This is an archived Horseadvice.com Discussion. The parent article and menus are available on the navigation menu below:
HorseAdvice.com » Diseases of Horses » Urinary System » Kidney Disease and Failure in the Horse »
  Discussion on High creatinine levels in a Fjord horse
Author Message
New Member:
sampson

Posted on Monday, Jan 5, 2009 - 12:42 pm:

Dr. O & All Fellow Horse Advisors,
Our very special gentle giant has a kidney issue. I have read all your articles and still have questions and am hoping for some answers or at least some good advice. Here is his history so far as we know.

April 2005 he entered our lives. Trojan is a very large Fjord horse, 15.2 and around 1150 lbs, much larger than the breed standard. He is 18 years old now. On his initial vet exam the vet thought he might have a thyroid problem, but the blood work came back in normal ranges, by July of 2006 however he was showing stronger signs of a thyroid problem. He came to the very edge of founder but showed no rotation of coffin bone and once his hypo-throid was diagnosed he was placed on the proper meds to help (thyro-L) he gets a small dose everyday. His body condition improved he lost some weight and seemed to generally feel much better.

He was however kept in a small paddock, to prevent the other horses from running him off his feed, which was a 1/4 scoop a day just enough to give him something to take the thyroid medicine and his hoof supplement. He had terrible hoof rot, we cultured his feet and found no less than two fungus' and a bacterial infection. After much soaking and good care, he is now the strongest barefoot horse you've ever seen. Gravel crunching, seriously.

At this point due to a nasty divorce he came into my care on a permanent basis and was moved to a big pasture with lots of grass and friends to play with, his mood perked up remarkably and he seems so happy and healthy.


Recently, we were doing his yearly dental and I happened to notice a slight, very slight, yellow tint to his inside lip. Testing has shown a high level of creatinine 4.1 to be exact. The blood was pulled on December 18th, my vet has recommended a re-test which will happen this week January 8th 2009. He is over weight but not obese, his body condition has improved since moving to a large pasture and has friends to romp and play with but still needs conditioning.

Blood results show everything else is in normal ranges except his creatine at 4.1 and his potassium at 7.8.

We do not know the cause of this condition and if we hadn't noticed the yellow tint would be riding him and no one would ever guess there is a problem, he runs, romps, eats, and loves with vigor.

My questions are:
1. Is there anyway to help lower his creatinine level through either diet, medication, herbs or exercise and better body condition?
2. His feed and supplement regiment are as follows:
All the grass he can eat, 1/4 scoop of Nutrena light balance, a diabetic feed, 1/2 to
3/4 scoop of soaked beet pulp, one flake of a good quality grass hay, which has some clover, and fescue mixed in. He often times does not eat the hay, as there is abundant grass. There are only two horses on the farm and they get to eat all the grass themselves. He gets a small scoop of Biotin, Corta-flex, a salt and electrolyte powder, also a scoop of transfer factor an immune booster with some added vitamins and omega fatty acids, and anti-oxidents.
3. Can he be ridden for short periods to help his conditioning? He appears eager and shows no signs of feeling ill.

Any advice you can impart will be greatly appreciated, he is a very special horse that we want to be in our lives for as long as possible and are willing to do whatever we can to ensure his longevity.
Sincerely, Teresa
Member:
klowe

Posted on Monday, Jan 5, 2009 - 2:26 pm:

Hi Teresa- welcome to HA. I can't give you advice on the creatinine level, but I'm a med tech and I can tell you that vet specimens are almost never handled ideally, particularly those drawn in the field. Specimens where the serum or plasma is not separated from the red blood cells promptly will almost always have high potassium. This can also lower glucose levels. Other tests can be affected, but those two are the most often seen once vet specimens get to the lab. (We also see it frequently in human samples!)

Kathy
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Tuesday, Jan 6, 2009 - 6:20 am:

Welcome Teresa,
Can you give me the units of the creatinine value and what your labs normals are for horses? Often these values are reported in mg/dl but not always. High creatinine does not cause tissues to yellow so the two facts need to be separated. Is there any yellowness to the whites of the eyes?

