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Discussion on Purchasing a 4 yr old with no training?
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New Member:
lnadeau
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Posted on Friday, Mar 27, 2009 - 11:49 pm:
My girl friends horse of 17 yrs passed away 2 mnths ago. We have been horse searching for the past month and we think we may have found a 4 yr old dark bay warm blood. He's a beautifull animal but the problem is that he has spent the majority of his life in a stall with a walk out paddock alone with very little human attention besides feeding and watering. He will stand for grooming under halter but he is very pushy and spooky when we try to walk him. My question is can we with time and a good trainer bring him around or is he set in his ways? We feel baddly for this horse but we can't afford a horse we can't ride.
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Member:
mitch316
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Posted on Saturday, Mar 28, 2009 - 2:28 am:
First off, sorry for your friends loss. From my experience, a four year old can be trained just like any other. We recently broke a five year old with no problems. However, I think (and it may just be me) it took longer to do it. It requires more patience than Job, and a lot of time. Daily interaction is a must, and if this is not possible I would reconsider. Like I said, this is just my opinion. I am not sure what part of the country or world you are from, but if money is an issue, now is the time to buy, or even better adopt, a horse that is already ready to go and in serious need of a good owner. Just about every rescue around here is full or overcrowded, and horses are going at the stock sales for as little as $75.
That being said, if your friend would like a bonding experience like no other and has the time and patience to spend, there should be no reason why he cannot be trained. It will not be easy, but not impossible either. If she wants one ready to ride quickly, I would call your closest rescue. If she wants one to train, but cannot invest a lot of time and effort, I would still go to the rescues first, and then to the sale. Just my opinion, but I know there are others on here with loads more experience than me! Hope it helped a little!!
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Member:
dsibley
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Posted on Saturday, Mar 28, 2009 - 7:46 am:
My first question would be to ask why the horse was in that situation? Was he started earlier only to find a serious lameness issue, or even worse, a disposition problem? Why did someone spend the money for a stall, feed, bedding, etc and then not work with him? I hate to be cynical but you need to look at all angles here.
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Saturday, Mar 28, 2009 - 9:21 am:
Hello Lance,
I feel strongly that this horse can be successfully trained but from your post I wonder if this is why your girlfriend wants to buy a horse and does she have the experience or knowledge to do the training.
DrO
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Member:
ekaufman
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Posted on Saturday, Mar 28, 2009 - 10:59 am:
Welcome to HA Lance! Of course a 4 year-old can be trained. Many WB people believe that WBs ought not to be started before 4, so it's quite common to find horses in this situation, but in a market where your girlfriend could easily find an 8 year-old well started at a bargain price, why on earth would she bother? It is far better to spend the extra time looking for a suitable horse that will work out the chute, than to waste time later unhappy with a very green, somewhat spoiled and quite possibly unsuitable horse.
If you can't afford a horse you can't ride, buy a horse you CAN ride now. There are many lovely ones looking for a home!
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Member:
jjrichar
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Posted on Saturday, Mar 28, 2009 - 11:12 am:
I totally agree with what has been said above. I have to confess and admit to having had horses that have gotten a 'late start' in their breaking and training. Not because of injury, but simply because I did not have time to commit to them. Family and work always seem to come first. LOL
Anyhow, there are advantages to having a 4 year old that is not trained... First, his bones are well formed now and you pretty much know that he wasn't pushed too hard when he was too young, like many trainers do. Also, he probably doesn't have any BAD training you would have to undo that you may encounter with an already trained horse. I personally feel that older horses can sometimes be easier to train because they don't have as much 'pee and vinegar' in them as the youngsters do. A lot of times they are a little more tolerant since they have had more life experience, assuming the experiences they have had are good ones. But of course, all of this has to be judged on a horse by horse basis.
The disadvantages here mostly seem to come from the conditions he is kept in resulting from isolation, etc. This would be where I would try and spend as much time as possible with the horse, prior to purchase and see how he 'comes around'. If the current owners are willing, your girlfriend should visit him as much as possible and see how he responds more human interaction.
Jesse also brings up a good point... what was the reason for the late start? It’s a fair question to ask the sellers that they should readily be able to answer. And you have to assume they don’t necessarily answer honestly. It is possible it was injury related and a pre-purchase vet exam may be well worth it.
All in all, a four year old is by no means an 'old horse' and still very trainable. Before I would worry to much about age, I would focus more on his individual behavior and whether or not he is the right horse. Your girlfriend needs to ask herself a few questions... Does she have the resources and knowledge to train him, via the guidance of a trainer, etc. And does she have the patience to spend time building his confidence to get him over the skiddishness? If the answers are yes, then she could have found a diamond in the rough. 
My deepest sympathies for her loss. Good luck to you!
