. THANKS
Member:
dres

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 5:04 pm:

No problem.. The posts are about 15ft apart.. remember this is just to keep me in when riding a young horse.. and it is not hot.. I have a swing metal gate right at the barn there, so IF i wanted to turn a young horse out i can close it.. other wise i don't.. BUT you can use those spring loaded gates that you can buy with the electric tape that will work fine..
As you can see we use one of those spring loaded catches there at the end.. So when i have to get more sand it is easy to open for the trucks to come in... but does not change the look at all..
guess you really can't see the open end to well. .:-(

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 6:27 pm:

Thanks Ann I appreciate it. Hubby wanted me to ask what you used on the corners so they don't pull in.
Wood posts?
Hopefully that will be my last question
Member:
dove2

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 7:27 pm:

No Diane, I hope it's not your last question. I need the same info and am greatly helped here. I am planning to create an 80x200 foot riding arena, which will need temporary fencing. Hopefully, I can cover it later on when we save up enough money. Your post is very timely and helpful. Ask a ton of questions!
Member:
mrose

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 8:23 pm:

I've been out of town and mostly off line, but am now reading this and the posting on arena footing and finding some good info. So, ask away Diane! We are in the process of building an 80' x 125' (?) arena, and will have to move my small out door arena. I want a 60'round pen too. I like the look of the fencing Ann has used, and it sounds inexpensive and easy and I think would be great for an outdoor arena as long as your not chasing cows. I'm also intrigued with the rubber footing on the other post. Loved reading about using oil on sand, too.

So glad you're getting a safe place to ride, Diane! Fighting traffic on a horse is tough on all concerned.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 8:53 pm:

Well you asked for it. I found a bungee gate on line I love bungee cords for some reason
The one on the web is electrified which I don't need
So I was thinking a regular bungee cord/cords would work as well and I like the Idea of making it as big or small as you want. I did have to lol at the thought of a horse trying to run out and getting bounced back in
https://www.kvvet.com/KVVet/productr.asp?pf%5Fid=97102&gift=False&0=dept%2Easp%2C dept%5Fid%3D198%26Tree%3D%2CComplete%20Catalog&1=dept%2Easp%2Cdept%5Fid%3D125%26 Tree%3D0%2CLivestock&2=dept%2Easp%2Cdept%5Fid%3D128%26menu%5Fid%3D%26Tree%3D1%2C Fencing%20Supplies&HSLB=False&mscssid=0A4C36E81BC094FD0A184E1CC868DC23

I also found you don't have to put wood posts in the corners...which is great
https://www.horse.com/Horse-Fencing/Horse-Fence-Accessories/Corner-Insulator-Fenc e-Tensioner-BXC24.html

Now if Ann would be kind enough to tell me how she attached the tape I would be eternally grateful
Member:
paul303

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 10:24 pm:

OK, Diane, I've got my whole place done in Horse Guard fencing. We started out with fancy ideas of glitzy fencing, but we are in an old growth pine forest, and rough storms and high winds bring those huge old trees down.....on the fence. Repairs were costly and time consuming. When we switched to Horse Guard, the trees and limbs just fall on the tape and stretch it. You just have to "pull" your fence straight to "repair" it. Takes only seconds.

We have 14' pipe gates, with a set of 4x4 posts ( about 8' apart )on either side of the gate with one 4x4 run horizontal between each 2 post set. The 4x4's are covered with sleeves and the t - posts are covered with 2 or 2 1/2" pvc pipe from Lowes ( they sell caps too ). We bought the pvc in 8' lengths and cut them in half. We got the sleeves and caps for the 4x4's there too. The clips and fencing came from the feed store. We attached the clips to the pvc covered t-post with self tapping screws. It's really not such a terrible job. LOADS easier than setting wood fence posts ( that trees can fall on and break ).

We've had this for 4 years, and no horse has challenged it ( of course, ours is electric ), got caught in it or tried to run through it. We did not reinforce the corners. We've never had to repair broken fence or replace damaged fence. The stuff just stretches slightly and "gives", and all it takes is a little tug to restore it.
Member:
dres

Posted on Sunday, May 25, 2008 - 11:19 pm:

Lee Horse Guard is what we used all over this place and the arena.. I LOVE IT.. its easy to put up and easy to fix if and when something falls on it or a horse kicks out.. and that horse does not loose a shoe or cut up his leg when doing so.. !~

Diane here is the link https://www.horseguardfence.com/newcatal/catal.php there is a photo of the spring loaded gate latch and also how the tape connects to the sleeves over the t posts.. all tho , we have an older model and the latches just punched in by hand.. these are screwed in it appears..
I can't say enough good about this kind of fencing..
OH and another bonus , starting the young ones , you know how they like to rub your legs into the wall when learning to steer.. ? Well this does not hurt one bit.. :-)

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, May 26, 2008 - 6:14 am:

Thanks! The horse guard fence sounds wonderful. I do remember riding young horses and getting the leg rub...altho I don't plan on any young ones again.
Hubbby put up some cheap type tape for the cows and it would stretch and end up on the ground in the wind & snow which has been another concern of mine. Last night we had a tornado go thru 2 mi. east of us for the second time this spring and the wind was horrible!

Lee I did consider pvc pipe, but getting hubby to cut it probably would be a chore & I THINK the sleeves are comparable in price.

Thanks again I have a plan now!!!
Member:
erika

Posted on Monday, May 26, 2008 - 8:30 am:

LOVE this thread! Great questions and even better answers. Now to file it away for someday...
Erika
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, May 26, 2008 - 9:59 am:

WOW I figured out how much a finished fence with that gate,horseguard tape, sleeves,brackets and all for my arena which is going to be approx 120' x 120' can be done for about $400...for a good looking fence!!! (we have the steel stakes). You guys are great!!!!

Now please help me hammer out the footing. I am going to go with the crushed limestone, when not packed it has the consistency of heavy sand around here anyway. Our ground is HARD clay. Can I just dump the lime on top? Does the grass/topsoil need to be removed first? 2 inches thick is about the right depth?

Thanks again for any direction
Member:
dres

Posted on Monday, May 26, 2008 - 10:19 am:

Diane when you say hard clay on the base.. does it turn into peanut butter when soggy wet? If so you need to get rid of that put down another base then add your washed sand.. If this clay does turn you will eventually loose your sand to the peanut butter clay if you ride on it when wet..
And remember to start out with less sand, to much sand is hard on the horses and hard to change..

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Monday, May 26, 2008 - 10:35 am:

Diane,

Just getting caught up on reading this, and I would say for using Horse Guard fencing, which I use, use some 4 x 4 or even larger wood posts for the corners. I have to move corners back every spring as they pull in, we have sandy loam soil. Also, it's a cinch to set the corner tensioners on wood posts vs setting them on corner t-posts with the sleeves over them. I have to drill holes through it all, and start with a smaller drill, then a larger drill, then the self tapping screw. It's a royal pain in my opinion.

My son and husband did the main fences a few years back and it was very time consuming to drill the holes in for 3 strands of wire to be set. (I have cheated and attached the corner tensioners with the plastic tie things, but only in the round pen)

Another thing, by the time you buy your t-posts, and the covers which went up in price, you might be able to go with wood posts and spend less. Of course wood, treated even, does decay eventually so it's a trade off and the wood posts are more labor intenstive to put in.

Another tip is we don't use the holes in the sleeves for the insulators, we drilled our own to make the spacing the way we wanted it for 3 strands for the main pastures. (I think they designed the covers hoping you'd buy enough for 4 stands)My arena and round pen are only 2 strands because it's not meant to be a place to keep them locked in.

Last of all, if I were to do it over, I found some fencing that comes in difference widths, the vinyl stuff like the Centaur. I'd love that in maybe 2" widths, attached to wooden posts, in white! Not sure if it was the Centaur brand or not, but I really liked it better thant he horse guard but the HG will be great for the arena too as you can make it electric if you have to.

Just more to think about, and maybe save you some headaches!

Let us know how your footing comes out, I have grass and it's o.k., but if there is something better I am for it.

Can't wait to see the finished arean, maybe a shot of you running barrels?
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, May 26, 2008 - 10:44 am:

HMMM no it will "divit" when it is really wet, but not boot sucking mud. Surprisingly for being at the bottom of the hill it is one area that doesn't get the "boot sucking" mud. I think it may have rock under it and the drainage runs away from it also.

If you look at my very 1st post in this thread you can see in the pic there are rocks on the other side of the creek and I suspect this area is also close to rock, but not sure. If it isn't "peanut buttery" would the grass need to be removed before the lime is put in? I really have no idea!

As a side note I priced vinyl rail fence for my arena...2 boards and it came to over $2000, I'm still amazed at the savings for a similar looking fence
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, May 26, 2008 - 10:55 am:

Angie I priced the centaur fencing with post ect and it was way out of my budget. I have been saving for this arena for mos. and had almost $3000. My mother doesn't have any air conditioning so for mothers day I tapped into my arena money and had central air installed for her....she loves it! and at 82 yrs. old I thought she deserved it more than I needed a fancy arena...sigh. So now my budget is about $1500 and the dozing will be around $800...don't leave me much! BUT thanks to you guys I think I can still do it
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, May 28, 2008 - 4:57 pm:

In process...the green grass is about how big my makeshift arena was..this one measures 120'x 120" I can't wait to finish!!!! Of course rain is in the forecast for the next several days!

Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jun 1, 2008 - 9:00 pm:

Well it won't stop raining and my arena is a swimming pool, haven't been able to get the dozing done.. Talked to the limestone guy and he suggests I put down a rock base followed by packed lime, followed by loose lime. That sounds like something I should do if I want to do it right, which I do. BUT I'm pretty sure I don't even have close to enough funds. Have any of you just put lime/sand on top of a clay base? How'd it work?

Thanks
Member:
paardex

Posted on Monday, Jun 2, 2008 - 6:21 am:

Yes though it is Normandy clay and perhaps that is less heavy? I know clay soils can differ from horrible to extremely horrible to put an arena on.
My round pen was put in about six years ago, drainage around, top soil removed, and sand on top. It now needs a bit of extra sand I don't know what happened but 'experts tell me the sand mixes with the clay underneath and so 'disappears'. It has been very good [in this climate] only frozen gave sometimes a problem. Now it starts to be soaked if it rains for eaxample a whole week.
Hope this helps
Jos
PS about 15cm of sand was put on
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, Jun 2, 2008 - 7:14 am:

Jos Do I understand you right? Is your sand slowly working in and turning to "mud", that is why you need additional sand? I wonder if I just pack the lime then put sand/lime on top would work as well?

My paddock doesn't have a rock base, is on a slope, and hasn't turned to mud. It is packed well and needs additional lime this year because of washing away, but it has never been muddy.

THANKS
Member:
paardex

Posted on Monday, Jun 2, 2008 - 9:21 am:

I Had someone knowledgeable over here[he initially designed the round pen] a few weeks ago because the sand started to stay wet . He said that it mixed after a while with the undersoil and they had only taken the top soil off because they needed to get a 'horizontal part'[the pasture slopes at that part and the former owner of my house insisted on having it there.[he has loads of money so didn't mind the additional work] thats why they put a drainage around it at three sides rest of the pasture slopes against it.
Well putting some extra sand every six seven years isn't bad I think. Plus he added if the round pen had been better kept grass free and regularly harrowed it still would be fine.
So yes they removed the grass evened it out[?] and then put about 15 centimetres of sand on it.
On the sandy soil I had in Holland you either needed to put something in between [a special tissue] or it mixed much faster.
Does this help?
Jos
PS It is of course not 'heavily used' One or two horses an hour a day approximately this does make a difference
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jun 8, 2008 - 8:39 am:

Friday the wind blew all day and No rain...well not much. The bulldozer guy was able to finish...pretty much anyway. Big pile of extra dirt in the middle, other than that he is done.

We have had rain and lots of it ever since he dozed that up, yesterday after a little shower I went down and checked how big he was able to get it (100' x 130') surprisingly it was quite dry and firm. I don't think I need the gravel base if after weeks and weeks of heavy rain it dried up that fast....literally overnight.

