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Discussion on Supplementing hay with cubes or bagged hay products
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Member:
teddi
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Posted on Friday, Jun 20, 2008 - 1:09 pm:
I apologize in advance for the length of this post. I’m thinking about buying bagged hay and/or cubes to supplement the hay I feed my horses and would like to know if there are any drawbacks to this combination of hay and cubes or bagged, chopped hay. There are several reasons that I am looking for an alternative to feeding straight hay; consistency of quality and ease of storage are two big ones, but the real reason is the lack of good quality hay in my area. I’m thinking of purchasing about 4-5 tons of hay for the year for my two horses (I normally buy 10 tons) and supplement the rest with either Triple Crown’s chopped grass and chopped alfalfa forages (https://www.triplecrownfeed.com/alfalfa.php and https://www.triplecrownfeed.com/grass.php) and/or Moorman’s Forage First alfalfa/timothy cubes (https://www.admani.com/AllianceEquine/ForageFirstTimothyAlfafaCubes.htm).
To provide some background to my situation – I live in Jackson, WY. When I first moved here it was difficult to find decent hay anywhere, but in recent years it’s become increasingly more difficult and more expensive to buy hay (last year I spent approximately $2,500 on 10 tons of hay). I’ve tried buying from several different growers (some several states away) , two brokers, and even the feed store with no real success. Most of the hay I’ve purchased is mediocre quality grass hay with some alfalfa mixed in. There are also some higher alfalfa content mixes available, but my younger horse is an extremely easy keeper and I can’t feed him a lot of alfalfa. I put in an entire year’s worth of hay in July because they only cut once here due to the short growing season. Moreover, if you don’t buy in the summer, there typically isn’t any more hay to buy. I have to put in my order a year in advance just to make sure I can actually get hay for the next year. Due to the DrOught in many states, our hay supplies can often be bought up by someone in another state. I could go on and on about the challenges of buying hay in Jackson, but I’m sure that I am not alone in the hay dilemma.
Any help would be most appreciated.
Thanks so much.
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Member:
vickiann
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Posted on Friday, Jun 20, 2008 - 5:56 pm:
Teddy, I have done this in the winter when I have no grass for my horses. It has worked out great for me. Though I have used Triple Crown alfalfa or timothy and found those products good, the last two winters, I have used their Safe Starch Grass Forage. This stuff is so digestible, and have had no colics at all the past two winters. It seems to normalize the manure of each horse. I have also used the T & A cubes when I've traveled or have needed to put weight on a horse. It is best to store the bags of forage out of the sun or heat, which will degrade the product. All of those Triple Crown products are of excellent quality -- worth the extra cost. I also have a friend who has limited grass and a touchy horse and he has done great with this approach.
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Member:
ekaufman
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Posted on Saturday, Jun 21, 2008 - 3:29 pm:
Hi Teddy,
I live in Northern Colorado and have had good luck with hay. I frequently supplement with cubes anyhow-- there's less waste, and it seems to entertain the horses.
My stallion is a hard keeper, and he always has a bucket of alfalfa cubes to chew on.
It's hard to tell how consistent the forage is that goes into the cubes, but I've had excellent luck so far. I have heard that there are ways to buy them in bulk if you have a container to dump them in, but haven't pursued that (and it may only be a local option).
Good luck!
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Saturday, Jun 21, 2008 - 9:56 pm:
I've used cubes in the past when hay has been hard to find and had no problems. Currently our two stallions are being fed cubes as they are showing and feeing cubes is a lot easier on the road than carrying hay bales. We are able to buy cubes in bulk and store them in large plastic garbage containers.
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Member:
jowidner
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Posted on Saturday, Jun 21, 2008 - 11:38 pm:
Teddy I have also used the Triple Crown forage when I have had to supplement my hay and it worked well. My horses had a little more difficulty with cubes. They didn't clean them up as well and were harder to chew. My local vet recommended that I soak the cubes to prevent choke and dental problems, and so I decided I would rather feed forage or pellets than deal with the extra step of soaking. I have also had very good luck with Blue Seal hay stretcher pellets. My horses love them, but I am not sure if those are available in your area. You might try googling Blue Seal Feeds to see.
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Member:
teddi
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Posted on Monday, Jun 23, 2008 - 12:12 pm:
Thank you everyone for your comments and feedback. I have a call in to the Triple Crown rep to find out if they have a dealer anywhere close by. The only feed store in town used to carry Triple Crown, but they went out of business a few months ago so I am now on the hunt for an alternate source. Thanks again for your help with this.
