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  Discussion on Has anyone heard of protien bumps that develop in the saddle area if untacked too quickly while hot?
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Member:
corinne

Posted on Monday, Aug 27, 2007 - 11:33 pm:

I have just learned of a condition called protein bumps that supposedly develop when you untack your horse two quickly and develop in the saddle area. My horse has four which I attributed to inscectal causes. They came out of no where, the skin is in tact and eveyone swares they are these things called protein bumps which develop as some sort of heat reaction to sweat and pressure being relieved from the saddle two quickly after riding. Supposedly the are prone in warmbloods (are not actually protein deposits) take a while to go away and quite common. I have never heard of such a thing. Some of the horses at the barn are untacked over thirty minutes decreaseing the pressure at the girth slowly, then entirely, then letting the saddle sit, then the pads then when he is cool removing them all. Does any one have any information about this? This has been explained at our barn by numerous vets to horse owners but I have yet to inquire but am interested.

v/r
Corinne
Member:
mrose

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 28, 2007 - 12:32 am:

I have heard of them, but never actually seen one and rather thought they were in the line of an "old wives tale" or in this case, an "old grooms tale." There are times, esp. at shows when changing horses between classes that a horse will get his saddle and pad taken off in a hurry and the horse will be pretty sweaty. We sometimes don't get a chance to rinse the horse off for a little while. These are my Arabs and a friends Paints & Quarter Horses. Are these breeds not supposed to be as susceptible to these bumps? Where are the bumps located? Could they be fluid build up due to pressure?
Member:
mrose

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 28, 2007 - 12:40 am:

I just did a quick internet search and found this from Ohio State U.: "Occasionally horses will develop hives, commonly called protein bumps, on the skin. These can be an allergic reaction of the body to foreign proteins in the feed but are more likely are the result of skin contact with some chemical in the bedding. Insect bites also cause these hives. Generally, the hives are short lived and no serious problem occurs."
Member:
canter

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 28, 2007 - 7:42 am:

Thanks for the info Sara. I had a moment of concern when reading Corinnes post: I almost always remove my saddle immediately after my ride is done before continuing to cool out via hand walking. I just always thought that after a hard workout, the sweat would dry quicker and it was kinder to the horse to get the saddle off as soon as possible.
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 28, 2007 - 9:57 am:

That's very strange. Having said that, I have noticed Gem has some bumps in her shoulder area, mostly on the left, after riding. Barely noticeable but I am watching them. She was in very poor condition when we got her as a supposived "yearling" (she was most likely 6 months old, not a year) and is around 5 now. She seems to have reactions to some things that don't bother the rest and I always pay close attention to her health.

Wonder what DrO thinks of these types of bumps you see on Demetrius?
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 28, 2007 - 10:13 am:

Hello Corrinne,
The problem with the posts above is not enough detail to really tell what is going on and I am uncertain you are describing hives.

What most folks here call protein bumps are either fly bite reactions or a common condition called cutaneous amyloidosis (Diseases of Horses » Skin Diseases, Wounds, and Swellings » Bumps / Nodules / Warts / Tumors » Cutaneous Amyloidosis). Amyloid is a proteinacous material so can be accurately called "protein bumps" though some have said it is related to excess protein in the diet, not true as far as I know. I do not believe amyloid bumps have anything to do with how fast the tack is removed but do believe that they could be a reaction to pressure points from the tack but many are not related to areas where the tack sits.
DrO
Member:
mrose

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 28, 2007 - 10:53 am:

Likewise, Fran. Guess I won't change anything.
Member:
maggienm

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 28, 2007 - 11:33 pm:

Very pertinent posting. Just tonight when I was tacking up I noticed a small lump on my mares back.
It is a little smaller than a dime, moves with the skin and if I pick at it causes flinching.
It is under the saddle area but not near a pressure point. I will double check to see if there is anything in the blanket that might be responsible.
Last month I noticed a similar bump away from the saddle area on the shoulder. It didn't do anything(like get a scab, swell, appear tender) just gradually went away.
She has been stung a few times this year, this is different.
Just for interest I loosen the girth, scoop poop, take the saddle off, leave pads on while I take off leg boots and bridle, depending on weather and how warm she is I may leave the pads on while sweep- whatever- then take the pads off.
My reasoning is when I am working and slow down or stop after a bit I sometimes get chilly, esp if I have been sweating, she can't tell me. Also, I seem to remember somewhere in the dim recess of my mind that a muscle experiences less stiffness if cooled slowly, this meaning walking out as well as air temp. Maybe I am not remembering correctly.
One other thing, if the air temp was perhaps 75 or warmer I might pull the pads sooner.
Member:
corinne