Hubby also thinks I should use wood posts rather than the t-posts and sleeves (for durability) told him if he wants to dig the holes fine... but I'm not going to.. We are also debating the tape, what he uses for the cows sags in our never ending strong winds and ends up on the ground when it ices up, so I am considering the poly rope instead. My neighbor has the poly rope for her turnouts and it holds up well in our weather, doesn't sag with ice/snow and doesn't stretch in our strong winds.

So the new plan is wood posts, poly rope, no rock for base (thankfully) and lime for footing, also a regular light pipe gate.

Rain all week again so I have plenty of time to ponder this, does this sound safe yet functional?
I'm open to any opinions. Thanks
Member:
canter

Posted on Wednesday, Jun 18, 2008 - 7:48 am:

Hey Diane,

In case you didn't see it, the July issue of Dressage Today has an article on arena footing - pros & cons of different types. I haven't read through it yet, but you may want to find a copy for info & ideas.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Jun 18, 2008 - 5:29 pm:

Thanks Fran I'll check it out. If they have dressage today in our 1 horse town
Member:
canter

Posted on Thursday, Jun 19, 2008 - 7:29 am:

Let me know if you can't find it and I will scan it and email it over to you.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jun 28, 2008 - 7:54 am:

VERY good news, mother nature actually smiled on us last week and Lake Arena dried up. Bulldozer guy (neighbor) came and finished the dozing yesterday.

He got done about 830 last night, and at 9 it was raining so hard you couldn't see out the window, so back to Lake arena.

And just to show my WHY thread was way off...(hubby helps him quite often with farm things) he only charged me for the fuel for the dozing!!!!!!
So instead of the projected $1000 or more it only cost me $200. He put quite a few hours in between rainstorms, his job, haying, and planting crops...What a NICE GUY!!! he usually charges $150 an hour.

He and hubby think I should harrow it when it dries up and see if I think just the dirt/clay would suit me for footing.
Do any of you you have that for footing? Thanks
Member:
lilo

Posted on Saturday, Jun 28, 2008 - 9:44 am:

Diane - the arena in our neighborhood was dirt/clay when I moved here. It was not very good - it got baked hard when it was dry, and was slippery when wet. We finally went and packed down the clay to form the basis for the arena, and added washed sand to a depth of about 3 inches on top. We also got a harrow that does not dig too deep (so it does not dig up the clay base underneath) and use that periodically. Other than being very dusty when dry (and used by many horses at once), it really has held up pretty well. We do add more sand occasionally (maybe every 2 or 3 years).

Just my experience - and it really depends on how much clay there is in the base.
Lilo
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jun 28, 2008 - 10:00 am:

Lilo that's what I figured, it is all clay and VERY hard. I'm sure Hanks feet would probably get sore, if rode much in there. It does dry remarkably fast tho. I guess it doesn't hurt to experiment until I can get footing in there. I'm hoping it will be dry enough to harrow and try out this afternoon. I think their thinking is I can keep the top layer loose enough with the harrow to provide enough "soft" footing. Since I will be the only one using it...it could work I guess. The thoughts of the lime dust is kind of a put off. I suppose it will dry up here at some point Thank you
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jul 5, 2008 - 11:57 am:

HELP!!! We finally got the dozing done. Hubby disced up the dirt and now it had huge clumps of clay. I have harrowed and harrowed to no avail.

Hubby took disc over it again and it is better, but not even close to clump free. Any ideas how to get rid of the huge clumps? I have tried the chain link fence with weight, I have tried a regular harrow with weight. Would a roller work?

Tho far from finished I was hoping to start using it soon.

Member:
lilo

Posted on Saturday, Jul 5, 2008 - 1:05 pm:

Hi Diane,

I understand your problem - because that is what our arena was like when I moved here.

I already told you what we did to get better arena footing (with financial help from riders and eventually the HOA).

There may be other solutions - I would search the HA website - I believe there have been discussions in the past.

Lilo
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jul 5, 2008 - 2:40 pm:

GEES I took the roto tiller down....I am way to determined at this point, it worked up great and the clumps broke up well. However it would take 3 days of roto tilling and sweat to get it done AND I was going to!

Another farmer friend that we let use our tractor in the winter for feeding his cows went by. Called on my cell phone and said he had a pull behind roto tiller that will pulverize those clumps....Thank GOD. So he is coming tomorrow to do it. So with any luck I can start using it tomorrow.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jul 5, 2008 - 7:40 pm:

Oh how sweet that footing is the farmer guy came over tonite and roto tilled the arena, it LOOKS so nice. He is coming back tomorrow morning to go over it again. I will take pics when he's done. It's about 2in deep. I think if this works out I will have to get one of them somehow.

SEE good deeds do come back around eventually!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jul 6, 2008 - 6:49 am:

Dr.O. I took Lilos recommendation and read through the old arena footing posts. I see you state that deep footing can be hard on the legs.

Since roto tilling the arena up it is about 2-3 in deep. I lunged Hank in it last night to try it out, his hooves sink almost all the way in. He seemed to move fine, but it definitley was more work for him then say grass or sand footing.

His hooves loved the footing! He will not be getting worked hard, because he is so out of shape. Do I need to worry about damaging his legs?
Once it rains I will be able to adjust the depth better I believe. Thanks
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jul 6, 2008 - 8:33 am:

Farmer friend was here at the crack of dawn. Here's a couple pics of what the footing looks like now. I do have to harrow it yet. 2nd pic is my boot prints in it to show how deep it is. Now that hooves are on the mend all I need is leg issues. Final mesurments 100'wx150'L Thanks


Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Sunday, Jul 6, 2008 - 9:25 am:

Diane,

Looks like a well worked up garden spot! LOL!! I know when my horses got out this spring (funny, they got out like 3 times this year, and prior to this year, my horses never escaped) they ran through the worked up garden and I thought, "wow, that would be nice arena footing!"

Looking good, looking good. Can't wait to see a picture of you riding in it, Hank will be just dancing with joy!
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Sunday, Jul 6, 2008 - 9:36 am:

Diane I would consider footing in a working arena so deep "the foot almost sinks all the way in" too soft. I would shoot for a surface that leaves a even hoof print that is less than 3/4 inch deep. Heels sinking in more than toes is particularly bad.
DrO
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jul 6, 2008 - 9:48 am:

UGHHH I figured that, thanks Dr.O. I'll get this right yet! I'm hoping after I harrow it it will compact down some.

Angie Hank loved the footing as far as his feet go, he had quite a bucking Yahoo time at first when I lunged him in there...sigh...glad I wasn't on board... at least the landing would have been soft.

Back to the drawing board, I'm pretty good at treating hooves now, but tendons and ligaments are way out of my league...don't want to go there!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jul 6, 2008 - 11:53 am:

Harrowing put the footing at perfect depth, but guess what the lumps are back. Not nearly as big but more than I would like!

Went to wally world and got hair color, that's about all I can think of to do now. I am going bald and gray over this
Member:
paardex

Posted on Monday, Jul 7, 2008 - 6:31 am:

Diane as soon as it has rained it'll be less heavy footing[speaking from experience!]
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, Jul 7, 2008 - 6:51 am:

Jos I hope you are right, it is pouring rain right now so I'll see this afternoon. Tho I'm skeptical!
I rode Hank in it yesterday and the clumps didn't seem to bother his feet at all. Fat boy was only able to take 20 mins. of light work.
This is what it looks like now. lumps.
Member:
ekaufman

Posted on Monday, Jul 7, 2008 - 9:37 am:

Hi Diane,

I am keeping my fingers crossed for you. I will say that I have built a couple of arenas on clay, and have not personally had success with the approach you are trying. Clay tends to perform better as a base, for some of the reasons you are finding-- it clumps and packs, and is difficult to control wrt depth if you work it. My current outdoor has a packed clay base with several loads of unwashed sand mixed into a top layer of harrowed clay (sand blows out here, and the clay bakes; this footing is supposed to stay softer w/o blowing to Kansas). I wasn't able to get good footing using just clay, but I'm in NoCo, so it may be different here.

FWIW, the footing in your photos looks a bit deep to me. It's such a balancing act between reducing concussion and preventing soft tissue strain.
Member:
muffi

Posted on Monday, Jul 7, 2008 - 12:30 pm:

Diane - Not knowing what your financial situation is - i would recommend bringing in material to add to the "clay".
I have clay here too. we have brought in Large Grain sand and I also put in wood chips. (we chip our trees here our selves with our DR Chipper and have some very nice Cedar chips - smells great too) but all that added to the use of the arena - pounding hooves, have helped to totally get rid of the Large Clay Lumps we have experienced here.
Hope perhaps that may help you?
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, Jul 7, 2008 - 6:22 pm:

Sand is unbelievably expensive here...dunno why.
Lime is my next choice, they practically give that suff away. Speaking to other people with arenas around here lime gets very hard too. My vet has an arena that is lime and he said he hates it because it packs harder than the clay, also what other horse folk told me. I'll have to play with the clay and see what happens I guess. It's not like fatso gets worked all that hard at this point anyway.

Gray is gone, hopefully I can get this figured out before winter! Thanks
Member:
paardex

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 3:17 am:

Over here the mixing with woodchips is done often too.I know of people who even put their used woodshavings in. They do it to get a 'lighter' footing,perhaps if you experiment with woodchips and lime together?
I must add though that woodchips disappear but as we are near forest it's cheap to replace.
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 7:25 am:

Woodchips are an option. Our neighbor works for the county and he is always cutting trees and chipping them by the dump truck load. I wonder if black walnut would be a concern?
I'm not sure what he all cuts up.

So would lime need to be mixed with them, or would just mixing them with the clay work? I don't want to get a mess down there that will be hard to fix!

It rained SO hard last night, storm report said we had 1.5 in in a half an hour + whatever else we had through the night. From the house anyway the arena looks very good... no puddles, and it looks like the lumps my have gotten broken up, hard to tell from here for sure. Maybe mother nature gave me a helping hand for once. Will have to check it out when I get home from work.
Member:
dres

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 8:47 am:

Wood chips and shavings can cause the arena to be slippery after a rain .. just a FYI..

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
paardex

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 10:26 am:

If the arena is already loose I would think only woodchips would do. When you don't leave them there to eat it wouldn't matter what is in it[unless yours are like Grasse who tries to graze during lungeing in the pasture]
As far as I know with a not to high percentage woodchips mixed in with the clay[as your arena dries fast or won't stay wet] you would be allright with the slippery. As thick layers of woodchips are used in Holland over the trails you can ride on and Holland has a lot of rain I supposed you could use this option but....It stays Dutch information and my firsthand experience is with sand, so please try carefully if nobody else can give more information.
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 6:30 pm:

Well the arena is a mud bowl, but that is to be expected with as much rain as we had, drainage actually looks real good...no puddles or wash ditches. The lumps are greatly diminished so I'll wait and see what happens when it dries out. Too hot and humid to ride now anyway.
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 7:01 pm:

Hmmm...guess I will not complain about my turf arena. I think it's much less of a headache, just have to mow it occasionally! Ya, it is hot & muggy, we went from winter to summer this year.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 7:34 pm:

ANgie grass is starting to go back up on my list. I don't know if it seemed slick before because my ring was so small or because it is slick. What is your experience with that?
Member:
mrose

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 8:38 pm:

https://www.footingsunlimited.com/site/files/717/57793/227874/340827/GET_CONTROL_ OF_ARENA_DUST.pdf I found the above site and it had some good info on dust control, footings, etc. It is the site of a business, but even so I thought it was informative.
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 10:53 pm:

Diane,

I look at this way: With grass, I can ride in the summer, no dust. I can ride in the fall. I can ride in the winter and it's still a smooth surface; how will you keep your surface smooth as it freezes? I can ride with snow on the ground. The only time I stay outa my arena is when it's early spring and the horses would make big holes sinking in. Which they will do any wheres it muddy.

I think any surface can be slick, and maybe yours is more clay and might be more "slickery" I dunno. Horses race on turf, and don't they do steeple chases on turf?