And my advice would be never to own horses in Jackson, WY...
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Monday, Jun 23, 2008 - 1:08 pm:
Oh, but such beautiful country up there, Teddy!! It's kind of ironic not being able to find hay; that "hole" used to be one huge meadow filled with hay. So much for progress! Back in the 70's I trailered up and camped with horses (and friends) in that area and had a wonderful time. There was tons of grass for the horses to graze.
I hope youre able to find something without having to travel half way across the state or to Idaho. When we moved to UT from CA we had a terrible time finding hay. Luckily we'd brought a few tons with us. We had 24 horses at the time and I was frantic trying to find something to feed them. Since we were surrounded by alfalfa fields, I'd assumed you just called a farmer and asked to buy some hay. Little did I know that brokers come through every year and buy up the hay in the fields before it is cut!
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Member:
teddi
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Posted on Monday, Jun 23, 2008 - 2:15 pm:
Hi Sara,
You are so right about it being beautiful up here. I moved to Jackson from So. CA almost 5 years ago and truly do love it, but it can be a hard place to live for a number of reasons. I was surprised that keeping horses here has been such a challenge too. And who knew that finding decent quality hay would be so difficult?! I think I'm paying more here to keep my horses at home than I did in Malibu -- and at a show barn no less! I can't complain though. It's so nice to look out my windows and see the horses right there.
I hope you're enjoying the spring weather...finally! Was that the longest winter ever???!!!
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Tuesday, Jun 24, 2008 - 9:57 am:
You are so right about the winter! It wasn't so severe, it just never quit. And, it doesn't seem like we had much spring. The weather went from snow to hot in about two days.
We just got our first cutting baled and in the barn. I can't tell you how happy that makes me!
I love the Jackson area. When I was up there with the horses years ago, we rode along the GrosVant river; it was so beautiful!
There used to be a motel with log cabins and horse corals at one end of town, and a wild, really old bar as you started up the grade to Targee. Do you know if that place is still there? When we were there cowboys (real ones) would tie their horses up to a hitchin post outside, and they were broadcasting some honkey-tonk music from the place.
Also, the Million Dollar Cowboy Bar in town, was a real cowboy bar with few tourists (believe it or not!) We had great fun dancing with all the cowboys on Saturday night! We were back there a few years ago and you wouldn't know it was the same place. Ah, well.....
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Member:
teddi
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Posted on Tuesday, Jun 24, 2008 - 12:38 pm:
Sara,
We got snow, rain, sleet and hail until about three weeks ago. And there was snow on the ground until the end of May this year. I'm so glad it's not winter anymore. And I'm pretty sure that if I never saw another 7 month long winter, I'd be just fine.
Jackson has changed a lot in 20 years. That motel with the log cabins is no longer there at the S. end of town. Too bad because I'd have loved to see Cowboys there with their horses. And I cannot imagine the Cowboy Bar being a real cowboy bar! It's all tourists and college kids now. It must've been a shock to see how much things have changed when you came back a few years ago.
I'm glad you got your first cutting baled and tucked away. I'm still trying to find someone who can supply me with hay. I might have a resource who grows hay in Star Valley and he'll actually deliver to my house -- unheard of here. I may have to take a trip to Star Valley to see what his hay looks like this weekend. And I'm still going to buy the Timothy/Alfalfa cubes from Triple Crown as a supplement to hay. At least then I'll have all of my bases covered.
Thanks so much for all your help. If you're ever in the Jackson area, we'll have to get together for a ride.
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Tuesday, Jun 24, 2008 - 1:02 pm:
I'd love to ride with you! After summer, I plan on cutting way back on the showing and spending a lot more time just riding. Jackson Hole would fit into that plan just fine!
Until we started growing our own hay, I always kept some cubes around "just in case." They were my "security blanket." I can't use pellets on all my horses, as I have one that tends to choke on them. They all do fine with the cubes. I guess you don't have an Intermountain Farmers near you? They are a co-op for ranchers and farmers and are in UT and ID, but don't know if they extend further. It's usually a good place to get feed, including alfalfa/grass pellets and beet pulp.
