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Discussion on Alushield "aluminum bandage" and Dermaclens
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New Member:
cnbreb
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 23, 2007 - 7:52 pm:
Dr O--
I am nursing a full thickness wound (more of a scalping actually) on a pastern and it is progressing nicely. I have been cleaning it twice daily, treating with Dermaclens and keeping it under a gauze, elastikon bandage. I have been keeping the horse in because of wet conditions to avoid soiling the bandage. I have been seeing advertisements for an aluminum aerosol bandage but couldn't find anything on your website about it. Could you educate me on it and its use? Is it something I can use on the wound now (it is 1.5 weeks old) or should it wait? He has a good amount of granulation tissue, which is under control and not excessive.
Any thoughts would be helpful.
Thanks!
Carolyn
I've also attached a picture of the wound (post hosing)
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Member:
vickiann
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 23, 2007 - 9:05 pm:
Hey, Carolyn - I've used this product upon Veterinary advise for wounds that were quite similar, from early in the treatment. For the size wound that you are dealing with, this product would be quite ideal, in my humble opinion, as someone who has used the product as professionally directed.
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Member:
jojo15
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 23, 2007 - 11:59 pm:
are you talking about allushield? and products like that? i had the same issue. Even after reading the article i chose to use it and wonder dust. Assessing that it was NOT a deep penetration wound. the wound was small enough and too close to the ground felt it was more important to keep stuff out and flies. I only used it for the first week. and bandaged. washing it out and hosing daily. it was a cannon bone slash on a mini.
why did i use it? I felt stopping stuff from getting in there was more important than heal rate or potential scarring issues. which is what i got from the article. It slows down the rate of healing. is more caustic. killing the good and the bad, etc. On a deeper wound i could see how you want the tissue to grow as quickly as possible, as healthy as possible. etc
Your wound doesn't look that bad at this point. But its a hard part to keep a bandage on. I know what i did was probably all wrong. But, you probably need to address the animal too as well as the wound. I know my guy would have made it much worse, if that stuff wasn't on there.
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Member:
paul303
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 24, 2007 - 1:32 am:
I've had good luck with Alushield. Used it after diligent cleaning and hosing to keep dirt and flies out. I've also had some luck with it on hock sores on geriatric horses that have some trouble with rising.
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Member:
vickiann
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 24, 2007 - 11:18 am:
You can find the Alushield in some of the horse catalogs.
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 24, 2007 - 11:33 am:
Hello Carolyn,
Though we have had other posts about these type products, I am unfamiliar with the use of aluminum for topical wound care. Searching the literature I find one Russian reference that is fairly old and not translated. Reviewing the proceedings of a very recent seminar on innovative wound techniques it is not mentioned. I would be interested on any research information anyone has.
We have treated many wounds such as yours with the recommendations in the long term wound care article and never had such a wound not heal well.
DrO
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Member:
vickiann
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 24, 2007 - 2:10 pm:
If I recall correctly, can only add that the Vet. who recommended the product to me thought it was great post-surgically on smaller animals also, as an alternative to Vet. wrap. At the time I did read up on the product, and believe there was a caution about some possibility of bone problems if the product was used extensively on an animal.
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Member:
cnbreb
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 24, 2007 - 5:46 pm:
Thanks for the discussion on this. It is the Alushield and Aluspray I was seeing advertised.
The following links are the MSDS sheet and the leaflet the company produces for this product.
https://www.neogen.com/AnimalSafety/pdf/MSDS/79100_MSDS.pdf
https://www.neogen.com/AnimalSafety/pdf/ProdInfo/Tech_Bulletins/79100.pdf
The reason for the original inquiry was to seek an alternative "bandage" so I could turn the horse out; however, I think my horse answered my question as to whether or not he should turned out minus a true bandage as he proceeded to catch himself on the cut with his other foot. The wound in on the inside of his left hind foot, which obviously makes him susceptible to knocking it.
I guess he'll have to suck it up and stay in a little longer or at least until the paddock dries up.
Thanks again for the input.
DR O-- Is this something worth keeping in the vet box for cuts higher up on the body? Just a general interest question...I know everyone has certain preferences for managing a wound, but with all the new products out and lack of information it is hard to judge them sometimes. I understand the importance of clinical studies and am very disappointed at how hard it can be to find the information on these products. I know if the product is evaluated by the FDA you can find them (some times) but unless it was once an Rx or someone has published research, the over the counter products can be really difficult!!
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Member:
vickiann
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 24, 2007 - 8:08 pm:
How right you are, Carolyn. Sometimes products sound really terrific and then when you try them you are disappointed!