Brian went to our garden center and asked for the toughest grass seed they had. I don't know what it is, but I figured if they do sports on grass, like soccer, and football used to be on real grass too, there has to be tough grasses available. Mine is not 100% of the "tough" stuff, it has some pasture mix in it too. I let them graze it occasionally even. It's been there for at least 4 years now, and it's not as thick yet as I'd like but I am cheap with fertilizer.

I wonder, have you considered tiling(not tilling, I mean tile) the area? It sounds like it might be a wet spot no matter what you use for the surface. Maybe check into that, or check with the county and see what they do for wet roads? On our road, which part of it becomes darn near impassable in the spring, they put some kind of mesh down before building it up.

I know some might concerend with the horses pounding away on a hard surface, but gee whiz, horses have run over the prairies forever and a day, so why do we worry so much about coddling their legs? When I ride on the road, it's hard too. Unless it's spring!

Bet you're sorry you asked now, lol!
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 11:05 pm:

P.S.,

of course the bad thing about my "turf" is that sometimes they think they are in there to eat instead of work, especially if they haven't been on pasture. The round pen is worse because they have to pass through that to graze the east pasture, so they really think that is NOT for work. If I ever live some place else and do barn and pastures, my round pen will not be off the back of the barn, nor will my arena be in one of the pastures!!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 8, 2008 - 11:41 pm:

Honestly it drains well, after 2 in. of rain mostly in a matter of an hour, It handled it way better than I thought. I don't ride in the winter, not enough daylight and I think by now y'all know I HATE winter. Due to Hanks constant weight battle I know EXACTLY what you mean by the grass diversion in a grass arena!

Sara's (thanks Sara) website states clay isn't all that bad if it has a good base....and it does. If I can't ride for a few days that's fine, I don't ride every day anyway. I'm definitely a fair weather rider. How often is it 75 degrees and sunny?(just kidding) I will probably ride 3-4 times a week if possible.

I'm going to "play" with the clay the rest of the year and see how it works and make adjustments accordingly next spring.

Thanks everyone for all the good advice, when it dries up I'll see if I can get hubby to get a pic of Hank and I in there.
Member:
pbauer

Posted on Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008 - 1:39 am:

Dear Diane,



I Googled: The Best Arena Footing Plan...a lot of great informational websites.


https://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4GGLJ_enUS224US224&q=the+best+arena+footing+plan



Dear Sara,


Great Site!! Thank you!!


Warmest Regards,
Tonya




Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008 - 8:56 am:

Diane,

Laughing here at your "fair weather rider" comment. My husband calls me that too. LOL!!! Glad I am not alone, maybe we should start a new club; "The Fair Weather Riders." WaHooo!!!

I hate riding in extreme heat, I get dizzy too easy. I hate too much wind, horses spook at everything. Cold, snow and ice don't work for me either. Yup, 70's, enough of a breeze to keep the bugs away, sunshine. Sounds great to me! We've got that today and have to run daughter to an appt, but I will enjoy this when I get home.

I can't imagine what I'd do with an indoor arena. My gosh, riding no matter what the
weather conditions? That would be a dream come true! Top it off with some nice 20 something stable hand who's tall, dark, handsome, and looks good in wranglers; and tacks up my horse for me. Shhhh, don't tell Brian, lol!!

Tonya, neat ol' picture, where's it from?
Member:
mrose

Posted on Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008 - 9:43 am:

You ladies would have a hard time in Southern Utah! If we waited to ride until the wind quit blowing and it was between 60 and 80, we'd never ride! Also, several times I've started out under ideal conditions only to be rained or hailed on before the ride was over. One memorable ride it started out with not a cloud in the sky, and before I could get back home it had rained, thunder and lightening, hailed, sleet and for good measure, a little snow! Of course, that was up in the mountains.

I can't wait to get my indoor finished!! Of course, after seeing some of the arenas in France, I may have to upgrade a little! My original plans are starting to look a little drab. Can you say "crystal chandaliers?" And here I was going to be happy to just have good footing! I'm working on getting some pictures up for you all.
Member:
erika

Posted on Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008 - 10:27 am:

Oooh, Sara, you are a woman after my own heart! LOL! I just picked out crystal sconces for my surprise tack room my husband is building for me...he didn't bat an eye! So much for my easy-to-clean suggestion above!

I think it's going to be nice..one of the construction guys told me it reminds him of a wine cellar! (Mind you, I haven't seen it yet. My husband is doing this to surprise me, but I get to pick stuff out. Do you know how happy I am to have construction going on and not have to be involved??)

One of these days, when I'm allowed back in, I'll take some pictures.
Erika
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008 - 12:05 pm:

YES fair weather rider group would be PERFECT LOL.
Ran into the wood chip guy today he was grinding trees on one of my routes, that does look interesting the chips are not huge as I imagined...almost like sawdust. I think I am going to try one load and see what happens. He said he knows what kind of trees go into every load so don't have to worry about black walnut.

Sara can't wait for pics!
Member:
paardex

Posted on Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008 - 12:48 pm:

Erika I think a combination of a tackroom and winecellar would perhaps make more husbands agreable to build one?
Jos
PS Diane I am very curious what happens with the woodchips perhaps I could use them at the muddy places of the pasture in winter.
Member:
paul303

Posted on Wednesday, Jul 9, 2008 - 10:16 pm:

Good lord! The extent of sheer GENIUS on this site is amazing!!! Sara, I can't wait to see pictures when you're able to post them! But, Erika, you're over the top! Ha! Chandeliers and Wine.....Ho, Ho, Ho, good way to get the husband involved in horses! Just remember to use caution with the vino? Right? Don't get too big for the britches you bought in Kansas!
Member:
mrose

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 12:34 am:

O.K. ladies, this is what we can all strive for! It would go really good with your new tack room, Erika
Member:
scooter

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 5:21 am:

Sara that's nicer than my house! Did you have to put that in with my mud bowl arena LOL.
Member:
canter

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 7:08 am:

Ha! If I ever find myself in an arena like Sara pictured above, I will know I have died and gone to heaven!
Member:
erika

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 8:19 am:

Sara, I'll take it!
Erika
Member:
mrose

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 9:14 am:

Of course there would be a down side to having an arena like this. You'd have to go out and buy all new riding clothes, for instance. Certainly you wouldn't want to be caught riding in the worn out pants with the fraying seems like I often wear. And then you'd probably have to get a Hermes saddle or some other butter soft hand made model. Your horse would have to just be immaculate to perform in such a place, so you'd have to hire a groom...it would mean a whole change of life style.  Erika's wine celler/tack room would be needed because I'm sure that riding in such a beautiful arena would entail drinking fine wine or champagne also!  Ah well....we can always dream!

Meanwhile, I'm very excited to report that the top half of my new arena will be shipped in two weeks, which means construction will be started within a month, I think.(The base is already done.)  I'll be riding inside this winter!!  I may have to buy a new pair of riding pants to celebrate.  I have been inspired by Erika's fancy tack room lights, though, and think I'll decorate my tack room up a little.  Funny, we are adding a master beDrOom onto the house, and I'm a lot more excited about the new arena than the house addition! Company could always pitch a tent inside the arena and be pretty warm and comfy, but I'd have a hard time riding in the new beDrOom.
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 10:23 am:

Ladies,

Cody, Tango, Willow and Gem all told me to ask you if they could PUH-LEASE come over to play in your new arenas when they are done? And bring "mom" with? LOL!!!

Love the arena picture Sara. I was telling my kids that our house is looking trashed and there are barns out there that are kept cleaner than this! Now I have proof to show them!

This will be good motivation to clean the house and the BARN today!!! Dang thing about house work though, is it cuts into riding time, drats!

I hear you about the beDrOom. Ours is done enough to live in, but the walls are "designer primer white" until flooring is picked out, and I could care less because the pastures need work, and I'd rather have nice pastures, hay in the barn, than have a fancy beDrOom! Some day, it'll all be done.

Erika,

Yes, can't wait to see the completed project!!
Member:
pbauer

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 2:23 pm:

Dear Angie,


Endearing picture; it sparked something deep within my heart. It was found while doing some business research.


God Bless,
Tonya
Member:
paardex

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 2:40 pm:

Dreams are good! We keep busy and out of trouble trying to get pasture tackroom and house in order,but I bet you anything all the Bartabas horses would gladly exchange their [handmade and designed]boxes and antique and very beautiful arena for our pastures. That's what always get's my attention a horse however valuable or unique or whatever is happy with grass shelter and hay.
Now aren't ours lucky?
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 4:41 pm:

Angie have you ever seen a horse person with a clean house? When it's nice out sorry I'm outside most of the day. Got all winter to clean and be inside. An indoor arena would be SOOO nice, but it would have to be heated for sure or I'd never use it! The outdoor one is enough of a problem
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 5:15 pm:

LOL Diane!

I hear ya about the house; if my house is clean, I'm not doing enough in the barn or with the horses, and I am usually pretty crabby then too. Now, today it's raining, so I am cleaning figuring clean is good, if not boring, tee hee. I love the smell of clean in the house! Love Murhpy's Oil Soap smell, reminds me of leather! Which lasts til the next time I head out, then horse smells over power "clean house" and I forget all about the clean house again.

Normally, the barn is cleaner, and also it's "Done" and the house is NOT; we'll be remodeling til we are in our graves I figure!

Nope, no heat needed in an indoor arena for me. Just be nice to have no wind, snow, ice, or on the hottest days, no bugs either. Think I'd take AC over heat in an indoor arena, especially since up here I'd only need the AC about 5 days over the summer, lol!

Maybe all of us "fair weather riders" should pool our resources for an indoor arena, too bad we don't all live closer together; Erika could pick the lights out for us!
Member:
mrose

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 5:42 pm:

Hey Angie, you can bring your horses down here anytime!The way my house looks, though, you'll for sure want to camp outside or in the arena or barn! One good thing about construction, it gives you a very good reason to not clean house. I try and keep the bathrooms and kitchen clean, and that's it right now. With all the dirt around, the entire place is torn up right now, it is hopeless to clean the wood floors. My barn, however, looks great! The tack room is freshly cleaned (easier due to lack of crystal lighting fixtures!) stalls are cleaned, I even have two clean horses (momentarily.) I think I'll just open that bottle of wine and forget the house!

Boy, we would all have a great time, and could learn so much from each other, if we all lived closer together and could ride together. Of course, our husbands might all leave us; it might be more than they could take!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 6:11 pm:

Uh-HUM I live right smack in the middle of y'all you are more then welcome to build an indoor here and meet monthly, have a nice flat spot bulldozed right now....Dennis isn't too far from me, he can be the "teacher" good luck with that! Tango and Hank would probably take at least a year.

If we added a beer tent to the arena I'm sure the hubbys would be happy...
Member:
mrose

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 7:31 pm:

Hmmm..a beer tent would help, especially if you built a garage or something so Lonnie could work on a bike or motorcycle while I took a clinic with Denny! I can DrOp off AJ; he should keep Dennis busy for another year!
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 9:53 pm:

When we were in KS, at Holly's, Brian took the 3 teenaged girls to the water park almost every afternoon. So, Diane, with your arena area being somewhat easier to make into a swimming pool, maybe you can set up a pool and slide, with that big beer tent, and maybe a big screen tv too?! Just downsize the arena a little bit? LOL!! And you seem to have some high ground for the tents if the IN crew still is game for sleeping in tents after getting rained out in KS.

O.K., good plan!!! And you're right, Denny would be kept busy as I still need a cowboy to ride the silliness outa Tango!

Sara,

my kitchen is semiclean..is that a word? My dishwasher if on the fritz, and being I've gotten spoilt with having one now for almost 5 years, I can't seem to get rid of dishes in plain sight. I think the tack room counter is less cluttered looking.

I've lived with floors without flooring, and exposed drywall around the windows for so long, I don't know how to act in a house that is all finished.
Member:
mrose

Posted on Thursday, Jul 10, 2008 - 11:56 pm:

I'm used to the drywall aroumd the windows, too, and the window sill that isn't there because we're going to put in a greenhouse window...someday! Maybe if we'd just quit coming up with projects and improvements we could live normal..whatever that is!

