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  Discussion on Last foal died from c. perfrigens
Author Message
New Member:
rlrhorse

Posted on Friday, Mar 7, 2008 - 3:01 pm:

My mare is due to in 3 months, and I am unsure how to treat the foal upon its arrival due to this mare's last foal dying from C. Perfrigens; I believe type C, but I don't remember for sure. I do remember the culture said it had the beta toxin.
I reviewed the suggestions given in the article with my vet, but he said the problem with the oral metronidazole is that it taste bad and might keep the foal from nursing well. He suggested IM gent and pcn. Ouch! He didn't seem familiar with the antitoxin or the toxoid. Are these the ones formulated for cattle? He also mentioned maybe doing an infusion with hyperimmunized serum, which would protect the foal from salmonella and other diseases too.

Since having a wittnessed birth is unlikely with my work schedule, I'm leaning toward just giving the probiotics containing the s. boulardi and maybe the antitoxin if I can get some more information on it.

What are you thoughts?
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Saturday, Mar 8, 2008 - 5:07 pm:

Hello Regina,
I wanted to research some information on this so I will reply when I get back into the office Monday morn.
DrO
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Monday, Mar 10, 2008 - 10:47 am:

Hello Regina,
To answer your direct question: yes the vaccine and antitoxin products that have been experimented with are the ruminant products.

All of the recommendations in the article are controversial Regina and not supported by research but from anecdotal field reports. The extra-specie use of vaccines and biologicals is fraught with dangers of increased reaction rates. The preventive use of probiotics in clostridial enterocolitis is also controversial. The reason for presenting them is that this disease occurs as a outbreak situation that can effect a large number of foals on a farm and there are no recognized prevention or therapeutic strategies that work consistently. For some who find themselves in this position the risk vs benefit becomes tipped in favor of the experimental use of these treatment/prevention strategies.

I am not sure I would resort to such experimental techniques with your history of one case a year ago. Given the constraints you give of a unattended birth, you only have one clear preventive strategy and that is the mare be maintained in a very clean environment. I would not recommend pretreatment of the foal with gentamicin as this is associated with clostridial shedding. I would try to be prepared for the next case however with frequent monitoring and having the product Biosponge (smectite) on hand. There has been some research that I think is stronger than what has been done with Probiotics that it decreases the severity of Cl perfringens enterocolitis. For more on this see, Diseases of Horses » Colic, Diarrhea, GI Tract » Diarrhea in Horses » Initial Evaluation of Colitis in Horses » Discussion on
Lost mare within 16 hours - Severe Diarrhea Colitis. I will be placing this information in the article.
DrO
New Member:
rlrhorse

Posted on Monday, Mar 10, 2008 - 11:40 am:

Thank you so much Dr. O! As a nurse, I do hate the idea of giving antibiotics without sure reason, and as the article indicates, antibiotics can actually make the foal more at risk for infectious diarrhea. I already have the biosponge on hand (I purchased last year after reading the above sited article in case any of my other horses became ill after the foal died and the cultures came back).

The manufacturer of the biosponge said I could give it as a preventative after the foal had consumed colostrum. Do you recommend this, or could it cause problems as well? I know if given too soon, it can cause the antibodies in the colostrum not to be absorbed.

I plan to have the mare foal outside in a clean pasture, since the weather will already be quite warm (I live in TX). The last foal was borne in a stall, which I had kept quite clean, but obviously not clean enough to keep out spore forming bacteria.

Would it be of any use to vaccinate the mare with the clostridium vaccine, so she could pass the antibodies on to the foal in the milk, rather than risking vaccinating the foal at birth?

And one last question. Sorry to be so long winded, but I've been worrying over this for a while now. My vet had also spoke of giving some hyperimmune serum, I'm not sure if he meant orally or IV. Would this be of any benefit, or does it include risks as well?

Thank you so much for taking the time to research this for me. I have read and researched this disease until I totally confused myself on what I should do. What's that doctors like to say about us nurses? "You know just enough to be dangerous." Well, that's me:>)

I do have to say, of all the reading I have done in the past year, this site had the best information of all that I found. Thank you for such an informative, helpful site!
Regina Robertson
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Tuesday, Mar 11, 2008 - 6:36 am:

Thank you for the kudos Regina.

There seems to be some confusion in your post. Vaccinating a foal at birth would not be effective as protection takes time and usually a second vaccination (the primary series). When the article discusses vaccination it refers to vaccinating the mare beginning at least 2 months prior to birth. Unless there are clostridial antibodies in they hyperimmune serum, I don't see how it would help with this problem.

I am uncertain about the effects of the Biosponge in a healthy newborn foal.
DrO
New Member:
rlrhorse

Posted on Tuesday, Mar 11, 2008 - 10:36 am:

Oh yes, I did get confused on the vaccination of the mare vs. antitoxin for the foal. From what I had read on the web about vaccinating the mare, risk of reaction, mostly abscess formation was the concern. Is this correct? Should I also be concerned about risk to the foal if I decide to vaccinate the mare?

I am unsure if the serum would contain clostridal antibdodies are not. I assumed it did, since my vet recommended it, but he hasn't been the most up to date on this disease, as it seems to be fairly uncommon here in Central Texas.

Thank you again for your help with this very scary disease,
Regina
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Tuesday, Mar 11, 2008 - 9:38 pm:

Yes an abscess is the most likely complication and through fever and possible seeding infection into the blood it could potentially harm a pregnancy.
DrO
New Member:
rlrhorse

Posted on Wednesday, Mar 12, 2008 - 11:43 am:

Well, I was considering risking an abscess, but not sepsis. I guess my plan will be to take a close watch and see approach and be prepared with the Biosponge on hand. I may talk with the manufacturer of Biosponge again and see if anything has changed since I talked with them last year about giving it a foal prophylactically. I just wish I could be more proactive in preventing this from happening again.
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