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Member:
stek
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Posted on Saturday, Mar 28, 2009 - 12:47 pm:
I agree with the above .. if your girlfriend is a trainer, or wants to invest the time and money into a trainer, then the horse's background should not eliminate him as a prospect.
If she doesn't have the skills or finances to invest, or simply wants a horse she can ride sooner than later, I would keep looking.
That said, we have a horse on our farm who is 10 who spent the last 6 years stalled or in a small paddock with little to no human or horse interaction. His manners were of course atrocious and he had no herd social skills, but within a few months with clear consistent handling and turnout with a good herd he is very much over those issues.
Good luck in your horse search, and remember horses live a long time .. make your choice with that in mind.
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New Member:
lnadeau
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Posted on Saturday, Mar 28, 2009 - 2:22 pm:
Thank you all for your advice. We believe the owners of the horse just ran out of money to do anything with him, we know they are at least a year behind on his board and they own 7 other horses. My concern isn't so much that they are hiding something but wheather the horse can come around. We have factored in the cost of 6 weeks professional training and we discounted his purchase price to reflect his condition. You have all given us solid advice and we thank you. We will keep you posted.
Thanks Again
Lance and Mary
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Member:
muffi
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Posted on Monday, Mar 30, 2009 - 10:18 pm:
Good luck Lance and Mary -
let me share a story from my vet.
We were talking about training and timing - My horse - Just a grade horse but my pride and joy is huge adn beautiful. just coming 10 this year. I was saying that this was gonna be his year. my vet agreed - he noted that all too often horses are trained in to a skill at too young age. that once a horse hits double digits. he is perfect for decipline and training. That actually he thought that Dressage horses were better off waiting on that part of their training until they were in fact older and ready to understand and handle the decipline (gee it seems I can't spell that word? oh well you know what i mean)
but moral of the story - if the horse clicks with you all than that is your horse - you know they also hae to pick you too. see if it works. good luck and post pictures!!!WE ALL LOVE PICTURES
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New Member:
lnadeau
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 - 12:21 am:
Thanks again for all your advice and support. We bought Finnigan and brought him home today. We are happy to report he is now safe and sound in a seven stall barn with 2 retires, 2 5 yr olds and another 4 yr old. He will be going for training late next week. I'm attaching photos of my 4yr old buckskin quarter horse "Topaz" and some old photos of Finnigan
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New Member:
lnadeau
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 - 12:28 am:
Heres Topaz
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Member:
hollyw
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 - 12:37 am:
Fantastic!!!! He's GORGEOUS!
If the trainer is worth his/her salt, he/she will include you in the training. Be sure to go and visit the trainer often with he/she is working with Finnegan so you can be ready to continue the methods when he returns home.
So happy for you.
(Topaz's pics didn't show.)
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Member:
erika
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 - 10:43 am:
Wow! What a beauty. I can see why you didn't move on. I hope he turns out as beautifully behaved as he looks!
Erika
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Member:
jjrichar
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 - 12:01 pm:
OH wow! He's beautiful! So glad you went ahead and purchased him. With some training and socialization I am sure he will come around. I don't think you will be disappointed at all. Congrats! 
Please keep us posted and let us know how things progress in training. I am sure I can speak for all of us in saying we would love to hear how it goes. Good luck!
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Member:
vickiann
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 31, 2009 - 4:28 pm:
Finnigan is a very beautiful horse.
I hope that you will enjoy him very much.
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New Member:
lnadeau
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Posted on Wednesday, Apr 1, 2009 - 1:24 am:
Thanks all, I'm positive he's going to work out fine. We are pretty excited. I'm trying to upload a Topaz pic. Sorry doesn't work
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Member:
lnadeau
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Posted on Monday, Aug 10, 2009 - 3:59 pm:
Just an update on Finnagan. Once we had him moved and settled in we brought in a horse starter. Within the first two days Mary was able to get on him and by the end of five days he was calm and she was able to ride on her own. Mary now is riding him in dressage lessons and the trainer is absolutley thrilled with his mind and movement. We are very happy and look forward to showing him next summer. A real diamond in the rough story. Once again thanks for your help and support.
Cheers
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Member:
frances
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 11, 2009 - 12:50 am:
Wonderful - congratulations! And maybe ... pictures of him today??
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Member:
canter
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 11, 2009 - 2:43 am:
That's fabulous, Lance! I wish you and Mary continued success on Finnagan.
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Member:
jjrichar
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Posted on Saturday, Aug 15, 2009 - 2:18 pm:
So great to hear, Lance! What a lucky horse to have found good, responsible owners too. :-)
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Member:
lilo
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 16, 2009 - 4:44 am:
Love a story with a happy ending! All the best, Lilo
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Member:
vickiann
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 16, 2009 - 7:10 am:
Great news, Lance.
Thanks for this happy up-date.
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