Diane, did you ever get a chance to look at that web site about footing? I've been reading the articles there about footing materials and dust. I'm rethinking the oil idea and leaning again towards watering, with maybe an additive to hold in the moisture. Who knew footing could be such an issue? For years I was happy with whatever dirt we had dug up and "fluffed" a little. In our climate I would like to keep the dust down, esp. in an indoor, and it would be nice to keep it from freezing solid in the winter.
Member:
paardex

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 3:56 am:

Angie,finished house: sell it and buy another one is my solution for one reason or other this happened 4 times in a row with me. No bathroom no heating[not good in Holland] Christmas with roof half away..But the horses always had a roof and a pasture with good fencing]
I think though if the moving bug strikes again I will look for a place near Sara or Elizabeth as they have indoor arenas.
Jos
Member:
paardex

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 3:59 am:

Diane as my round pen/lungecircle is completely overgrown with grass and 'mauvaises herbs' and you got me enthusiastic we started treating yesterday and will then turn the sand[heavy clay underneath and a low place so not to dry] and we can compare results.
For the moment I use the pasture and certainly without shoes the horses do fine on grass.
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 5:59 am:

The swimming pool idea is starting to sound like a good idea. Our monsoons are back 3in. last night in a short amount of time. I don't think there is any kind of footing that will hold up to that. Since last weekend I haven't been able to get near it because of the rain.

Sara when I worked at the equestrian center dust was a big problem in their indoor. We had to water it 3-4 times a week. We started putting salt in it (don't remember what kind) then water it lightly it would keep the dust away for a month with a light watering mid month. Kept it from freezing also. They didn't seem to have any issues with hooves or anything from it.

I did read that website and here is another good one. Take note there are 5 pages and a very good read also.
https://www.horsekeeping.com/horse_facilities/footing_1.htm

Jos I look forward to the comparisons
Member:
canter

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 7:46 am:

There is a chemical that works wonders on keeping down arena dust - unfortunately I can't remember the name of it. When I go out to the barn tonight I will check. It's white, has a propensity to clump up but the clumps are easily broken apart and only needs to be used every couple of months, depending upon humidity (or lack of). Does not harm the horses hooves. Can anyone help me out with the name? Otherwise, I will post it this weekend.
Member:
mrose

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 8:22 am:

One of the articles I read stated that salt is the most common dust suppressant after water. Calcium chloride,m though, can be hard on both tack, horses' feet, anything metal, and your boots. Even if using magnesium chloride the article said you should rinse off the horses' feet and legs and clean off your boots after being in the arena.

I was hoping to not to have to water very often. I looked at the price on all the artificial and coated sands, though, and they are very expensive. The salt would help solve some problems, but I'd still have to water more than I was hoping.
Member:
paardex

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 10:48 am:

So you would be able to mix salt in your sand arena and it will not freeze in our light winters?
Jos
Member:
mrose

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 11:17 am:

This article says to mix 2 to 4 oz. per sq. foot and one application should last about 6 to 8 months. It says the salt can be bought as a granule or liquid and they recommend the magnesium chloride as being the best to use.
Member:
mrose

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 11:18 am:

Now your neighbors will really start wondering about you, Jos, if they see you pouring salt on your dirt as well as your weeds!
Member:
paardex

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 12:42 pm:

Ha wait till they see me use my lungering when theirs are frozen!!
Jos
Member:
canter

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 12:55 pm:

Sara, I do believe my barn uses the magnesium chloride. The only time I've rinsed off my mare's legs is when it is just applied to the arena and I can see a few clumps here & there. The next day, when it's worked into the sand/rubber mix, I don't bother. I've never had a problem with her feet or legs because of the stuff, nor have I ever noticed it damaging the leather of my boots. Perhaps it's not used frequently enough to cause damage...I don't know. But it does make an amazing difference in keeping down the dust.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 2:14 pm:

How much you water it and how heavy seems to make a difference on how long it lasts. We watered enough so the top was kind of wet...little more than damp. Than lightly harrowed it in. One application worked most of the winter and no it didn't freeze Jos. If I recollect we had to lightly water it once or twice through the winter and harrow just to fluff the arena up a little. Most of the time we just had to do the "track."

My problem is getting rid of water! No dust problems this year.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 3:09 pm:

I have a question about wood chips? They are starting to look very good. Today as I was walking around my routes I noticed people that had a good amount of wood chips in their yards. The chips were not wet....remember we had 3 in. of rain yesterday. They were damp and the footing was nice and cushy and didn't SEEM slick. A lady caught me tromping around her garden checking them out, I had to explain why and she laughed at me....thankfully wasn't a cranky type lady.

Anyway the more I went along checking this out the more I liked it.

1 thing that worried me was could one of those chips lodge in the hoof easily? Some of them did seem "pointy" however when damp they seemed pliable.

Would you mix it with the clay or put it on top of it? Right now after all of the rain the clay is packed pretty hard and would make a good base.
Member:
pbauer

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 3:51 pm:

Dear All,


I'll take that arena...but only if it comes with the maintenance enforcement crew!

Who does your dusting darling; I was asked by an interior decorator... after she noticed that the top of my refrigerator needed some dusting done.
My response:



Best,
Tonya
Member:
mrose

Posted on Friday, Jul 11, 2008 - 5:14 pm:

Tonya,

If that lady came to my house right now she'd have heart failure!
Member:
paardex

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 3:06 am:

Diane I had in Holland put woodchips in a thick layer on the places where the horses entered the paddocks[about 15 cm thick]and the path they walked to the stables[sand enough there for the arena] and even though the horses [5 big mares with foals and sometimes a few 1 and 2 year olds]left and came home each day in a startling galop, I never had anyone slip or fall.
I had friends over there with less sandy soil and they mixed woodchips in [more accurate:they put a layer on top and the horses mixed it] and even though they trained dressage horses high level[at least five a day] whole year round the arena was very good they had experimented before with carpetslices and rubberslices, but found this the best solution.
They cleaned the hoofs after work [part shod young ones barefoot] and had I think once in a five year period a little problem with a piece of wood stuck in a hoof. Remember Dutch rain and clay/sandthough it rains a lot during winter in Holland too but perhaps more regular instead of 'monsoon'.Imo that would only mean for you you sometimes have to harrow to dry faster?
No dust mixed in the sand too in summer. You do need to get new ones from time to time as they disappear.
Why don't you give it a try on a round pen sized area of your arena it means you can lunge[less dangerous with unknown footing] and it is easier to undo if you dont like it.
Apart from that Holland has trailrides in the dunes who due to the sandy soil get to heavy for the 'working[read hired]horse' and they put thick layers of woodchips on the sand before touristseason to spare their horses.
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 7:02 am:

Interesting thanks Jos. It rained most of the night again, I don't know if I'll ever get this done. To put the chips in it has to be dry.
Member:
canter

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 9:44 am:

Diane, we have wood chips in the walkways around the barn (to keep mud down), but not in arenas or pastures. Occasionally, I have found a small piece stuck between shoe and frog, but no damage to the foot has been done by it. To my knowledge, the horses without shoes haven't had an issue.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 10:06 am:

Fran do they seem to sink into the mud? I really was quite impressed yesterday. The gardens that had 2-3 in of chips held up well...but a horse weighs about 1000#'s more than me. I can get a never ending supply of chips for free so the price is right also. Getting lodged in the foot is the only thing that concerns me. Hank is barefoot and hopefully he can remain that way. The pointy splinters look kind of wicked, but when damp the seemed pliable...like they would bend rather than stab.

Thanks
Member:
mrose

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 10:58 am:

I had a long conversation with a woman from one of the footing companies. She knew a lot and gave me some good info, and wasn't "pushy" about any of the products her company sells.

She told me "clay" was not a horse owner's friend" and made a terrible base, although it does make a good "sub base." She told me to compact the base layer of clay like you do if you are putting in a road, wetting it down then rolling it until it is very compacted. Then use something "powdery" for the base. She suggested what we call "D.G." (the kind without any stones in it) and what in other parts of the country is called "stone dust" "blue stone" etc. She said it has a lot of names and to talk with the local quarry folks. The base is then compacted to 100% compaction. Your footing is added on top of the base, and the kind of footing depends on your discipline, area you live in, etc., etc. Sand makes a good footing for most people; ideal if you plan on using water for dust control, is a rubber/fiber/san mix. Straight sand or a sand/fiber mix is good if you are planning to use oil for dust control.

She said there are several enviornmentally safe additives to help with dust control, one of them is a product called "Dust Down" which is added to the water (I think she said) or sprayed on the footing. It allows you to go a lot longer between waterings.

If you want to use oil, look for "off-spec" oils. She suggested calling janitorial supplies and landscaping companies as well as contacting oil companies directly. Any light grade oil is good, but "off-spec" is cheaper.

If you are building an arena, indoor or out, don't do the footing until everything else is done.

This lady is going to send me a package of footing and additive samples and more info regarding costs. I'll let you know what else I learn.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 11:15 am:

UGHHH is all I can say, but I know deep down Sara that is the way to do it. Limestone would make a good base and is fairly cheap around here.

That was my original plan until cheapo husband got involved...I should have known better of course. The clay is like rock again because of all the rain. For the main footing I'm still up in the air. If I ever get that far!
Member:
ekaufman

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 12:32 pm:

Hi Sara,

One caveat on the footing lady's advice: if you are using a standard truss height of ~14' you will save money and time by piling your sand inside the arena BEFORE the trusses go on. A dump truck can't dump sand under a 14' truss! A live-floor dump can do it, but they are expensive to hire around here.

I calculated my rough tonnage of sand and dumped it in a pile (with a tarp on it, to keep roofing screws out of it) before the trusses went up. Then I waited until last thing in the arena to spread it and oil it.

Just an idea....
Member:
mrose

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 1:19 pm:

Hi Elizabeth,

We'll have a 30' clearance in the middle of the arena, so I don't think we'll have problem. It's a Cover-All built on top of a 4' concrete wall. The Cover-All has quite an arch to it and slopes down from the top. (I'm getting SO ANXIOUS to get it all done!! I've wanted on my entire life!)
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 1:26 pm:

Sara I will say the Cover-All is impressive. A guy up the rd. has a dairy shed Cover-All...on concrete walls That shed has been there for as long as I can remember and it is still in awesome shape. Obviously they hold up well in anything mother nature can dream up, we seem to get it all.
I hope you intend to post pics of the finished product!
Member:
mrose

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 4:12 pm:

That's good to hear about how long that Cover-All has been there. It does have a 20yr. (I think it is) warranty and I know they use them at event centers, etc., but still... Like you, we live where we get about everything weather wise; especially high winds (it's not called windy until it's blowing over 30mph!) I've seen them in CO and Canada, so figured they must be pretty tough, but good to get conformation of it!

I'll post pictures; don't be expecting murals on the wall, chandeliers,etc...at least not right away!
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 7:21 pm:

Sara,

Some place by Green Bay WI, there is a HUGE Cover-All dairy barn. I am thinking it's been there at least 15 years. We've been living here 19 years and seems like we always admired it when we DrOve by it. It looks GREAT, and always say "Man, would that make a great riding arena!"

Lucky gal you are!!!!
Member:
mrose

Posted on Saturday, Jul 12, 2008 - 11:19 pm:

Angie, I AM lucky! And, excited! Why don't you all move to S. Utah and we could share? I'd love the company.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jul 13, 2008 - 8:12 am:

Told hubby I would like to do my arena "right", he still insists that just the clay will be fine...sigh. So when/if it ever dries up I will try the clay just to prove a point, then hopefully get some lime down for a base.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jul 13, 2008 - 12:54 pm:

We had about 8in of rain this week, and when it came down it came down hard! No nice all day light rain.

Here is what the arena looks like now. I don't think I will ever get it done, but after 8 in of rain don't all arena look like this?

