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  Discussion on Treatment of placentitis
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Posted on Wednesday, Feb 20, 2002 - 10:09 am:

What exactly is the treatment for placentitis? My vet is recommending a sulfa drug and regumate. Other articles indicate using regumate is a waste of money. I didn't see anything in the article that would suggest the use of an antibiotic (unless I just didn't recognize it). My mare is bagging up at 281 days but she has been off of fescue for a month already. Something, beside bad luck, has to explain the problems I have had with getting healthy foals.

Out of 8 pregnancies, I have have had two late term abortions, the absorbtion of an embryo, two foals that had to have transfusions because the mare leaked out all of the colostrum, and a retained placenta.

I have fescue but I dry lot the mares for the last three months. I feed alfalfa and grain and I follow all of the recommendations for shots.

Posted on Thursday, Feb 21, 2002 - 7:17 am:

Hello Scott,
What breed of horse are we dealing with? What is the treatment for placentitis is an excellent question Scott but the ability to diagnose this condition is really in its infancy and treatment regimens have not become established. We are unsure at this time but as the article on abortion suggests in the placentitis section, antibiotics and Regumate are logical but their efficacy unknown.

Unless I misunderstand your post and you have the ultrasound diagnosis of placentitis already firmly established, it strikes me you are approaching your problem backwards. You are far more likely to hurt this pregnancy with the use of drugs not clearly indicated than possibly hitting this diagnosis in the dark. See the articles in the medication section on the drugs your vet proposes to use for more information.

The articles you read on Regumate and its misuse in preventing abortion were discussing early embryonic loss not preventing abortion from infectious causes.

Let's see if we can determine what is going on. Concerning the two late term abortions, placentitis should have been easy to diagnose. Also were necropsy's done on the foals. If so what was found? One absorbed embryo out of 8 is about the normal number and should have been picked up at the 40 day check.

What were the indications for transfusions on your foals? Though you read about colostrum leaking out, quite frankly in 15 years of taking care of many newborns I really don't think I have seen it occur even in mares that dripped for days before birthing.

With this many problems let's start with the basics and work our way up. You can take this to the bank: this many different type poorly defined problems indicate a probable managment break down somewhere and not an epidemic of placentitis. We need to id this so that next year things go more smoothly. Oh by the way, beginning to bag up at 281 days is a little early but in the normal range. However if bagging up is heavy, and the ultrasound of the placenta normal, consider over-nutrition as a possible cause.
DrO

Posted on Thursday, Feb 21, 2002 - 8:38 pm:

Dr. O

Let me give you some details. I am attempting to raise quarter horses. The two foals that had transfusions were tested with something they called an IGG test that indicated they didn’t get sufficient colostrum.

The mare that absorbed the embryo was bred the following year with shipped semen four times and did not check in foal. After the second failure they put her on regumate after she was bred. When they pregnancy checked her at 14 days she had a 4 cm follicle while on a full dose of regumate. The exact same thing occurred the next time. The vet said that wasn’t possible, although obviously it was. She had a biopsy that came back grade 1. Cultures were all negative.

The mare that aborted at 10 months had two prior foals. The first was born at 320 days and the second at 324 days..one of which needed the transfusion. She was put on regumate when she started dripping milk at 10 months but aborted about four days later. I was told by the vet that a necropsy would probably be inconclusive and that I should consider selling the mare (which I did), because there was a good chance she would have further trouble.

One of the problems I have is the closest equine vet (or any vet with an ultrasound) is a four hour round trip. I had already written this mare's pregnency off based on my prior experience and perhaps a misreading of the articles. I will take her to the vet on Saturday for an ultrasound.

My broodmares receive about two laps of alfalfa twice a day. I started with one quart of grain (14%) during the ninth month and add one quart a week. This mare probably weighs a 1000 pounds and was getting five quarts of grain when started to bag-up.

I just think that there is something working here other than bad luck. Thank you for responding.

Posted on Saturday, Feb 23, 2002 - 1:25 pm:

Do you remember what type IgG test it was and what the actual reading was? The significance of some of the readings on this test are argued.

