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  Discussion on Rear Leg Raising (problem?)
Author Message
Member:
marti

Posted on Tuesday, Nov 25, 2008 - 12:39 pm:

I recently purchased a 9 year old gelding. He is a beautiful mover and seems to have no problems when working. He does have small feet and turns out on the front. That part does not bother me, but I noticed that when I have him on the cross ties to brush or saddle or whatever, the entire time he is there he is picking his rear legs up and pulling them toward his belly, first the left and then the right. He does this almost continually and then will cock one leg in a resting position. I have not seen him do this in his stall. The previous owner said that he did it all the time (she owned him 4 years)and that she always considered him to be stretching. I am concerned that this may be a stifle or hock problem and am wondering what opinion Dr. "O" and others might have. Has anyone experienced this? He shows no signs of lameness or stiffness when he moves.
Thanks
Member:
corinne

Posted on Tuesday, Nov 25, 2008 - 12:57 pm:

I don't think this is abnormal. My arab loves to stretch his back legs while in cross ties. He also picks up his feet when I walk by one with a hoof pick. He is one of the smarter Arabs. Be careful however because in one stretch my gumby lifted his leg over my head stretching it then lost his balance and fell over in the cross ties almost taking out my husband and scaring himself half to death. I am now very careful to redirect his attention when he is stretching and I pick up his feet to pick them out instead of allowing him to do this. Moral of the story is if he is stretching, which I think he is, just be careful your horse doesn't fall over in the process.
Member:
kathrynr

Posted on Tuesday, Nov 25, 2008 - 5:08 pm:

Hi Marti,
My QH does a similar thing, and has done it increasingly over the 4 years I have had him.
I was given a medical diagnosis of Shivers. There is an article here that Dr.O has under Diseases of the Upper Rear Limb,Lameness, Tying Up Shivers, EPSM.
Now I certainly don't want to suggest he has any of these things but you may want to read up on it for your reference.
Originally my farrier had told me it was in his head and was a nervous tic but my vet feels otherwise and has recently suggested we do a muscle biopsy to confirm exactly what the cause is. He does not do it while riding just when he is still on the cross ties as yours does or at times while grazing.
Kat
Member:
scooter

Posted on Tuesday, Nov 25, 2008 - 5:24 pm:

Hank does this while he's eating his "grain" I take it as a sign of pleasure or anticipation. He NEVER does it otherwise and is not lame. I'm not sure, but I think if he had shivers it would show up in other ways. If he does it ONLY in cross ties, he may be anticipating brushing or riding.
Member:
rtrotter

Posted on Tuesday, Nov 25, 2008 - 6:43 pm:

Marti,
Some horses have some very strange habits. I like to see my horses stretch. One of my horses would stretch her back legs out as soon as I snapped the lead shank on her to take her out of the stall every day. This was a mare that was turned out almost 24/7 and only came inside to eat her breakfast and get ready to jog or train.

My two year old stretches at least once before I put the harness on him, he stretches his front legs out so much that his nose almost touches the floor.

I think this is an enjoyable experience for them and it may release endorphins so it makes it pleasurable for them. It also may be a sign that his back has a kink in it. I would think though that he would also show it in his movements, since he does not I'd say if you are really worried get your vet to check him out.

Horses do a lot of things to help themselves. I think sometimes we humans forget to listen to them.

Rachelle
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Tuesday, Nov 25, 2008 - 7:18 pm:

There are certainly some neuromuscular problems that present similar to this (for example see Shivers) but I don't know whether there is some "pathology" behind this or not. It sounds like a rather benign behavior and so I personally would not spend a bunch of money on further diagnostics. Does this seem to be worsening?
DrO
Member:
ekaufman

Posted on Tuesday, Nov 25, 2008 - 11:17 pm:

Hi Marti,

I rescued a horse that was diagnosed with stringhalt at 25. I also have horses that do all kinds of stretches like Rachelle describes (and one who stretches her legs on the gate like a jogger).

If it were me, I would wait to see if there were a problem before worrying; for example, if he seems lame, or if the behavior begins to seem involuntary (he starts banging his legs, etc.). Any serious condition will insist on investigation by, well, becoming more serious, at which point it will certainly cost money and interfere with your pleasure in your horse, and possibly your horse's pleasure in his daily routine.