My hoof prints




Member:
paardex

Posted on Sunday, Jul 13, 2008 - 1:53 pm:

If it get's that wet, wouldn't woodchips sink in it and mix as soon as you use it[top dry clay wet result mix?] and make things even worse? Thought popped up in my mind as I saw your pics. Boy you have extreme conditions don't listen to my advice anymore it doesn't apply to the US
Jos
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Sunday, Jul 13, 2008 - 2:36 pm:

Nope, mine would still be green, I think?

Maybe you should consider pouring cement and then putting down artificial turf? That is a mess no doubt. I guess with enough loads of sand, wood chips, chopped up rubber, etc, maybe it'll all work out?
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Jul 13, 2008 - 3:08 pm:

The thing is, I suspect if it doesn't rain AGAIN it will be dried out enough to ride in by tomorrow...maybe Tues. If that is true that isn't too bad considering the rain we had is it???

Jos this rain just isn't normal this year. Usually it is a dust bowl here my mid June and we are hoping for rain. All I can think is thank God it isn't snow. My horse are basically in an area as big as a backyard 1/2 acre tops and are FAT. I was going to update Hanks wwd with pics...finally done cleaning and it is SOOOO Windy can't do nothing outside. Might help dry arena up anyway
Member:
mrose

Posted on Sunday, Jul 13, 2008 - 7:33 pm:

Diane, if we had that much rain in so short of time, and didn't have loads of sand, our arena would be worse; it would be a gooey clay mess that would suck off your boots and the horse's shoes. And, when our clay dries, it is like adobe bricks. Yours at least looks like it will dry out and be useable. One good thing you can say about the wind, it dries things out...at least it's a good thing when you want your arena dry, not so good on your skin and hair.

We've had to put so much sand into our little out side arena and our pens because of the clay, not to mention road base on the driveway! It just sucks everything up.

P.S. I haven't mentioned to Lonnie how much our indoor arena is going to need and how much it will cost. I figure I'll get all the facts, then ply him with lots of wine, turn down the lights, put on something "sexy"...then at the appropriate moment spring it on him. It I just come right out and tell him he'll have a heart attack even before he can get the word "no" out!
Member:
canter

Posted on Monday, Jul 14, 2008 - 7:44 am:

Hi Diane, The wood chips don't sink into the mud (but remember, they are used on a walkway, not an arena, so while there's a lot of horse traffic, it's *mostly* at walk). With heavy rain - and we've had a lot of it too this year - the wood chips hold up quite well, however, the footing does get "squishy" and I wouldn't want to work a horse through it. That said, these are spread for mud control and looks. I have no idea if the 2 to 3" is what is recommended for arena use. Also, there is no prep when they are spread, such as compacting a base for an arena.

Although we've had no problems with sticks or chips injuring a horse by getting lodged in a foot, I have a hard time seeing how wood chips would make good footing for an arena...just seems too uneven to me and I wonder about how slippery it would get. But that's my conjecture and not based on actual experience with anything other than the walkways to the pastures.

One other thought...the barn gets their wood chips for free from a friend in the tree business, so the chips are uneven - lots of variation in size. I suppose that if the chips were more evenly chipped up into uniform sizes, it would be much better for an arena.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, Jul 14, 2008 - 8:08 am:

I think you are probably right. Over the weekend I did do a little research and it did say letting the base settle and weather for a year is a good idea.

So I think I am just going to "let it be" until next spring and use it when I can in the mean time. I have an electric fence up around it now to keep the pooping cows out.

At least that gives me another yr. to save up for footing and fence so I might be able to afford something semi-nice anyway.
Member:
lindas

Posted on Monday, Jul 14, 2008 - 11:21 pm:

I am new to this particular discussion...looks like you have a mess! I had a similar problem, trying to save money at the outset to ease my husband's concern about money. A local farmer convinced me that he could do the whole job with just a Bobcat and a box blade on his tractor. When it was done it looked okay to the eye, so we put up a board fence and thought we were all set...we ended up with a very deep, soft arena with horrible drainage and an injured horse. My wonderful gelding strained his suspensory ligament in that arena, has been on stall rest for 8 months, and has had about $2,000 worth of ultrasounds, shock wave treatments, etc. He is on the mend, and should be allowed to go back out after about 10 more weeks of rehab riding, but what a lesson for us! So after he got hurt I decided that this situation was intolerable, and hired a professional grader. He gave me an even larger arena (90' x 110', which is the biggest we can fit in the area we have) and he packed the North Carolina clay base down hard, and he fixed the drainage so that it will dry in a day after severe rains. In cold weather it takes 2-3 days, but nothing is perfect! We put a thin layer on sand on the top, which has mixed with the very top of the clay to form a nice loamy layer. Unfortunately to get it fixed right I had to tear down the fence we had and rebuild it, reusing as many materials as possible. When the arena starts getting a bit hard again I am considering using rock dust to improve the drying time even more. Most of my friends who have that say you can ride right after a rain storm without any problem. It was a very expensive lesson that had a bittersweet ending...I am about $5,000 in the hole after having to redo everything and treat my poor horse, but Reno is on the mend and we now have a nicer, larger arena than I had imagined. Maybe my experience will give you some ideas on how to fix the problem. If you have not yet used a professional grader I would strongly recommend it!!! Don't let them do it when the ground is wet, I was told that the pros will not work on ground that is not dry as it does not pack well. You might have to wait for the monsoons to stop! Best of luck to you.--Linda
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 15, 2008 - 5:49 am:

Linda Thanks for sharing your experience. I do know better than to put a fence up until it is finished...learned that lesson a long time ago. I knew the footing was going to be the "stickler" in this project. Your story will make me be very careful, leg injuries is not something I want to deal with.

Thanks
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, Jul 28, 2008 - 7:21 am:

Lake yucky muck is dry and the rain compacted the clay nicely. I harrowed it and the top loosened up and the footing was pretty good, though not quite what I have in mind.

Barring any rain this week, next weekend we are going to put lime in, I don't think I need a base other than the hard clay Do I????

I'm planning on starting with a depth of 1.5-2 in. But am second guessing my self as to whether this is too deep????
Member:
mrose

Posted on Monday, Jul 28, 2008 - 10:37 am:

Diane, my entire yard is "Lake Yucky-Muck" right now!

The articles I've read and people I've talked to say you need a base with the clay because the clay will work up into your footing and cause it to be slippery if it gets wet. One source called clay "a horsesman's nightmare." We have adobe clay. I don't know if it depends on the type of clay or if all clays are the same.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, Jul 28, 2008 - 3:41 pm:

Sara, this is my "plan" put down around 2in of lime and see how it works, if I feel I need a better base , I will compact that lime for a base and go from there. Money is tight right now and I figure that's the way to find out if it would work.

Though I'm wondering if 2 in. would be too much for "the joints"? Gotta agree with clay being a nightmare, but it really did dry VERY fast, except one spot under the tree...it is a low spot I need to fix and it doesn't get much sun because of the tree. The "arena" has dried hard as cement.

I just don't know
Member:
mrose

Posted on Monday, Jul 28, 2008 - 4:57 pm:

Ha, Diane. Money is always tight if you have horses! I have one now that is trying hard to strip me of the few dollars I have left after ordering the Cover-All. And, what I don't spend on him, I'll be spending on our old dog who is starting to have health problems.

I don't now what to tell you about the footing and base. I'm trying to figure out the same thing myself. It's very confusing to me. I'd love to have someone from one of the arena building companies come in, sample our dirt, and say "this is what you need" then do it. But, I can well guess how much THAT would cost, and you'd have to pay for footing on top of that! Keep me posted on what you decide and how it works out and I'll do the same.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, Jul 28, 2008 - 5:46 pm:

LOL you are a big help
Member:
mrose

Posted on Monday, Jul 28, 2008 - 9:10 pm:

Sorry!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Aug 2, 2008 - 7:04 pm:

YEAH!!!! I had the lime put in today and let me tell you it is PERFECT!!!!!!!

We put down about 4.5 in. on top of the VERY hard clay, even the dump truck with tons of lime didn't dent it. The guy was actually able to spread it pretty evenly with the truck. When he was done we harrowed it even and the footing depth after compacting is a perfect half inch, soft for feet and not to deep for legs

Tomorrow hopefully I can try it out, is suppose to rain though.

Here's a pic from my deck I was to exhausted to walk down there AGAIN.

Member:
dres

Posted on Saturday, Aug 2, 2008 - 7:25 pm:

Looks lovely.. I want to come roll in it.!

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots.
Member:
mrose

Posted on Saturday, Aug 2, 2008 - 7:54 pm:

It looks beautiful. I'm anxious to see how it is after you get one of your infamous rain storms. Hopefully it will dry out good and look as nice. Let us know how it feels! I'm still "pondering."
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Aug 2, 2008 - 8:36 pm:

Yea I'm wondering about the rain storms too. I hope it works out, I think this is my last chance. Our rain is so weird this year we never have a "nice" rain. The other day I was driving and this storm popped up out of nowhere. It was raining and blowing so hard I couldn't see an inch in front of me.

All the cars on the hiway just stopped, hard to believe there wasn't an accident! If it holds up to that I'll be happy! But 'm not sure any type of footing would?

My son is visiting from Colorado Springs, so if he is around tomorrow I'll have him take a pic of me and the bloated blimp in there...if it don't rain!
Member:
lindas

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 1:07 am:

Hey, Diane, after the rains let us know how the arena held up and how long it takes before you can ride again. I'm interested because it won't be long before our sand needs to be replaced, and I am considering switching to lime...I guess that is what they call "rock dust" around here.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 7:13 am:

Will do Linda, should be able to let you know today, a big red radar blip is headed right for us.
Member:
hpyhaulr

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 9:46 am:

Diane,
I just read your post about the storm and it has been EXACTLY the same way here in SC for a couple of months now. Since we are still designated a severe DrOught area,I know I am supposed to be thrilled that we are even getting rain, BUT I should think there is a way to get it from he sky to the ground without going sideways into the barn! It is the violence of the delivery with which I take issue. We have a sheDrOw and between the wind and the DRIVING rain I am going through straw and bedding at an alarming rate. EVERY day I have to unplug the laptop before leaving for work or going to sleep and the grass grows so fast at night, it keeps us awake! I am pumping out the roundpen as I type this. I use a sump pump and several long hoses. Daytime humidity is so high that if I don't pump, it could several days to dry the (sand footing)round pen out, and before that happens there will be more stuff flinging out of the sky at us. I don't mind the new grass in the pasture, but the whitecaps in the round pen I could do without!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 9:46 am:

Pics 10 mins. after a HEAVY rain storm, I am very pleased, as you can see from my foot prints it is great. The clay would have been lake yucky muck again! I am going to ride in it this afternoon.
Son decided to go to Indiana, but I will see if I can get hubby to take a pic....or will take pic of Hank myself so you can see the footing with a horse on it.


Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 10:07 am:

Cyndy, I am starting to think that kind of rain is normal now. We have the heat and humidity thrown in with it now too. When it rains it comes down hard and sideways, we have alot of run off because of the torrential downpours. I hope this lime can hold up to it. BUT still way better than winter.

I have whitecaps in the horses pasture!!!
Member:
dres

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 10:32 am:

that looks great after the rain you discribe!~ the test will be the winter..

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 11:24 am:

I don't think winter will be a big deal with it. I don't ride in the winter. I think it will settle more over the winter, then I will have to add some next spring and then be done. I would never had dreamed an arena (especially footing) would be such a task!! I'm not putting the permanent fencing up until next yr I think. Although I do plan on putting a 16 ft. gate in for machinery and a walk in gate for Hank and I so I guess it wouldn't matter. I Can't wait to try it out this afternoon!!!
Member:
mrose

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 11:57 am:

That looks really good, Diane. Is what you call limestone called something else in other areas, do you know? We don't have anything called "limestone" available here.
Member:
hpyhaulr

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 12:31 pm:

Diane,
That arena looks fantastic...I am going to look into the limestone! Whitecaps in the pasture are a lot easier to take when you have that beautifully done arena to run away to! I hope you have a great ride today. You sure have had a lot of ups & downs (oh what a great pun!) in the past few months...
It is already 96 here and the humidity is 74%... there will be no riding here today!glug,glug,glug.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 12:42 pm:

Pics of Hank and I...Does the footing look about right??? It felt good and Hank loved it as you will see in my last pic....That one is for Angie just to show she doesn't own the only "sweet horse" We were on the upside of a pretty good buck on that one. What an A$$ and that is why I love him




And here is the buck he couldn't resist and that wasn't the last one!! I just put the sidepull on him thinking he would be a good boy...so much for positive thinking...In his defense we have probably rode maybe 10 times this year, and in the end he was doing very well

Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 1:37 pm:

Sara, limestone seems to have different names around the country, stone dust being one of them I think. Ours is what they "lime" the pastures and fields with around here. I do like it better than sand for a couple reasons. One is it doesn't "displace" as easily as sand it is heavier. It also seems more water resistant. It is the same thing I use in my paddock, except in the paddock I packed it down hard...I have NEVER had mud in there. I believe the arena will also pack down and settle by itself, but running a harrow over it will keep the top perfectly soft..yet firm.