The follicle while on Regumate is not unheard of and probably represents an already formed follicle when the Regumate was began.

Lets start with nutrition:
Using the condition scale at "Care for Horses: Disease Prevention and Health Care: Weight, Condition, and Eventual Height Estimation" what would you grade your mares at. The amount of grain sounds a bit extreme if their condition was good before you started. How much does a lap of alfalfa weigh? What other forage do they receive?
DrO

Posted on Saturday, Feb 23, 2002 - 9:14 pm:

I made the trip to the vet today. The ultrasound indicated a normal placenta width (1.3cm I think)and normal foal heart rate. He said there appeared to more edema than bagging-up. He put in a caslic stitch and said she should be fine. I feel much better but am still concerned.

The IgG reading was 100 on the first foal and 300 on the second.

The condition of my broodmares is almost always fleshy to fat. This particular mare has stayed fairly close to the fleshy category. The mares are in a lot because of fescue so there is no other forage. I thought, if anything, the broodmare in her last trimester should have free choice alfalfa. I don't have a scale to weigh forage.

Posted on Sunday, Feb 24, 2002 - 9:50 am:

Well Scott,
the first thing to do is to achieve a body condition score of moderately fleshy. Though I have published the recommended body scores of Kohnke as he wrote them, I also made a note at the top to the effect that I think he goes overboard and fat is not acceptable to me for any horse. I think over nutrition not only adversely effects the pregnancy but is a big reason for developmental orthopedic disease.

From here on out I want you to try and achieve a score of moderately fleshy in your mares going into the last 30 days of pregnancy. No big downward moves should be made just before foaling, but quit upping the feed on a mare that is already fleshy to fat, please....

Next issue, exercise. What kind of exercise are these mares getting during their pregnancy.

I can believe what you thought was bagging up was edema and probably a lot of fat too. If the vet felt there was no problem, why did he do a Caslicks? Concerning the IgG 100 and 300, how long after the foals started nursing were these blood levels taken from the foals? Was the test performed there at your farm, in his office, or sent off to a lab?
DrO

Posted on Monday, Feb 25, 2002 - 2:33 pm:

I have always been concerned about a lack of exercise once the mares are taken off fescue. The mares are put in 100' by 100' paddocks. My vet said they would get plenty of exercise on there own.

Both IgG tests were done about 30 hours after foaling. The mares and foals were hauled to the equine vets and they did the test in house.

I guess that I should throw away my "Blessed are the Broodmares" book. It says that a broodmare should be getting 14 quarts of grain by the end of her pregnancy (1,000 pound mare). I also thought conception rates were much better if the horse was on the fat side.

Posted on Tuesday, Feb 26, 2002 - 7:20 am:

I agree with your vet a 100 by 100 paddock is probably big enough, do they stay clean and dry Scott and how when do you move them in there?

It looks like the IgG testing was done at the proper times.

Yes, you should throw away any book that recommends you be feeding 14 quarts of grain a day to a horse in fat condition, but I can't believe that is what the book says. There are some mares out there that are not fat and even lose weight on 14 quarts of feed a day after the foal is born. It does not sound like your mares are one of those. Concerning conception rates, moderately fleshy IS on the fat side.
DrO

Posted on Thursday, Apr 11, 2002 - 2:55 pm:

Hi there I have a mare that my vet suspects placentitis, am I correct in understanding that antibiotics at this point will not help?

Posted on Friday, Apr 12, 2002 - 5:28 am:

No you are not correct, unless the vet feels the fetus has already died. You need to read the article associated with this forum and the previous forum posts in this discussion more closely. It discusses this and many other important aspects of this disease. I have done a little research this morn and included some specific recommendations for treatment in the article.
DrO

PS Cathy,
When you post a new question you should start your own discussion and not post it at the bottom of someone else's discussion. It keeps discussions easy to read and you will get more responses. The button for starting a new discussion is at the bottom of the page that has the link to the article associate with this forum and the list of already created discussion.
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