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Thursday, Oct 25, 2007 - 8:03 am:
I went and studied the above links and, considering the paucity of information available, I would not consider its use at this time. We have recommendations for wound care products in Diseases of Horses » First Aid » First Aid Kit and in the articles on wound care. Those are what I keep in my "box".
DrO
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Member:
cnbreb
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Posted on Thursday, Oct 25, 2007 - 7:15 pm:
Thanks for the input. My only hope in using this product was as a short cut to turning the horse out, but I'd rather it heal to the best of its ability than hinder the progress.
CB
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Friday, Oct 26, 2007 - 6:49 am:
Why not turn your horse for several hours prior to the bandage change then when he comes in you can clean the wound and change the soiled bandage. With a lot of movement and the addition of a bandage you may have a bit more granulation tissue but the aerosol bandage would not have prevented that either. By the way what is in the Dermaclens. I went looking on the internet and did not find any ingredients but the description concerns me for long term care: "3 mild acids" and "debriding action".
DrO
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Member:
vickiann
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Posted on Friday, Oct 26, 2007 - 6:13 pm:
Sometimes there are wounds that are extremely hard to wrap or bandage. One of my guys tore a gaping inch wide hole in his face that was deep and had a hanging flap of skin (which eventually had to fall off). It SHOULD have been stitched but due to when it was discovered, I had to treat it as an open wound. There was a point in time that the Alushield was very helpful with keeping this wound clean and preventing debris from packing down inside of it, which was essential to a good outcome.
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Member:
cnbreb
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Posted on Friday, Oct 26, 2007 - 6:23 pm:
Dr O--
Here is the narrative from Jeffers website:
"An acidic cleaning cream of benzoic, malic and salicyclic organic acids for use on wounds, abrasions, burns and other dermatological conditions. Low pH discourages bacterial and fungal growth. Ideal for chronic, slow-healing wounds and lesions. Non-toxic, non-irritating, odorless and non-staining."
Here is a link I found to Pfizer's site with the description and the MSDS, which doesn't say much.
https://www.pfizerah.com/print_friendly.asp?drug=dc&country=us&lang=en&species=eq &s=/product_overview.asp
I haven't noticed any adverse affects; the cut looks healthy and doesn't appear to be producing a large amount of granular tissue. Hopefully that's a good thing.
CB
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Member:
cnbreb
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Posted on Friday, Oct 26, 2007 - 6:34 pm:
Vicki--
THe good news is I can wrap it and the bandage says in place. Last year, through another injury with my second horse, I learned about the magic of Elastikon. It's expensive as heck, but is a breathable adhesive and elastic bandage. I basically make a band-aid from a six inch section of 4" Elasticon and fold over a 4" square gauze which I place in the middle. The Elastikon sticks well to the hair when dry. I then follow up with a modified foot wrap of vetwrap and duct tape. I only use 1/3 -1/2 a roll and apply it to only the back half of the foot, crossing it under the bulb of the heel. I then use the duct tape as a protective layer on the heel and across the hoof wall and front edge of the vet warp. Even with his stall walking I can get a full 24 to 36 hours out of the bandage, as long as it stays dry
Face bandages are hard for certain! How did your horse do with the spray can near his face?? That must have been a difficult job at best! Glad it worked out well for you!
CB
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Saturday, Oct 27, 2007 - 10:11 am:
Since getting the ingredients of the Dermaclens I have doing research to find a rationale for the use of these three acids on wounds. Salicylate (think Aspercreme) is a rubrifacent when put on the skin so I would have thought it to be irritating in open wounds.
I found several articles of research around 1985 where it appears at first they felt the combination improved burn wound healing when added to a new 5% povidone creme over traditional 10% povidone ointment. Later however it was discovered that it was the change in formulation of the povidone that accounted for the improved rates of healing and decrease bacteria rather than the addition of the acids. It did not seem harmful in the formulations mixed with betadine however some papers describe it as having a proteolytic action. It breaks down protein which may be useful is wounds with a lot of dead debris, which is probably why it was used with burn wounds in experiments, but in a clean wound this may actually be a indication to not use it since the new skin is primarily protein. Since the late 80's it appears wound researchers have lost interest in it.
DrO
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Member:
cnbreb
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Posted on Saturday, Oct 27, 2007 - 6:44 pm:
So does that mean it is safe to use on a wound of this type or should I be using a triple antibiotic instead? Again, I just want use what is in the best interest of healing this wound as quickly as possible and with minimal complications.
CB
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Sunday, Oct 28, 2007 - 8:25 am:
Carolyn,
Whenever I have full skin thickness wounds I follow the recommendations made in the article Diseases of Horses » Skin Diseases, Wounds, and Swellings » Wounds / Burns » Long Term Deep Wound Care.
DrO
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