In general at this point I would wait to see if the high creatinine value repeats but must say as a single persistently high value with no other clinical signs or lab indication of kidney disease I would not be worried about it much. I would expect heavily muscled horses to have a slightly higher value of creatinine. IF continued concern about kidney function exists a simple UA that includes specific gravity should answer this question.

I agree with Kathy about the high potassium (and low glucose) value of equine lab samples. When found with no concurrent disease it is a frequent artifact due to the time the blood spent in the tube.
DrO
New Member:
sampson

Posted on Tuesday, Jan 6, 2009 - 12:45 pm:

Dr. O,
The lab values are indeed mg/dl and their normal range is .7-2.2, thus my concern with Trojan's 4.1 level.

There did not seem to be any yellowness in the whites of the eyes the day we noticed his lip coloring but I am going to take another good look at those eyes today and I'll report if there is yellowing. I thought the yellow tinting would have been related to liver function but both his AST and GGT levels sit smack in the middle of this labs normal ranges. Could the drugs given during the dental for sedation have caused it? My vet says no.

My vet is coming to pull another blood sample on Thursday and have me get a "clean catch" urine sample. What will a UA show that the blood work does not?

Thanks so much, Teresa
New Member:
sampson

Posted on Tuesday, Jan 6, 2009 - 12:50 pm:

Kathy,
Thanks for the info on taking the field blood sample. I will ask my vet about taking him to a facility where the test can be checked on site rather than having to wait. Usually on Thursdays he takes it straight to the University after seeing me so it gets there pretty quick. Although with the first sample it did sit around a day or so with the holiday and all.
Thanks much, Teresa
Member:
klowe

Posted on Tuesday, Jan 6, 2009 - 2:50 pm:

Teresa, I have had blood drawn on one of my horses. I put it in the refrigerator for around 3 hours before I could get to work and centrifuge it, and the potassium level was normal...but a whole day or more would have a definite impact, refrigerated or not. If you (or anyone) is wanting a glucose level, have it drawn in a sodium fluoride (gray-top)tube if it isn't going to be processed within a half-hour or so; The NaFl prevents the red cells from metaboizing glucose and giving a falsely lowered reading. However, as far as I know, a processing delay would not particularly affect creatinine.

Also, it's important to remember that normal ranges are averages, and that there will always be healthy individuals with readings outside normal ranges. I wouldn't jump to conclusions on the basis of one test, for one of my animals or myself, for that matter.

Good luck with your boy! He sounds like he has a good home.

Kathy
New Member:
sampson

Posted on Tuesday, Jan 6, 2009 - 4:06 pm:

Kathy,
Thanks for the kind words of encouragement! It's funny, Trojan was bought at a local sale by a friend of mine, who liked the idea of having a horse more than she liked spending time with him. She footed the bill but I developed a bond with him while rehabilitating his hooves.

When her husband decided he was too expensive to pay barn board and could get more for him at a meat sale. I panicked called the wife and we kidnapped Trojan. I began looking for someone to take him, while he was hidden away at a foster home, who would understand his needs and give him a real home. He went to Debra, under the advice of an acquaintance. I never met Debra, just knew her farm was nice and was told she would give him a good home. Two months later, Deborah called me to see if I knew any history on Trojan and we spoke on the phone.

Mean time where my horse,Sampson, was boarding the spring dried up in his pasture with no way to water him. He was barn bound. Debra offered me and my little haflinger/welsh mutt a home and now we are one big happy family and Trojan and Sampson are reunited and Debra and I are great friends. I really believe that somehow Trojan made that happen. He is a truly unique and special horse. Debra and I both love him so.

Cross fingers that the blood test on Thursday show improvement, I have high hopes, both you and Dr. O made us both feel a little better about his levels, perhaps it's just his norm.


Really glad we found this site it is awesome!!!

Best, Teresa
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Wednesday, Jan 7, 2009 - 9:40 am:

The article on acute and chronic renal failure explains the importance of the specific gravity of the urine Teresa.
DrO
Home Page | Top of Page | Join Us!
Horseadvice.com is a BBB Accredited Business. Click for the BBB Business Review of this Horse Training in Stokesdale NC