Posted on Wednesday, Aug 29, 2007 - 11:45 pm:

Hello Dr O and all. I am sure these are not hives. They are somewhat hard to touch pea sized bumps that are gradually diminishing. Having just read the Cutaneous Amyloidosis information because my friend found a huge mass in her horse's throat and I was researching what it could be, I still think that perhaps what I have is a reaction to insect bites. He is on senior feed which is low in protein, is now only getting broome hay and one fat supplement with 6 lbs of Equine Senior per day.
I am going to ask one of the vets the next time they are there for a scientific explanation of these supposed protein bumps, how and why they develop and I will post back. I have always removed his tack quickly as a reward and have never had an issue until now, but this had been a really bad bug season. I would be more inclined to think this is an old groom's tale however, these are all Grand Prix horses who get the best vet care and all their owner's know of these bumps described to them by very good vets at the local vet schools etc, that may develop as some sort of reaction to pressure being released too quickly after the horse is sweaty. Hmmmmmmmm I have no idea but will update what I get more information. I am not concerned for Demetrius but am more curious as to what my barn mates are speaking of.
Member:
mrose

Posted on Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 - 12:12 am:

This has been a bad fly season. I've had horses get bumps from bites like you would expect from a bad horse fly bite or even bee sting, but no horse flies around where we live, except in the mountains near water. This is the first time I've seen these bites since we've lived here.

I remain unconvinced there is such a thing as a real "protein bumps" but will be interested to see what your area vets say.
Member:
corinne

Posted on Thursday, Aug 30, 2007 - 9:12 am:

Sara will get back to you. I too am leaning towards the wive's tale but I will play devil's advocate since K State vets have given in depth discussions to owners on these bumps before and surely if there is some sorta of inflammatory response etc the vets would know and I always take the word of an Equine Practitioner (well most of the them anyway....I cross reference with HA first. LOL).
Member:
dres

Posted on Thursday, Oct 9, 2008 - 12:05 am:

Corinne, did you ever get to the 'root' of these bumps?? My rehab filly has a couple in the saddle area, hard round does not appear to be a bite as there is no pit to believe so.. they do not appear to bother her ?? She has several..

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
stevens

Posted on Thursday, Oct 9, 2008 - 9:53 am:

Ann,

I had a horse once who developed bumps in the saddle area. We did a biopsy and they were diagnosed as collagen granuloma (or something like that). The vet told me it was likely an allergic reaction to insect bites that may have actually been on another part of the horse's body.

We put the horse on prednisone, and they went away. They came back later and my vet injected them with some steroid and they never returned.

Good Luck.
Member:
dres

Posted on Thursday, Oct 9, 2008 - 10:29 am:

Thanks Chris, i have heard of injecting them. I know some vets will without a biopsy as they are common.. They don't appear to bother her as much as they do me.. ! But one larger one is right where the saddle puts pressure i can't help but think..

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
corinne

Posted on Friday, Oct 10, 2008 - 8:45 am:

Ann....sorry I haven't been able to check my email. Comps for my masters is in 5 weeks and I am studying like crazy.
Anyway, as for the bumps. I do believe they were insectal. I have not had a reoccurance and I don't leave the saddle on for long after riding since it's hot here. It never really made scientific sense that it was a condition caused by too quickly a release in pressure of tack and I am sure they would have developed again at one point since my original post.
Maybe as Dr O states they are just a reaction to pressure points? Can you try pads?
Let me know how the progress.

Corinne
Member:
frances

Posted on Thursday, Aug 26, 2010 - 7:19 am:

I'd never heard of this, but the other day when I removed the girth after riding (and it's extremely hot here) I noticed several bumps in the area the girth had covered. I glanced at another horse which was being untacked nearby at the same time - and it also had them.

So maybe there IS something to the theory of pressure being removed too suddenly - maybe blood flow has been restricted and suddenly is able to flow unimpeded, forming bumps? I shall experiment over the next few days .
Member:
rtrotter

Posted on Thursday, Aug 26, 2010 - 7:25 pm:

Hi All,

I have the same situation with my mare as well. She normally tows and very rarely wears a harness except to train. She's had them for about a month, they were almost gone and then came back again after another training trip in the harness. I've washed the neoprene girth cover, treated for bug bites, fungus etc. But they still stay there. They are not itchy and they do not bother her. I have been treating them with Tomorrow and this morning I washed them with antibacterial soap, rinsed very well and applied Tomorrow. Tonight they do not seem as prominent and look like they are drying up. I'll be able to tell more tomorrow morning.
Rachelle
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