It can be dusty when dry, but I think most footing is except maybe rubber$$.
Member:
mrose

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 2:20 pm:

Diane, that looks nice! I wish I could get down and pick some of it up to see it up close and see what it feels like. I'm going to have to talk with our local gravel people and see if they have something similar.

Aw, heck, Diane, that wasn't a REAL buck! Hank is just expressing how happy he is with his new arena! His ear are all up and perky; he's just having fun! I bet he'd really like to roll in it.
Member:
hpyhaulr

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 2:52 pm:

Looks to me like you are both having fun!!
Member:
dres

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 3:04 pm:

The footing looks great.. Sand stone? hum.. don't think we have that here either.. That is a Hank buck. ?? He and you both look happy..

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 3:16 pm:

Believe me it WAS a real buck, tho the following ones were even better! That's the fun thing about Hank he gives no warning...you ride ready.

The guy that helped me train him, always said he was a "hard book to read" and he is..

BUT when we were done fat boy was tired, I had to hold his head up LOL
Notice the footing, perfect depth...I LOVE IT
Member:
paardex

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 3:40 pm:

So they start bucking Diane when they get slim? Perhaps I will keep Grasse fat then!
The footing looks perfect you really did a good job!
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 5:58 pm:

Thanks Jos, No he bucks no matter his body type.. Once he gets of out of his system we're good to go usually. When riding consistently his buck disappears! He was really lazy today, but he is VERY out of shape too...so didn't push it.
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 6:26 pm:

Diane,

I love it!! I wasn't going to go into HA to see the pictures but being there were so many new posts in my HA box, I decided to see what all the fuss was about. NICE, Reeellly NICE!!

I just may have to check into new footing for my little ol' arena after all. Gem fall on the wet grass cantering on the lunge before riding her a couple of days ago, and this whole footing thing came to mind. Probably won't happen, but now that you've paved the way, maybe I can at least put it on the list of things I'd like done, lol!!

You both look HAPPY!!!
Member:
lindas

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 10:42 pm:

Very nice arena! Congratulations, looks like it will work. I'm definitely going to look into rock dust now. I have a friend who says he compacted about 6 inches and allowed it to settle. Then he harrows the top inch or so to keep it soft. That might be overkill on the depth, but he says it drains great, and he has never had to put off riding because of the condition of the arena, no matter how much rain. I would like to see what it does in the winter. I have to avoid one end of my arena that stays frozen and never dries in the winter because it is in the shade. The sunny part (about 2/3 of the arena) can be used about 50 percent of the time in the winter. Obviously we don't have the winters you do, but we do get our share of freezing cold and ice storms. Ugh!
Hank is such a pretty boy! He's a chub but now that you have a nice arena I'm sure he will be back in shape in no time. I'll take the bucks over spooks any time. I don't like it when they jump out from under me. I don't have the balance I used to have, and it hurts so much more to hit the ground than it did when I was 18!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 11:08 pm:

Angie it was so nice not to have to worry about slipping and loosing his hind end. I didn't even ride right I am so use to slipping on the grass I was always tense. Hank was apprehensive at first too, he has fallen on his butt so many times down there when it was grass. I don't see slipping ever being a problem again as long as I keep the Pooping cows out!.

Linda thanks I think you will like the rock dust if it is the same thing as limestone, I don't think 6 in would be overkill. Hank IS NOT A CHUB He is pleasantly plump!

Soon to be arena skinny! Got to find all of my arena "toys" again.
Member:
leilani

Posted on Sunday, Aug 3, 2008 - 11:50 pm:

Diane,

The footing looks really good. When I'm not at my friend's arena I ride on grass also and have slipped one too many times.

As the lady I purchase my feed tells me each and every time I leave, "make sure your horse digests her food and hang on". Cracks me up. She is an almost 80 yo Japanese woman who knows everyone and has been in the feed business for 35 years. I just love Pearl.

Great looking pictures. Leilani
Member:
annes

Posted on Monday, Aug 4, 2008 - 10:53 am:

Diane, the arena looks great and Hank certainly looks like he is enjoying it. (I think it was a happy buck too). It may be the same 1/4" limestone dust that I use around my barn but mine is a pale grey color. Yours looks tan in the picture..is that the color yours is? I paid $295 for a dumptruck full the last time I purchased it.

P.S. It looks like you have a pretty wildflower garden around the arena. I see all the white Queen Ann's Lace growing....
Member:
leslie1

Posted on Monday, Aug 4, 2008 - 1:23 pm:

WOW great arena! looks beautiful and so do you and hank!
what great job on arena and getting hanks feet back.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Monday, Aug 4, 2008 - 9:27 pm:

UGGH Mother nature. We had our wind blows trees down 3 in. of rain in 2 seconds again today...when will it stop! It rained hard most of the day topped off with the gully washer late this afternoon.

Anyway found a low spot...I have a good size puddle, which will easily be fixed when it dries up.... other than that I have NO doubt I can harrow it tomorrow and ride in it....I think it is even going to hold up to the gully washers! Once the low spots are fixed. Batteries are dead in camera, but I didn't sink in when walking on it at all.

Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 5, 2008 - 8:00 am:

For those that are interested in this footing, the puddles on the pic are GONE this morning. IF ihave time this afternoon I am going to ride Hank and will let you know how it feels...Our storm report said we had 1 in of rain in 15 mins. + the rain we had through the day...hopefully it is useable.

From my experience with sand at the barn ...it would still have puddles.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 5, 2008 - 8:01 am:

For those that are interested in this footing, the puddles on the pic are GONE this morning. IF I have time this afternoon I am going to ride Hank and will let you know how it feels...Our storm report said we had 1 in of rain in 15 mins. + the rain we had through the day...hopefully it is useable.

From my experience with sand at the barn ...it would still have puddles.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 5, 2008 - 4:47 pm:

Less than 24hrs. after gully washer...I was able to ride with no problems.
Member:
lilo

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 5, 2008 - 6:07 pm:

Diane - it looks like you really have the footing thing down. I am happy for you. The next test will be when it has been dry for a while (if that ever happens) to see if it will be dusty.
Thanks for the photos of you and Hank enjoying the arena!
Lilo
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 5, 2008 - 7:53 pm:

Hank was a very good boy today when I rode...got my toys down there...he gets bored easily, He really enjoyed trotting over the trot poles for some reason. In the end we were jumping them...when he's in better shape I will start jumping him again...he LOVES jumping for some reason.

I am going to really enjoy this arena Thanks everyone for your help!!!
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Wednesday, Aug 6, 2008 - 8:55 pm:

Diane,

Could you do me a big favor? Do a recap of what you did?

Was showing hubby the pictures and explaining to him what you started with and what you had, and being he showed slight interest, I am thinking if I can say; "well, she did this, bought the lime, did that" etc, maybe we can improve our arena too.

So, worked the sod up, had clay, put lime on it? How deep? How much? And then sand, correct?

Thanks sooo much!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Aug 6, 2008 - 9:49 pm:

Sure Angie, We didn't have a level spot so first bulldozed to make it bigger. If you have a level spot at least you can skip that step. So you can go right to the footing I would think. If you have clay that is packed down, which was the next step for me, I would suggest just killing the grass with round up...I had to do that before we put the lime down because the weeds and grass were growing back and didn't want it coming through.

Once the spot was level and dry and packed...we put in the lime (stone dust) and that's it. I had to put in 12 dump truck loads...which I think holds about 8 tons and I need one more I think for the low spot. The arena is 100 wide by 140 long approx. The dump truck guy pulled in flipped his switch and DrOve around as he dumped, he actually got it pretty level. we used our loader tractor to back drag it and level it out. (except that one spot we got it pretty good. Than ran the one section harrow over it with cement blocks for weight to really even it out. (hay bales work too. After the dump truck guy dumped it I would estimate the depth at 4.5-5 in. after we compacted then harrowed it It is about 3.5 in.... NO sand in there. All the other stuff we did to the clay was not necessary it was to try to use the clay as the footing...per cheapo husband....didn't work.

It is raining cats and dogs as I type this and I will be able to ride in it tomorrow, even with the low spot. NO slipping is WONDERFUL. I have nothing bad to say about it thus far. I do know if it ever dries out it will be dusty, but that don't worry me much since it's outside and there is usually a breeze.

I know this will vary but my costs are

Bulldozing.....$200 (friend did it)
I haven't got the lime bill, but I THINK it will be about $50 a load for the lime and trucking, we only live about 2 miles from the quarry, so they didn't have to drive far....$600

Total cost EXCLUDING fence will be under $1000 and well worth it
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Thursday, Aug 7, 2008 - 8:29 am:

Thanks so much Diane! That doesn't sound like much at all to do if I can convince hubby to have the arena done that way. My spot is very level already, smaller, and I think all I'd have to do is kill off the grass and spread the limestone. I don't have as much clay as you by any means, so that part helps.

I'd probably have to level by hand, our neighbor with the bulldozer lost all his equipment when business went sour on him, dang but we miss having someone 2 miles away to come by at a moments notice to do work like that!

Doubt I'll get it this fall yet, but I'll keep talking about it til spring and cross my fingers. I find myself telling our daughter not to go faster than a trot in the arena because now I am paranoid the horse will slip and fall! Of course, I've never seen it happen when the gras was dry, only when it was wet from dew or rain, but still I worry!

Hmmm...if I know hubby, he'll think we need RR ties all around the perimeter to keep the lime in, and it'll turn into major grunt work. He did suggest that once when we discussed having sand put in there. You'll have to keep us updated through the seasons if you loose your LIME, lol!!!

Thanks again!
Member:
canter

Posted on Thursday, Aug 7, 2008 - 1:05 pm:

Diane, the arena looks great and you must be SO pleased!

Angie, FYI, 1 of the outdoor arenas at the barn is grass (actual lawn as they seeded it to use for the oldest daughter's wedding 2 weeks ago). We didn't use it until after the wedding, and as long as it's dry, I w/t/c on it (and Sparkles wears shoes) with no problems. The 'rougher' the grass, the less likely the horse to slip. Or at least that's what I've been told.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Thursday, Aug 7, 2008 - 2:07 pm:

Angie that's the next step. Holding the lime in. Some people put boards on the bottom and I was considering this. But rail road ties or boards would be expensive and prone to rot + I wouldn't want to bonk my head on one if sweet boy bucked me off (I wear a helmet).