He sounds lovely and fun. Post a picture and let us know how you get on.
Member:
frances

Posted on Wednesday, Nov 26, 2008 - 5:41 am:

Hi Marti,

I've had a thread ("snatching up hind") on here recently concerning my horse's similar behaviour to your horse's. It's probably time I posted an update.

Shivers was first ruled in and then out by vet, and soreness found in various areas (back, stifle, hock) which could possibly explain it.

After the first two were treated, the problem became much milder, but has not disappeared and once in a while seems quite severe again...so I'm still not sure.

Do your horse's hinds make straining, spastic movements when he's holding them up?
Member:
ajudson1

Posted on Wednesday, Nov 26, 2008 - 8:25 am:

I have quarter horse mare who used to do that constantly. Worse was picking up her foot, she would jerk her front feet up towards her belly and never relax, and jerk her hind feet out when picked up. When I wasn't cleaning her feet or trimming, she just did weird things with her back legs. She's quit doing it now for the most part and I think it was just a bad habit part of being nervous. (she was a rescue purchase, starved the first 6 months of her life)

On the other hand I have an Arab mare who does like cat stretches when leaving her stall, and when being saddled she will "park out" and I used to worry it was a pain issue. (She also groans every time anyone gets OFF her!) Never found any pain issues, and both horses seem healthy in all areas.

Have you tried a few days of Bute to see if it disappears? That would suggest pain if it did, and you could then spend money on other tests.

I don't think it sounds serious more likely a weird thing he does. Let us know what you find out of course.
Member:
marti

Posted on Friday, Nov 28, 2008 - 9:15 am:

Thank you to all who have responded. Your input makes me feel much better. I did have magnetic therapy done n the gelding last Thursday. He did have many tight spots. I had never had this done before and I am not sure I believe in it (I am from the old school). "Heck I am old." Anyway I figured if it could help it was worth the cost. Since he can not talk, I don't know if he feels better or not. It did however have no effect on the raising of the rear legs. I paid special attention yesterday when I was working him in the arena. I just stood still and sat on him in one place for an extended length of time. No leg lifting occurred. I am now thinking it is more of a habit and is just a weird thing he does. It certainly has not worsened and I can live with it. Thanks again to all and I will post a picture of him soon.
Member:
marti

Posted on Tuesday, Dec 9, 2008 - 1:44 pm:

I am still some what worried about the back legs. I do not see him doing any of the leg raising while in the pasture, but when in his stall eating or just standing or when tied he is always resting alternate legs. When I saddle him or brush him and he is tied he constantly raises alternate legs and pulls them up and also wiggles his nose in an odd way. I have been working him for Trail Class competition and see no signs of any problem while riding. He moves real good and has no problem in a counter canter or pivot. Please keep me posted if anyone has the same indications. Typical leg resting position, when not raising them.
Member:
rtrotter

Posted on Tuesday, Dec 9, 2008 - 3:25 pm:

Marti,

Your horse is gorgeous, but from the picture I can see he is standing underneath himself in front and behind. Since the posted picture cuts off his feet, would it be possible to post one of his legs and his feet ( a side view and a front view). I can't tell if he is wearing shoes or not.

The funny part of this is I have a two year old that does the exact same thing. I never see him standing with all his weight on all four legs and he snatches them up with very little urging. I have had 2 vets, the chiropractor and the acupuncturist tell me they can find nothing wrong. But with me when my gut says there is a problem, there usually is one.

I just did a serum blood test for EPM, but have not gotten it back yet. This alternating leg thing does not bother him jogging, training or racing. But he does have a tendency to hang on the right line more than what I would want him to do. I'll wait to see what the blood test shows, meanwhile he is going to his second qualifier on Friday at the Meadowlands, with the hope of him being able to race the following week.

Rachelle
Member:
twadwis

Posted on Tuesday, Dec 9, 2008 - 4:30 pm:

I too would like to see those feet, if possible the feet at ground level from the side and front plus of course sole shots. You have described two things that would bother me especially considering his 'odd' behavior, small feet and toeing out. Those, coupled with the way he stands should question heel pain....we are so used to narrow contracted heels many people don't recognize that as a possible problem.
He sure is a pretty boy.
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