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  Discussion on Riding in deep sand
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Member:
Wolfydoc

Posted on Monday, Apr 25, 2005 - 12:22 am:

Hi all,

Can someone please convince my friends that riding their horses in deep sand, especially faster than a walk, is NOT a "great way to condition your horse." Am I wrong in desperately trying to convince them that this is asking for a tendon injury?? I just can't believe how widespread and deeply ingrained in horse owners this myth is.

We all live in the Reno, NV area, and there is plenty of sand all over, and it is especially deep around beautiful Washoe Lake, a favorite equestrian spot. Locals seem to love to take their horses onto the beach and haul butt down the shores of the lake. As Vice President of our Northern Nevada Gaited Horse Club, I would LOVE something in writing to convince my friends that I am not just being a worry-wart, or an overly conservative vet/horse mom. (I did a search for "deep sand" and read the post on deep mud cantering, as well as the entire article on flexor tendinitis, which all but states that riding in deep sand can result in tendon injury, but I need it in clear concise black & white language in order to convert this crowd!)

Thanks as always for this awesome site.

Cindy
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Monday, Apr 25, 2005 - 8:05 am:

I went to the literature and do not find any studies for you to take to your friends Cindy. The general recommendations about being cautious about sand with horses that have flexor tendinitis comes from the fact that as the heels DrOp there is extra stress put on the flexor tendons and soft ground may not support the heels well. That said I know lots of folks who take a trip to the beach each fall and gallop full out down the beach without incident. Let me ask you, do you know someone who has injured a tendon under such circumstances?
DrO
Member:
Christos

Posted on Monday, Apr 25, 2005 - 8:53 am:

Cynthia,
The horse I was talking about in this other post was eventually sold for meat 3 months later, as he got destroyed beyond hope.
He was the most beautiful TB stallion I had ever seen, both in body and mind. A formidable competitor (he won seven races), at the same time easy and sweet as a puppy. His registered name was Akatavlitos, which, ironically, means indefatigable, indestructible.
Member:
Wolfydoc

Posted on Tuesday, Apr 26, 2005 - 11:33 pm:

DrO,
No I do not know someone whose horse was injured riding in deep sand. However, would you agree with my general impression that a number of owners don't even know their horses are lame until much later after the initiating event, if at all?

My best friend, who has been riding for many many years, did not know her horse was lame until I observed her riding the horse myself, and she had ridden the horse on the beach many many times in the past. Who knows when this horse injured her suspensory (final diagnosis)? No, it wasn't a tendon, but point being that many people don't recognize lameness especially when they ride one afternoon and put the horse out to pasture for the next several days or more.

And I do agree with you that many people, including my friends, ride their horses in deep sand and have no apparent problems. Go figure. I do know for a fact how horrible my lower legs felt when I once started a backpacking trip on a beach and after one hour I walked back to my truck and DrOve 8 hours back home! And I was in great shape, no joking! Of course, we're not built exactly like horses.


So what do you recommend for healthy horses DrO? Stay out of deep sand or just be cautious about it while not avoiding it entirely?

Christos, your story is absolutely horrible and I believe there is some bad karma for this person(s) at some point in his/her life.

Cindy
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Wednesday, Apr 27, 2005 - 7:50 am:

I would stay with the "be cautious about it". I would try to hang down where the sand is wet close to the water, it provides better support.
DrO
Member:
Vickiann

Posted on Wednesday, Apr 27, 2005 - 12:14 pm:

A few years ago while conditioning a horse for the "Big Scrub Trail Ride," (there is lots of deep sand out there in the Ocala National Forest) I over-did the work in sand and had an injury, so was unable to use that horse for that ride, though he was okay in a couple of weeks. I took him to a nearby leg and foot specialist who said the injury happened mostly because my farrier at the time had his rear heels too low and toes to long, causing stress as described by Dr. O. Shoes to raise his heels were put on the back (not that this type of shoeing helps much in sand, but does on grass surface) and he was fine. In time, I was able to remove the shoes, and by keeping the toes short enough and heels up, have had no further problems with stress injuries and sand work. Here in central Florida we have lots of deep sand (in fact my farm is on what is called a "Florida sand hill environment" and it is GREAT for strengthening, but one must use common sense and take the horse's current condition into account. Don't try to do too much at one time until you have the conditioning in place. We go out for hours and mix up walking, trotting, galloping and sometimes even running in the sand with no ill effect. Riders here are more careful to slow down when in deep sand going down hills than on the flat or going up hill. Whatever surface, the horse's current condition should be considered, but probably more important in deep sand.
Member:
Lisamg

