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Discussion on Fattening up now getting too fat?
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Member:
adriaa
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 21, 2008 - 10:30 am:
Hi all,
Since I have brought my two mares home their diet has changed, mainly due to the addition of grass pasture. Previously on no real pasture they got 20-25lbs hay each and 6 lbs Safe Choice each.
My 19 yo. Morgan mare was underweight when I got her and I was trying to get her into condition. She did slowly and we did worm her since her worming history was unknown.
Now she seems to be getting quite fat (and sassy too) she's getting the 6lbs grain, Cocosoya, 5 hours pasture (we are working up slowly) and still 20 lbs nice grass hay.
A) is the Cocosoya overkill? It seems to have more protein than she needs since Safe Choice is 14%
B) should I reduce Safe choice amounts due to pasture.
Obviously in the winter I will have to re-adjust due to lack of pasture
Thanks
Adria
My TB is on the same diet, (no Cocosoya) and although she is not getting fat she's a bit antsy. Which could also be the situation...
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Member:
juliem
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 21, 2008 - 11:38 am:
Adria, if she's getting fat, she's consuming too many calories. If I fed my easy keeper (and Morgans usually are) this much he'd be obese! Twenty to twenty five pounds of good quality hay is probably all she really needs, unless her age makes keeping weight on hard. So, if you want to keep her on the pasture schedule, I'd cut out the grain unless she's in moderate to heavy work, cut out the cocosoya, and adjust the hay down while the pasture is good until she stops gaining weight. Fat Morgan's can be founder prone. I bet you'll notice her becoming much less "sassy" too. Dr. O may have a different take, but I think he'll say if she's too fat, she's being fed too much and shake his head while referencing the article on nutrition! You'll save a bundle too!
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Member:
ajudson1
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 21, 2008 - 3:19 pm:
Adria,
SafeChoice, is, "safe", meaning you can feed it almost solely for calories if you wish( I was told that by the Nutrena Rep btw) and it is also calories and protien.
If your horses are fat and sassy, I'd cut out the SafeChoice unless you feed a very small amount for adding supplements to, which is what I do. My horses stay in good condition with grass hay, winter, pasture in the summer, with a mineral block provided, and their supplements.
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Member:
scooter
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 21, 2008 - 4:55 pm:
Why are diets soo hard!! I know they shouldn't be, but do find them confusing especially with the easy keeping ones.
Adria, I would loose the safechoice, or at least cut it in half and go from there. If she's getting obese she shouldn't need oil either...unless you are using it for a specific problem such as espm.
My easy keeper used to get safechoice, but now he gets about a cup of alfalfa pellets and is just as happy + it's high in protein to make up for the lack of it in his diet.
You just have to dial down calories going in or more exercise.(SOUNDS easy) My fat boy gets along well with 24/7 VERY VERY short pasture, 6#'s of not so great grass hay, 2 cups alfalfa pellets per day. He's still fat!!! He is ridden or exercised a couple days a week.
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Member:
adriaa
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 21, 2008 - 9:52 pm:
Diets are so hard!! I feel like a dope. I know poor Dr. O always sending us dopes to the proper threads, but I'm still confused!!
When I got her she was thin, a 4 maybe, her tailhead and backbone were prominent, but not bony but very out of condition. She was at that time I was told only on grass. She was thin though.
Then she came to the barn where I was boarding with no pasture really, she got hay and Safechoice, it took a while for her to start looking better, now her coat is shiny and she's getting fat. Her rump is all filled out and she is getting a hay belly!!! Even her neck feels a bit cresty. But it happened quite fast, really just since she's been here, 2 weeks or so.
the Cocosoya is definitely out, and I'm trimming down the Safechoice, and maybe less hay. AND some exercise might help too...
I had to adjust her sheet, it had gotten tight just from last week!
It could also be the grass hay, they hay she was getting was more stemmy and rough. Do I need to reduce hay too?
I am giving them lots of hay since they are not out 24/7 on the pasture yet, so they have something in the paddock at night and for the time they are in there during the day.
I really wasn't expecting her to swing the other way, I was actually concerned about her weight going in to winter, but she is a Morgan.
I'll post a pic
Thanks
Adria
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Member:
scooter
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 21, 2008 - 10:14 pm:
Adria if she is grazing (depending on the grass) AND getting 20-25#s of decent hay I would think that is a little much for one of the easy keeping breeds + 6#'s of safechoice shew!!! seems like quite a bit.
The best thing I have found for keeping fat boy somewhat under control is to feed him 1.5% of what his body weight SHOULD be. So for ex if your horse should weigh 1000#'s at 2% of her body weight (which is high IMO for easy keepers) She should be getting 15-20#'s of forage. HECK mine can eat 15#s of grass in 5 hrs on a decent pasture . Good Luck
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Member:
juliem
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 21, 2008 - 10:21 pm:
Adria, if she's fat, she's getting too much to eat. After you cut out the concentrates and the oil, if she stays fat you will have to reduce the hay or the pasture time. If you read the article, you'll find that 20 pounds of hay is probably too much along with the pasture. If you figure she needs only 1.5 pounds of hay per 100 pounds of body weight, that would be her total for a day--not including pasture. She can easily eat 15 pounds of grass in five hours. That's too much in addition to the hay. One of them has to be reduced. It's really not that hard. If the horse is fat, they're eating too much. If the horse is thin, they need more. I struggled with it too at times until I decided just to look at the horse--fat horse? Cut the groceries. Thin horse??--more feed. If you want them to have hay to chew on when they are not on pasture you may have to find a stemmier grass hay.
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 22, 2008 - 8:03 am:
Sounds like a good plan Adria. Feeding horses correctly IS easy and everything you need to know about feeding horses correctly lies in one short paragraph. You all know where that paragraph is, see the Golden Rule (the only bold and italicized font on the whole site) in the article Overview of Nutrition.
DrO
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Member:
adriaa
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 22, 2008 - 10:55 am:
I didn't know really how much # of forage 5 hours of grass would be. She must have been on not such good grass at her old home. I do have some stemmy really late 1st cut hay, we had an awful hay season in the N.E., they don't like it all that much, sounds like the ticket.
Thanks all
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Member:
ajudson1
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 22, 2008 - 11:39 am:
Adria,
When my horses get too fat and sassy on pasture, I start limiting it to anywheres from 2-6 hours a day. I normally don't have toooo much pasture, but when there is fresh spring growth, that is how I do it and feed older stemmy hay. Your pastures look like they are plenty rich yet, so maybe you need to fence off a small area that they can graze down to almost nothing and use that for like 20 hours of the day, with some of the stemmy hay. I know I love mine in the pastures, so much room for movement vs the dirt lot, but as you are finding, horses like need all this micromanagement!
Nice looking horses! And I'll trade you for the pasture, mine has froze several times, just waiting for snow cover now and then they'll be back on the main one with hay spread all around.
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Member:
adriaa
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 22, 2008 - 1:14 pm:
Angie,
The pasture is only 2 acres, and they may have it eaten down pretty soon, but winter is coming so it'll be dying off too...
They are soo happy in this pasture, Rosie the TB just runs and runs around it. Freedom!!
Can rich grass and grass hay make them "high" like too much carbs in sweet feed?
Anyway, they have been demoted to stemmy hay and pasture. The grass hay I have is REALLY nice, it smells sooo good, like horse candy and it's the kind of hay I would definitely sleep in.
When it was put up the whole barn was this fragrant, herbal, grass smell. No wonder they are nuts.
I'm going to get the hay tested...
Adria
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