I was telling my mom about it and she said why don't you just put in the 6 in landscape (plastic border. I'm thinking that's a good idea, would be easy and cheap. Will let you know how it works out when I get that far!
Member:
lindas

Posted on Thursday, Aug 7, 2008 - 10:50 pm:

We have this problem but only on the lower side of our arena. It depends on how it was graded...if it was crowned you will have drainage and the potential for erosion all around. If it was slightly sloped you will have drainage on the dependent (lower) side. If it is perfectly flat the lime probably won't erode away, but the horses will kick it to the outside and you will get a little mound all the way around the outside. Putting something solid up to block the erosion will also block water drainage and could contribute to a perpetually wet arena. You could try straw bales, which is what my dad suggested to allow for drainage but slow the water down so the lime does not go away. You dig a little ditch about an inch deep to put the straw bales in, and the water flows through the straw, slowing the speed of the water down and catching the lime. It could get expensive for a big arena, as the straw can be expensive and has a tendency to rot, of course.. We want to try it on one corner that our grader lowered so the arena will drain, as our arena is on the bottom of a mountain and gets all the water from up the hill. That is the only place where we lose sand, and is where I will eventually put the bales when and if I get the time. Now all you would have to do is convince Hank that the straw bales are not a snack! Either way you are going to eventually have to replace the lime, as arena footing tends to get mixed up with the base and just disappears over time. If you had a fence for the arena you might consider erosion fencing just outside the fence. (That is the orange plastic netlike stuff that is used in many areas to keep construction soil runoff from going into streams. ) Without an arena fence that could be dangerous, because they might run into it and get tangled up with you on them!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, Aug 8, 2008 - 5:58 am:

Thanks Linda, great minds must think alike. My husband said to put hay bales around. I have one spot on the lower side where the lime is washing when we have a "gully washer" rain. Which seems to be every other day. Straw would make more sense and be less "distracting" for the "chub".

My arena is at the bottom of a hill also and considering everything the lime is holding up very well, but like all footing I'm sure I will have to have additional footing added occasionally.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, Nov 21, 2008 - 10:24 pm:

I have been mulling this fence thing around in my mind. I want to save up this winter so I can get the fence up around the arena next spring.

I need something strong to keep the cows OUT, and something relatively safe for horse and rider.

Tonight as I was browsing fencing, I realized don't think I can afford anything beautiful AND strong. I was considering electric fence tape, but after the heifers went through the hot wires around it last summer and left craters in there(which ultimatley led to my broken ribs) I decided against that.

Then I finally had an AH-Ha moment. Horse round pen panels!. IF I figured it right they are cheaper than any cow safe fencing I can find, with a big plus of we can use them for other things if needed!!!!! They are movable for mowing, discing, adding more footing, and the list goes on.

I think it would look good too. Any down falls to having this as an arena perimeter??? Would Hank be more likely to kill me with this than other fencing? HMMMMM
Member:
mrose

Posted on Friday, Nov 21, 2008 - 11:30 pm:

Only thing I can think of is you'd probably have to brace them in the corners and maybe every 12 - 16 feet along the sides. We used pipe panels for our old arena with heavy treated wood posts for support and it worked great. I think the round pen panels would be about the same thing.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Friday, Nov 21, 2008 - 11:44 pm:

You're so smart I would have never of thought of that, but of course if they are running in a straight line they wouldn't be as stable as going in a circle!

How did you attach them to the posts?
Member:
mrose

Posted on Saturday, Nov 22, 2008 - 1:09 am:

Well, in this case, I think Lonnie was the smart one as he put the arena up. We used old pipe panels form pens that we had brought with us from Truckee. (Don't even ask about that move!) Lonnie made some clamps that the pipe went through. He made them by bending metal strips and drilling holes in each end of them. He drilled holes in the posts and as I held up the panels Lonnie attached them to the post by putting a strip over each rail and running bolts through the holes. You could probably drill holes in the pipe and run bolts through them without the metal strips also.
Member:
rtrotter

Posted on Saturday, Nov 22, 2008 - 11:10 am:

Diane,

In your search for fencing, did you look at some of the options at Ramm Fence. I fenced 3/4 of an acre with two paddocks for less than $1000 for the materials, in my case two rows of 4 inch plastic for the top and middle rows and 1 row of very thick round wire. You can use any combination including electric wire or rope. You can call Ramm Fence or google their website, they are most helpful and will try to stay within whatever budget you have to deal with. Any of the fence combos are strong and look good, require very little maintenance and if broken are easily fixed with fence spoolers.

As far as the panels go, while you are right about them being useful for many things. They are rather expensive, do not add much to your property value and may not be as trustworthy as you think.

Rachelle
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Nov 22, 2008 - 12:20 pm:

Thanks Rachelle...yes I have looked into the Ramm fencing and just about every other type.

My problem is the COWS/Calves. They are in that pasture a few mos. out of the year. If it wasn't for them I probably wouldn't even need a fence! I don't really want an electric fence around my arena, an accidental zap would send me flying I'm sure! And the horse would be leery of the "rail". Granted I could turn the fence off when riding, but then I have to remember to turn it back on. Simplicity is something I strive for.

Property value is high enough according to our taxes! When searching different fencing, especially the vinyl types they seem VERY expensive to me. I can get good 12 ft gates for around $60 which comes to $5 a linear ft.( I think)
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Saturday, Nov 22, 2008 - 4:56 pm:

Diane,

I've never owned cattle but the neighbors do. And up to a few years ago, they were right across the road. The fence was old barbed wire, and they were forever going through that. Now, that the cattle are no longer over there, I see every pasture they have is really really thick electric wire.

So, my thoughts are this: What about a double fence? Have one strand (horseguard?) one board, one rail, etc., in the inside, and a very HOT wire around that on the outside.

If you used wood posts, like 4" square ones, you could even use the same posts for both the inside and outside. I bet there are extensions to hold the wire away from the posts on the outer side for all kinds of setups. Or you could use whatever you choose for the inside on one set of posts, and use the HOT HOT wire on t-posts or whatever you need. Have to see what works best with your budget and setup.

Yes, you'd have to open one hot wire gate, but I use 2 strands of Horse Guard for my arena, and it's not hot(I can make the round pen hot, and do if it's a sick bay, or a horse needs a reminder to stay off the fence)and I open the one strand gate from horse back all the time so I don't have to dismount...but I can see that being a slight problem if it was hot and you were on Hank! I just open it and throw to ride through.

I think cattle are notorious for leaning and rubbing aren't they? So they'd make your gate panels go every which way eventually?

I so want a real gate for my arena, I think each panel is more than $60 up here though.

I've also seen fences with orange plastic mesh on the bottem, and hot wire on top and a strand held way from it. Lots of options!
Member:
scooter

Posted on Saturday, Nov 22, 2008 - 6:07 pm:

Angie hubby and I discussed the double fence idea and actually that was what I had planned on doing....UNTIL! Those new calves could care less about hotwire when they are running about playing, after QUITE a few good zaps they start respecting it, but until then they knock down every elec fence we have. They even went through the horses high tensile hot wire 5 tight strands! Then the cows go nuts because the calves are trapped UGHHH, you get the picture.

I think Saras idea of securing the panels to a wood post or even steel posts would work... is a good idea. I was telling hubby about it and they had something like that called continuous fencing...which of course I had to google. I liked it and it is the same concept as panels attached to posts accept it comes in 20ft. sections too.

Something like this
https://www.gateway-ranch-ponies.com/gatewayr_files/hiqualcfences.htm
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 7:25 am:

Well I have the fencing figured out, but now I have another nagging problem and would love your opinions! I am going to finish this thing this year if it kills me.

On one side of my arena there is a steep hill, I got it planted and the grass growing well last year. We kept an elec fence around the hill and arena while the grass was growing. We keep heifers in this pasture during the summer to keep the grass down around the house.(keeps the snakes down).

Here is the problem, if I just fence off the arena part it will be impossible to mow that hill (very steep) from the top. Hubby could mow it from the bottom by backing up it with the tractor and bush hog. He doesn't want the heifers on the hill for fear they will rip it up and cause erosion. His suggestion is to include the hill in my arena fence (it would be part of the arena) and we could let the horses in to graze it occasionally OR it would be easy to mow from the bottom. I have seen arenas done in this fashion around the area and it looks just fine. BUT I would like to be able to do some free lunging and liberty work with Hank in there. You bet my hog horse would be running up that hill trying to eat grass! I really don't want to deal with the distraction. Any Ideas how to deal with this problem?? Here's a pic of the hill I am talking about (before I seeded it)..to the right of the pic




Member:
hollyw

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 8:06 am:

Pretty spot, Diane.
Well, you could include it in your arena and if you are talking about "free" longeing, you and Hank will both get more exercise as he runs for the grass and you keep him off if it . . .
Maybe ditch at the bottom of the slope and plant it in cedars? Cover with plastic and mulch? Dump gravel there? You could try running non-electrified tape, complete with a gate section, at the bottom of the slope just for the purpose of using the arena, and then you can open the gate to let the horses graze, but not sure if it's worth the trouble just to allow grazing on that bit of slope.
Have fun. It's nice to have the arena option.
Member:
dres

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 10:17 am:

very pretty spot, I agree to much work to allow for a occasional graze time.. I like the idea of a flower pot / cedar barrier .. or will Hank JUMP for food! I say carve out benches and make a viewing section for us to sit and watch.. it will be a comfy grass seating...

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
mrose

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 11:15 am:

I like Ann's idea! I'd love to come and watch you work with Hank.

If you don't want to go that route, however, how about a portable electric fence you take down when the cows are in there?
Member:
rtrotter

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 1:07 pm:

Hi Diane,

How about some good old fashioned boat rope, which can stay in position, when you don't need to mow it. And can be easily taken down when you do need to mow. It's sturdy, relatively inexpensive and you can put a snap and a screw eye on one end so it can be unhooked and hooked as needed. I am not sure if they have a variety of colors but an alternative is to buy whatever color you like of electrical tape and wrap the rope once it is up.

I cleared almost an acre of land in my back yard and kept my horses fenced in just with the boat rope for years until I decided I wanted something more rustic and prettier that would add value to my property. So, I went with Ramm fence ( two rows of 4" plastic fencing and the bottom row of thickly coated plastic wire). But the boat rope worked great for years. I used the braided plastic 50' and 100' lengths you can get in the hardware store. Or you can get real boat rope from a marine supply store.

Sara's idea of the portable electric fence is a good one, also. I paid about $800 for mine, though.
Rachelle
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 3:36 pm:

Thanks, for the most part it isn't keeping the horses in/out...the heifers need something to discourage them and boat rope won't do it The crazy calves are in that pasture sometimes to. I do not want any cows in the arena area, those things are so destructive and their poop is like ice!!!

So if you can picture this, I would like to have a sturdy fence around the arena, if you look at the pic above, the arena butts right up to that hill (which is steeper than it looks) I can put up a temporary elec fence around the hill...there's one there right now and around the arena. Last year that worked out fine as the grass was growing, but towards fall it had gotten very tall and ugly looking, not to mention drawing bugs/snakes/rodents. Unfortunately since I have such easy keepers they don't get to graze much in the spring/summer so they won't be in that pasture. Mowing probably is the best option, but it is so steep I couldn't do it with the rider AND there will be a fence (for the arena at the very bottom of it) so no holding your breath and zipping down the bank/hill!

I would love to put in seating for you to all come laugh at us...especially if Pukey has a calf this year Jos needs to come see that!! I would even like to have Denny come give a clinic, but in this area there just isn't much interest in such things...I am pretty centrally located for a HA clinic tho!! Hank and Tango could probably amuse us all for a few days A horned clinic!!!

Anyway I have to get the fence figured out before I do anything

Thanks
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 3:57 pm:

Here's a little better pic of the bank, the grass was starting to grow in then.(my horse is not fat)

Member:
paardex

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 5:59 pm:

I don't know how 'horned Hank' thinks about electric fencing but with the small poles for temporary fencing and one line I used to divide the arena in suitable parts for lungeing roundpen work or[a little bit bigger] free jumping. It worked very well BUT my horses despite all their horns were very respectfull of electricity[even when it wasn't on]
Jos
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 7:05 pm:

Jos he respects hot wire very much, I had it around the arena last year. He respects it so much I couldn't get him on the "rail" he didn't want to go anywhere near it! The heifers on the other hand went right through it a ripped my arena to He$$ (not Pukey of course)...she's a good girl!
Member:
ekaufman

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 7:27 pm:

Hi Diane,

Ok so you need something mobile, large enough to block a horse, and intimidating to cattle....

Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 7:33 pm:

HMMMM might work , kind looks like a carrot tho,so Hank may try to eat it, don't know if he likes hot dogs...but knowing him he probably would.
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 7:54 pm:

Oh ya, I can just see Tango being amused by that giant weinermobile...I guess if it's an all beef one, the cattle might be worried, lol!
Member:
rtrotter

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 8:45 pm:

Hi Diane,

I went back and looked at your earlier post about the type of fence you wanted to put in. It looks like a good choice. If I understand your predicament, you want the cows and calves to stay off the hill and they will do this if it stays mowed.

