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  Discussion on RED bruising of the white line?
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Member:
Dres

Posted on Wednesday, Apr 6, 2005 - 7:27 pm:

What would cause severe red bruising of the white line in the toe of a front hoof..? Would this be considered minor laminar tears?
If so, how would you treat it...


On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with SPOTS..
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 9:17 am:

Ahhh...blunt trauma? These red marks are common and if there is no lameness would not consider treatment necessary. If this is a chronic problem or happening under a shoe I would look carefully at my horses ap foot balance: is there too much toe resulting in easy trauma? For more see, Care for Horses » Hoof Care » Care of the Hoof: an Overview.
DrO
Member:
Dres

Posted on Thursday, Apr 7, 2005 - 1:55 pm:

This horse is my gelding that has had all the ''issues'' with his front hoofs.. He has been in the NB shoe for 10 months for the avulsion fracture of the navicular.. My farrier and I both were commenting that the shape of his hoofs were fast becoming square looking, the shape of the shoe ..neither of us were comfortable with this look now..we must have jinx him cus just after that shoeing the horse is lame once again.. We have been doing his shoes now every 4 weeks like clock work, this past shoeing we both decided to get him out of the NB shoes when the farrier pulled the shoe the bruising was there.. It happened in between the two shoeing.. 4 weeks.. I think that is why he is lame, or hoping .. anyway we have put in egg bar shoes for now, I have seen improvement in the lameness the past two weeks , he is not sound yet but better...

Do you think that the NB shoe could add stress to the toe due to the radical break over.? Do you feel there is a time limit as to how long a horse can wear that type of shoe? And should I worry that this will add more permenant insult to the already fragile hoof..?

thanks as always

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with SPOTS..
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 8:54 am:

It shouldn't Ann, an earlier breakover should reduce stress at the toe.However treatment for fractured navicular bone generally also involves an elevated heel, is this the case?

Though I do not have any clients using them, I am not aware that long term use of these shoes causes lameness. No the red alone is not a cause for believing there is some permanant damage. Let us know if this improves in the next few shoeings.
DrO
Member:
Dres

Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 10:43 am:

Yes, his heal on that shoe is slightly wedged...
I will keep you posted on his next shoeing, which i have put off an extra week to give him more growth...

Thanks as always...

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with SPOTS..
Member:
Juliem

Posted on Friday, Apr 8, 2005 - 9:26 pm:

I've had NB shoes on my foundered gelding since they first became available--1998 or 1999 I think. He is and has been sound in the shoes that entire time. It's not the shoe that will cause you problems. That's the science part of the equation. The art is in the application. If your farrier is not putting the shoe on with all the NB principles firmly in mind you're not going to get the benefit you would otherwise. Is your farrier Natural Balance certified? Has he read the material that is presented by Gene Ovenick? Has he been to the website? All questions I would ask before letting a farrier try to apply an NB shoe. And, unless you have radiographs, your farrier must guess where the tip of the coffin bone is and where the breakover should be. He can make an informed guess with the principles of the Natural Horse trim, but best are radiographs (x rays.
I'm a believer in the shoes as well as the system. I now have all my horses in NB shoes on the front to ease the breakover and offer some additional protection to the tip of the coffin bone on our rocky mountain trails.
Member:
Vickiann

Posted on Saturday, Apr 9, 2005 - 1:54 pm:

My Paint horse was diagnosed with "probable navicular," a few years ago, and his conformation plus past uses probably contributed to the problem. As per the diagnosing Vet's directions, I had him shoed in front with his heels raised for some time (had to bute him two days as he adjusted to the change in angles)and that seemed to work well, but after awhile the days of lameness again began to come and go with greater frequency. I had had him on a maintenance dose of CortaFlx and changed it to a daily loading-size dose after discussions with my Vet. (I had noted great differences in this horse's ability to get around (flying and gliding!) on the original day 8 or 9 of the loading dose). The dose called for on the label is for an 1100 pound horse and he is probably 1250. Also, when horses have "greater problems they can sometimes benefit from a larger amount" (per conversations with manufacturer) and "cannot do any harm" to the horse to give some extra. While being in shoes for a long time, his heels seemed to be getting worse and not getting quality growth. These were not special shoes other than that they raised the heel/angles. Around the same time I upped his CortaFlx dose to a constant daily loading dose, I had his shoes (experimentally, per Vet.) pulled (had to bute him 2 - 3 days as he adjusted to the change) and he has been in pain less often than before ever since. Another thing I discovered with this horse is that if he gets anything caught in his foot (small twig, acorn, etc.), it will make him extremely lame. He is not stall kept (can come and go from pasture as he pleases) but seems to benefit from having his feet cleaned out DAILY.
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Saturday, Apr 9, 2005 - 5:02 pm:

Ann I am surprised to hear you say slightly wedged, navicular fractures are usually markedly wedged. Was he more wedged in the past.
DrO
Member:
Dres

Posted on Saturday, Apr 9, 2005 - 7:37 pm:

Yes, last year the UCD vet put a higher wedge *don't know the degree* then he has on today... we kept him in the wedge for about 3-4 months then the heels started to crumble so we took him out of it.. he was going fine.. I know an avulsion fracture of the navicular can really never mend, do you think he should be wearing a wedge always ? If so I guess we are going to have to address what the wedge pad does to the heels of the horse...

I tested him today, he is still short tracking left on that hoof, still improvement from when he was in the NB shoes and seeing the RED bruising...

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with SPOTS..
Member:
Vickiann

Posted on Saturday, Apr 9, 2005 - 8:23 pm:

Cannot relate the "red bruising" to this total situation other than to observe that when the farrier takes a risky amount of hoof wall away (corrective work or an accident) this will happen. I have had this, but knew in advance due to communication with my farrier that it would because of what was being attempted, and never had lameness, though some tenderness on hard (asphalt) surfaces. Navicular situations are hard to deal with because they tend to come and go and must be treated for pain as they arise, and if the pain synDrOme worsens must consider whether changes and adjustments (angles, shoes, etc.) should be attempted. My 18-year old Paint horse (after ups and downs over the past few years) has been doing well for several months. Good luck . . .
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