Posted on Thursday, Apr 28, 2005 - 5:30 pm:

Cynthia;
I'm from Michigan, and although many don't realize it, we have a great deal of sand here. I do distance riding, mostly within the State and one can count on sand in almost every event. My biggest concern with deep sand is interference marks as if your horse is prone to them, they will be more likely to occur in the deep going. There have been some "old timers" in our sport that beleive that deep sand is best either walked through or run through. Trotting is just asking for trouble. (i.e. interference marks) Personally I have not seen many injuries (and you know I'm in the sport where your more likely to see stress type injuries) due to sand. However, that said, sand could be a danger to an already stressed horse as far as metabolic distress is concerned. The extra work it takes for a mounted horse to move fast in deep sand is more than most people realize. If they doubt it, try running in it with a back pack on. Exhausting.

As with anything else though, if you condition in it, as we here in Michigan are kind of forced to do, the horses learn to adapt. It's the out of state riders who come to compete here that feel it the worst. (or their horses, I should say). Most have no idea how tough our trails can be. Anywhere where sand and hills are combined with humidity is a challenge.

JMO
Lisa
Member:
Christos

Posted on Friday, Apr 29, 2005 - 5:41 pm:

There's another factor one needs to take into account with amateur races, and this is speed. Deep sand is significantly slower than firm footing, and this is an important safety benefit.
Firm footing plus racing mentality equals full speed, and that, I believe, would cause many more injuries -if not deaths- than deep sand, to horses and people alike.
Of course, it would be better if we'd leave racing to professionals, but go figure with these guys...
Member:
Mrose

Posted on Friday, Apr 29, 2005 - 6:24 pm:

You are right re: racing, Christos; however, when I was young my friends and I loved to race our horses at any given chance...sometimes on the beach (ocean) but usually on dirt roads. Luckily, none of us or our horses was ever hurt. When you are young, you never think about the possibility of getting hurt, and it was a lot of fun and a good way to win a quarter from your friends if you happened to win. The horses seemed to enjoy it, too. We would also bet on who could make all the jumps in an arena after the shows, etc. I always jumped bareback because I had a western saddle and didn't want to get impaled on the horn. Good thing my parents never caught me doing these things!
Member:
Lisamg

Posted on Monday, May 2, 2005 - 5:29 pm:

It still amazes me the things the young get away with. I can think of so many "stupid" horsey things I did when I was young .... that I wouldn't DREAM of doing now. I must admit, I too was guilty of racing my first horse too. Many moons ago. Now a race to finish on an endurance ride is not my favorite thing. I've even gone as far as picking a number from one to ten with my oponent(s) to avoid a race.

But Cristos is right, if people are going to race (anyway), hopefully the sand will save them if they fall. Also one of my favorite things about sand is that the holes auto-fill themselves, no worries about that.

Lisa
Member:
Christos

Posted on Monday, May 2, 2005 - 7:17 pm:

Lisa, I can think of so many stupid horsey things I did when I was a kid that I DO dream of doing now.....
Member:
Jnmteal

Posted on Thursday, May 26, 2005 - 12:18 am:

What if your horse doesnt want to walk in the sand? Its a struggle to get my ex Gymkhanna horse to just trott in the riverbed! This last time I rode her I deided to just let her run and she actually seemed very happy to actually be able to just go! it also made her mor manageable on my way home!!Ive been toldby horse trainers that to break her of this I should let her run untill she stops and then make her run more so that she gets the idea that its easier to just be controlled. any Ideas?
Member:
Wolfydoc

Posted on Monday, May 30, 2005 - 12:40 am:

Jennifer,
I am not a horse trainer by any means, but speaking from some experience and LOTS of studying of top notch trainers like Clinton Anderson, I disagree with the trainers who told you to just let her run. Even if you ask her to run some more. It seems to me, just my opinion, that your horse has some issues with respecting you enough to go in the gait YOU ask her to, and stay in that gait. There are some very basic exercises that can be done to communicate to her that she needs to 1) respect you, and 2)listen to and obey your request to be in a certain gait, regardless of what SHE wants to do. I think the only thing you accomplish by allowing her to run when she insists on doing so is teach her that she can dictate the gait (speed) she wants, when she wants. In other words, she's taking YOU for a ride, not vice versa.

For the immediate future, when she tries this behavior, you could also try putting her energy to good use for something YOU want her to do, such as practicing serpentines or circles at a trot or even loping, so she gets the idea she has to listen to her rider, that her rider is in control not her, and at the same time you get to practice softening her to the bit. Anything but just letting her take control of the situation.

Cindy
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