If you put twenty foot sections on that side of the arena, would you be able to take the sections down to be able to mow. Would your mower get through the 20' foot opening? If yes, do they make twenty foot gates.

I am trying to think of ways to keep the aesthetics of the fencing, enable the mower to back up the hill and keep the cows out of the arena.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 9:16 pm:

Well you don't quite have it right, we have to keep the cows/calves off the bank period. With as steep of slope that is there they will cause erosion, especially if it's wet. SOO I can put up a electric fence for that purpose YET it won't be part of my arena, or arena fencing.

It will then grow up into a weedy mess. I really do want to get the gates, but I haven't been able to save enough money up, so I think I am going with some kind of non-electric tape for the arena, with a hot wire running on the outside to keep cows out. Hubby really just wants to incorporate that bank into the arena, but I really don't want to! I have been thinking we should get one of those pull behind rotary mowers for the 4-wheeler and just put a gate in that side that the 4-wheeler could fit through...it would also be nice to mow the pastures/brush with...may be able to talk hubby into that! Don't know if that would look stupid having a gate there or nothmmmm
Member:
mrose

Posted on Wednesday, Feb 4, 2009 - 9:33 pm:

How about putting your fence at the top of the bank and then either making different plateaus (for seating for all us HAers) or planting some runner type plant there, like an ivy, that the horses wouldn't be inclined to want to chew on. It's a really pretty setting for your arena imo.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Thursday, Feb 5, 2009 - 6:52 am:

Actually the guy that did the dozing was suppose to put tiers in that bank to help with erosion. For some reason he didn't or couldn't...can't remember. I suppose I could weed eat the bank if worse came to worse, but I like to try to keep things simple and the less work for me the happier I am! Doesn't really seem to be an easy way around this I guess

I got many compliments from people about the arena last summer, even non-horsey people think it's nice with a pretty setting. I was on one of my routes in town and ran into some guy walking his dog on the otherside of the street (complete stranger) he yelled across the street...I see you got your horses playground done..."WHAT" I had to think about that and said, OH you mean the arena. He said yes, I ride my bike out that way and have been watching it progress, that thing is just great, hope you enjoy it!! Even the "suburbanite neighbors" have been enthusiastic AFTER they figured out it wasn't a swimming pool or a basketball court! I had them all guessing!
Member:
canter

Posted on Thursday, Feb 5, 2009 - 7:09 am:

Diane, my thought is some sort of natural type barrier, not appealing to cows. Plant a field of wild raspberries or some other type of prickly vegetation that will add to the beauty of the area ( I have a lot of wild raspberries bordering my yard and the little white flowers in early summer are really pretty), prevent erosion and keep the cows off. Don't they use natural type hedges in Europe as fencing?

The drawback is it would take a few years for it to grow up enough to truly work, so you'd have to keep the critters out until then.

Think of the yummy pies and muffins you could make with all those berries.
Member:
leslie1

Posted on Thursday, Feb 5, 2009 - 3:07 pm:

I really like Fran's idea(s).

Diane your arena looks so nice...It makes me want to run barefooot thru it. very comfy.

L
Member:
nikky19

Posted on Monday, Feb 16, 2009 - 10:27 pm:

I have a question for Diane E. Is the stone dust that you added to your arena the same as AgLime? It looks as though it did a really good job of stabilizing your footing and I'm redoing my arena (19years old) for the second time this year and I'd like to stabilize the new sand. If its not, is there anyway (as you're so good with the camera) to take a picture of what the stuff looks like for me - just a handful in your hand?
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Feb 17, 2009 - 6:00 am:

J., Ag lime is what I used. I don't know exactly what you mean by stabilize, but out in the weather the lime does become hard we have to disc it occasionally (twice last year) if we have lots of rain. I've been happy with it so far. Mixed with sand, I think it would be VERY good footing. The arena is under snow and ice right now so no pics
Member:
dres

Posted on Tuesday, Feb 17, 2009 - 11:22 am:

Diane, I have a question re this Aglime.. My rehab mare has to live outdoors.. she is constantly moving / buck snorts at feeding thus put in a stall is NOT an option.. Her paddock is oh, 24X48 or more * I am awful in measurements* it has become a soup bowl with all the rain we are getting finally... The other paddock her buddy that stays out with her is great// firm/ solid... but he does not move around like she does..
I am wondering if this Aglime would work.. you say it becomes hard when wet.. and you have to disc it up .. would you think her constant movement would do the disking ? Or would it become solid/hard thus better for her in the flooding rains.. ???

thanks..

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Feb 17, 2009 - 3:10 pm:

Oh Ann I would highly recommend it for that purpose...That is what is in my paddock and I NEVER NEVER have mud...the trick is to put it down right.

We had a firm layer of clay to put it on (and it is sloped a little) put a couple of inches of lime (stonedust) water it thouroly compact it...I DrOve our lawn tractor back and forth on it....add a nuther couple inches and repeat. I bet there is a good foot of compacted lime in my paddock. If you put it in loose it will just mix with the yuck....but done right it hardens up just like cement (but more forgiving) When at it's wettest in the spring, I can see hoof prints about an 1/8th of an inch deep...I HIGHLY recommend it for mud free paddocks! And yes when put down correctly the more rain...the harder it gets
Member:
dres

Posted on Tuesday, Feb 17, 2009 - 3:29 pm:

Thanks Diane, i think this is what we will do.. this summer we will pull out all this road base that has turned to mucky silt , think we will put in a drain, then do the process you mention above. Nothing else has worked, and this mare is hard on her paddock.. just way to active..
All my bragging about our wonderful spring like weather in Jan.. has come to a screaming HALT.. we have had a week of solid rain!

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots.
Member:
nikky19

Posted on Thursday, Feb 19, 2009 - 1:17 pm:

Thanks Diane: with sand the footing rolls a bit underfoot and i've read that adding stone dust to the mix will help prevent that, ie stabilize it. Your information is very helpful and it makes sense that Ag Lime is just ground limestone nothing more fancy than that and added to the muddy part of the paddocks is way interesting an idea - have to wait until the compacted soil summer months then I'm going to give it a "go". Thanks again
New Member:
kpaint

Posted on Tuesday, Mar 17, 2009 - 12:24 pm:

Hello Ladies, I'm a new member. I did an online search for "arena footing" and landed here. Read. Joined. Now begging for guidance. :-) I know just enough to be dangerous.

I want to build an outdoor arena and put down "appropriate" footing material that is affordable. Of course "appropriate" and "affordable" don't ever go together it seems.
I live on farm in NW Indiana which has lots of clay under the topsoil. I was wondering if I remove the topsoil, compact the clay (we have heavy excavation equipment), and then use a combination of sand and ag lime (also called stonedust or limestone around here)for the footing material--would that work? I haven't tested the sand to see how much silt/clay is in it. Silica sand (also called quartz or hard sand around here)looks very pricey because the quarries are so far from where I live. We have access to unwashed/unscreened "bank" sand; my guess is that there is quite a bit of silt and clay in it. Hmmm. I looked at the local 4-H fairground outdoor arena and it appears to be 4" of the "bank" sand dumped on top of the ground with no prep work on the subbase. It looks too deep, too wet, and frankly somewhat like a river sand bar... I don't want to spend $ to have an arena like that.
I priced recycled industrial rubber (no metal because it's not made from tires) and it was a whooping 15K delivered for 1 1/2" to cover proposed arena. It's supposed to be mixed with 2" of silica sand. Ha ha. This footing combo isn't happening.

It looked like Diane E had some success with her ag lime. I read back through the posts, but didn't see if she compacted the clay or the lime. The last post was in February. I wondered how the ag lime footing held up over the winter and now spring rains? Any harrowing done? Dragging? I read it was disced. How deep? Shouldn't I keep the base intact and not disc the limestone into it?
In our excavation work, we often use "limestone stabilization" during commercial construction. That is simply tons of limestone/dust dumped all over a muddy, wet, saturated building site and disced in which dries up the site, "stablilizes" the soil so that a building pad can be created--usually for large commercial buildings, plants, factories, etc. So, I understand how limestone/ag lime is used in that application, but I'm not understanding how it might be used as footing material. (I understand its application to dry up a muddy paddock.)
Help.
I have too much information that I'm having trouble stringing together to make sense!

The proposed arena is not for commercial use; just me. Tandem hitch driving, barrels, w. pleasure, etc. I don't show.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Mar 17, 2009 - 3:13 pm:

Hi Vicki welcome to HA, we come from close to the same climate I think. Here's my thoughts on it since putting the limestone down and it getting "weathered"

We removed the topsoil from the space, it did get compacted and weathered...as you can see from all my problems from trying to use that as footing. After the clay was baked in the sun after compacting we added the limestone. That clay didn't even give with the dump truck going over it loaded. Once the limestone was down it got compacted from all the rain and baking in the sun, Hard to harrow the top layer loose even.

From all my experiments this is what I'm going to do and think it will work perfectly. I am going to leave the limestone that is down and HARD for a base on top of the clay (I wouldn't use clay as a base at all!) The limestone dries VERY quickly I believe we have about 8 in.s down before compacting...and wouldn't be afraid to have a little more. I do have to lightly disc the limestone if using it for footing.

SO this year I am going to add a mixture of sand and limestone...over the limestone base for footing and I think we will be good to go with some light harrowing occasionally. The limestone base has held up wonderfully in the winter and also in the drenching rains.

As far as what kind of sand I think the other members commented on the best kind above, sand is ridiculously high here too, but I think with mixing it with the limestone it will cut the cost alot. Also with the hard limestone base you/I should only need an inch or two for footing. As stated above too deep of footing is not good. Hope that makes some kind of sense
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Mar 17, 2009 - 4:54 pm:

Vicki, I just went down and harrowed my arena, it's been under ice and snow up until last weekend, then we had torrential rains. I took some pics for you because I am a visual person personally and seeing things helps give me ideas. Anyway this is still a work in progress and unfortunately for the members I know I will have a thousand more questions once I get going on this project again... they are very imaginative, experienced, and helpful group

SO as much as I hate to I am going to start a continuation of this thread (Outdoor arena help 2).. (sorry Dr.O.) so I can post the pics for you...this one just takes a long time to load....
https://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/3/311440.html
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Mar 17, 2009 - 5:54 pm:

I just am not having a good day, I knew I should have sent that chain letter to someone else
Here's the workable link I think
https://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/3/311440.html
Member:
sdms

Posted on Wednesday, Mar 18, 2009 - 8:18 am:

Chain letter!

That's SO funny, Diane!
Member:
npo33901

Posted on Wednesday, Apr 21, 2010 - 5:26 am:

My outside arena is becoming overgrown with weeds and grass..
I don't have equipment to rake it.

Would salt help and not harm horses ?
Or burning it with flame thrower ?

I am not using the arena at the moment !!! But would like to keep it in shape - better shape than I am myself .
Member:
cometrdr

Posted on Wednesday, Apr 21, 2010 - 5:31 pm:

how about renting a tractor with a gannon and 'strafing' it to pull the weeds?
better than Salt - which could dry out feet.
Member:
scooter

Posted on Wednesday, Apr 21, 2010 - 6:36 pm:

Anna can't you spray it with weed killer? I spray round up around the edges every year and haven't had a problem yet with weeds.
Member:
npo33901

Posted on Thursday, Apr 22, 2010 - 1:35 am:

Muffi, what is "gannon" ? The agriculture rakes are to deep - I have drainage pipes every 4 m .

Diane, my horses try to steel/nib the grass when we are working . And dogs run there too ... Wouldn't it be harmful ?
Member:
mrose

Posted on Thursday, Apr 22, 2010 - 10:35 am:

Hi Anna-Marie. The effects of weed-killer don't last very long, you'd have to check the label to be sure. Another option is to go around with a blow-torch. We burn all the weeds along our hay fields this way.
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