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  Discussion on Balancing the calcium to phosphorus ratio when feeding rice bran
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Posted on Thursday, Sep 21, 2000 - 7:00 pm:

Hi all:) I'm looking for some advice regarding balancing the calcium to phosphorus ratio when feeding rice bran. I have been trying out a product called Satin Finish (a stabilized rice bran) on two of my hard keepers for about a month with excellent results. I'm feeding twice a day. Horse #1 (17.2h 7 yr old TB gelding) receives per feeding: 4 lbs crimped oats, 1 lb rice bran, 1 lb Purina Athelete, 8 lbs grass/alfalfa mix hay. Horse #2 (15.2h 4 yr Arabian mare) receives the same except 2lbs of oats rather than 4 lbs. Both clean up their grain, but the mare doesn't always finish her hay. Both are showing a definite reduction in undigested oats in their manure. They're also putting on weight where before they were barely holding their own when on a regular work schedule. Also, they're coats are just beautiful (a happy byproduct, but not the reason I'm feeding the rice bran). The Satin Finish has a 20% fat content with a .02%-.07% calcium content and a 1.5% minimum phosphorus content per 2lb feeding. I spoke with my local feed store and they had no straight calcium supplements, but I'm sure they would look it up if I could give them a name. I know the alfalfa mix hay is helping with the ratio, but without getting it tested, I don't know how much it's helping. From reading through all the articles and posts I could find, it sounds like a bonemeal product would be the way to go. Does anyone know a name brand I could look into? Also, if anyone has any comments regarding what I'm feeding I'm always open. I've been doing a lot of reading lately and I'm afraid I may have hit that dangerous stage where I think I know more than I do.

Thanks in advance for the help and advice!
Nancy

Posted on Friday, Sep 22, 2000 - 7:38 am:

Boy that is incredible, appx 50 to 1 phosphorous to calcium ratio. The calcium content of alfalfa is pretty consistant and you can find those numbers in the article on forages. You can then calculate the amount of alfalfa required to balance the bran so that you are feeding twice as much calcium as phosphorous. One problem I have with mixed hays is that it is always hard for me to tell how much of each type forage is in them.
DrO

Posted on Friday, Sep 22, 2000 - 12:04 pm:

Diamond makes a supposedly balance rice bran product. If you're feeding it strictly for the fat/calories, why not just feed oil?

Posted on Friday, Sep 22, 2000 - 1:25 pm:

I believe there's a good article on feeding that includes some discussion of this in the October issue of "Equus" or "Horse and Rider" (can't remember which).

Posted on Sunday, Sep 24, 2000 - 4:45 pm:

Thanks all! Dr O, do you know what weight the ratio on the Alfalfa table is based on? I had taken a look at it earlier and meant to ask in my original post.

Jordana, By any chance do you know the name of the Diamond product or the name of their site on the internet? The reason I was trying to stay with the rice bran was that at 2lbs of rice bran per day with 20% fat, I believe I'm feeding 6.4 ounces of fat. I didn't think I could get that much oil (a little better than 3/4 of a cup) down them every day. The bottles of oil I was looking at at the feed store recommended a maximum of 2 tablespoons per day (though that may be a patablity issue rather than an actual upper limit?? ... I don't know).

I spoke with my feed supplier on Friday about getting a bonemeal product. Unfortunately, since the Mad Cow disease outbreak a few year ago, bone meal has become unavailable to him. He's going to check with his feed specialist to see if they can come up with something else.

Thanks for the continued help!
Nancy

Posted on Sunday, Sep 24, 2000 - 8:05 pm:

Nancy - I went looking through a few horse mag issues to look for the Diamond ad, but couldn't find it. I'll keep looking though!

I'm feeding both my horses almost 2 cups of CocoSoya (coconut and soybean oil) a day. It's very palatable, and that gives them an additional almost 4,000 calories a day, about 20% of their total calories. I think the 2 tablespoons that you were saying were for coat shine more than anything else.

Posted on Sunday, Sep 24, 2000 - 10:24 pm:

Hi Nancy, I was on a site that talks about Rice Bran and all the percentages and thought I would pass it along to you. :)

https://shady-acres.com/susan/ricebran.shtml

Posted on Monday, Sep 25, 2000 - 11:44 am:

I am not sure I understand your question Nancy or which table you are referring to. Ratios are independant of weight however, so perhaps you are looking at the problem wrong? We have added information on calcium supplements to the article on bran to help clarfy some of these problems.
DrO

Posted on Saturday, Sep 30, 2000 - 1:53 pm:

Thanks all for the help! I think I'm going to look around for the oil product you mention, Jordana. I also was told about a balanced rice bran product put out by Buckeye that I might give a try.

Linda, great site and very readable! Thanks for turning me on to it.

Dr O, after thinking about it, I understand what you mean. No matter how much I feed, I still wouldn't change the ratio. Just took me a minute to engage the brain cells :)

Anyway, thanks again for all the help. At this point, I think I'm definitely going to stop feeding the Satin Finish. I think even if I can find a calcium product to balance out the phosphorus, I'm going to get into an over-mineralization problem. It's a shame, because I really liked the outward results ... but then, beauty is only skin deep.

Nancy

Posted on Sunday, Oct 1, 2000 - 9:32 am:

Nancy,
You can hoave your cake and eat it too. Vegtable oil supplementation gives many the same effects. We have an article on the pros and cons and how to go about it.
DrO

Posted on Sunday, Oct 1, 2000 - 4:26 pm:

Nancy, you are very welcome!. It's my pleasure to help with whatever I can so that our kids are getting the best balance of knowledge and care that we can provide. :)

Posted on Sunday, Oct 1, 2000 - 7:32 pm:

Hi Nancy - the CocoSoya that I mentioned can be found at https://www.uckele.com.

Posted on Monday, Oct 2, 2000 - 2:16 pm:

Jordana--Do you know of another source for the cocosoya oil? I'd love to use it, but I find it costs more to ship it to my location than the jugs, themselves, actually cost. Thanks.

Posted on Tuesday, Oct 3, 2000 - 11:15 am:

Hi Eveo - I sure don't, but if you find one, would you please let me know! :-)
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