Yes, it was a BIG shock! I had been telling Lonnie all about the Cowboy Bar and the Mexican food downstairs. The food when we were there was the worst Mex I'd ever had! I couldn't wait to get out of town! The area is beautiful, though. I love the Yellowstone area. We've spent time up there back-country skiing....a whole 'nother subject! Soooo amazingly beautiful!
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Member:
teddi
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Posted on Wednesday, Jun 25, 2008 - 11:12 am:
Sara,
Terrific! We can ride in the Park or just out the back of my property. (The back of my property opens up to National Forest land.) But you have to promise not to laugh at my horses. They're so out of shape from the long winter that it'll take me all summer just to get them legged up!
Thanks for the tip on Intermountain Farmers. I did a web search and you're right, they're only in Utah, Colorado and Idaho. Still keeping my fingers crossed that my newest contact for hay will come through. But I'll also keep some cubes on hand just in case.
And yes, it's amazingly beautiful here. I always say that every day is a perfect day here -- no matter what the weather is doing.
And another back-country skier?! You must have some incredible skiing in Utah. I try to get out as much as my work allows. When I moved here I even started my dog on Search and Rescue work...you know just to have my own Avy Rescue dog. However, time and work have stalled that for the time being. So many things to do and so little time for all of them...
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Wednesday, Jun 25, 2008 - 12:34 pm:
Lonnie and I used to live in Truckee, CA. He worked for Squaw and we did lots of skiing, downhill and backcountry. I'm a bit rusty, but still love it. Lonnie is Mr. "Telemark" and used to also be an avid climber in his younger days.
"Too little time"...the plague of my life!
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Member:
teddi
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Posted on Wednesday, Jun 25, 2008 - 3:23 pm:
I love Truckee! I used to ski a lot when I was younger, but didn't ski for several years after college. When I came back to skiing a few years ago I couldn't believe how much the technology had changed! I'm incredibly rusty, but have fun just the same. I had hoped to take up tele-skiing this past winter, but work didn't allow for much time off. Maybe next year...
And I climb too! I've never been much good at it, but it's fun and I really enjoying scaring the heck out of myself. I worked for a climbing magazine when I first moved to Jackson. My dog's profile is still on the website. Check him out at https://www.alpinist.com/p/mag/about (scroll down to the bottom).
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New Member:
ngreen
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Posted on Thursday, Dec 18, 2008 - 2:11 am:
Dear Doctor O,
I want to know if there is any downside to Chaffehaye - my horses seem OK on it so far - they have been switched over to 100% Chaffehaye for about a week.
They have lost a bit of weight, but I think that is because I wasn't feeding them enough, or they weren't going for it (Chaffehaye) initially or a combination of those things. They might have needed to loose a bit of weight anyway.
I have boarders at my barn who don't want to give Chaffehaye a chance - they insist that their horses won't do well on it, so they continue to give baled hay rather than let their horses get used to eating just Chaffehaye. I noticed that until I switched 100%, my horses still preferred baled hay when presented with both. Ironically, the reason I looked into Chaffehaye is because my boarder has two senior horses - one tends to be underweight, the other has had a history of founder.
Thanks for your input.
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Thursday, Dec 18, 2008 - 7:18 am:
Hello Nona,
Rather than placing questions about your horse at the bottom of another member's post, you should "Start a New Discussion". There will be no confusion between the two questions, help keep Horseadvice more organized, and more folks are likely to see your post so you will receive quicker and more responses that way.
You will find the "Start New Discussion" button at the bottom of the list of already present discussions found under every article. This is a good location for your post so back up one page by clicking on Forages for Horses, an Overview on the navigation bar above. To get a bit of a jump start include a description of the Chaffehaye and any nutritional information you have about it.
DrO
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New Member:
warthog
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Posted on Thursday, Dec 18, 2008 - 11:03 am:
Triple Crown sells timothy alfalfa cubes as well as alfalfa cubes and we've fed both for a couple of years with no problems. I like the cubes because it slows them down. Even the double compressed is easier to eat and they pig out on it.
Have you tried to find the 1500 pound square bales of double compressed timothy alfalfa or alfalfa. This is what we're feeding now to some of our horses and they are doing quite well on it but it will put weight on them. We feed just 1.25 pounds of Triple crown senior with the alfalfa and still have to run our guys around to keep the weight down.
We had to move our horses to FL from SC because of the problem getting hay. SC is in a worst case scenario DrOught so none of our hay sources had much and our cube supplier was afraid he was going to run out also. FL hay is expensive but at least we can find it.
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