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  Discussion on Skin condition in horses face
Author Message
New Member:
annes77

Posted on Monday, Apr 2, 2012 - 1:57 am:

Hello,

My name is Anne and I registered to this forum because we have a problem in the barn.

In february last year two horses showed the first symptoms. The white/pink skin on the muzzle and around the eyes first turns red, a little swollen and then becomes scabby. When the scabs fall off the skin is pink and hairless. One of them also had pastern dermatitis. They had this until may.

This year, also in february, 7 horses (including the two from last year) got the same symptoms. Some of them also have pastern dermatitis. The rash on their faces became better after only one to two weeks, but now in March it started all over again.

6 of the horses are outside 24/7 and live in a very muddy pasture. One horse is inside during the night and outside in a pasture that is also quite muddy. This horse has only a very little area of pink skin. The pastures they use in autumn/winter and spring are almost always muddy (except when there is snow).

I checked how the weather has been and in last year it was very cold and snow on the ground in February. In March and April there was no rain, but snow melting.
This year in February the weather was cold and sunny. In March it was mostly sunny and warm.

On March 15th I realized something in the haylage. Some plant that they did not eat because it had very hard stems. They most certainly came in contact with it or also could have eaten the leafs. Since it was brown, I could not determine what it was, but could be st johns worth or something else. The plant was in the haylage the following days. It was cloudy and one day it rained. After that it was sunny and the rash came back.

We had the vet out and she took some samples: Tested for mites, EHV3, bacteria and ringworm. All tests were negative except a modest growth of staphyloccocus aureus. The vet said that this bacteria always is there and could not be the reason. She presumes that they got a contact dermatitis of something in the hay or in the pasture. Unfortunately we can not test this since the barn owner is not willing to change the haylage. Everything else in the pasture is all the same since many years.

I asked the vet about photosensitivity due to something in the food ( I told her about the st johns worth), but she did not find it plausible since the sun is not very intense. We live in Sweden where UV index is under 2 during winter.

My questions:
Could it be photosensitivity anyway?
Could it be mud fever in the face although the areas do not come in contact with the mud and it rained extremely little?
Maybe a combination of both?
Is there anything else we should or can test for?

Hope you can help me finding out what kind of desease this is.
Thanks
Best regards
Anne
Member:
lsweeney

Posted on Monday, Apr 2, 2012 - 4:50 pm:

Anne - I had a mare that had pastern dermatitis and negative on the skin scrapings. She is susceptible to rain rot during the winter/spring, and typically will have spots in the mane, underbelly, between the legs, etc. In the past, I would just scrape off the scabs, and they would dry out, and go away.

On the pastern, though, it hung around forever, and eventually started to go up the leg, and got me concerned. The vet gave me some stuff with tea oil in it, that really didn't do much.

In the end, this was the regimen that worked:

Hose down the legs and soften all of the scabs.
Remove the scabs.
Clean with Betadine.
Rub antibiotic ointment into the areas.
Cover with an antiseptic cream of some kind, Novasan or Privasan.
Cover with a thick coating of Desitin or Balmex.

You can leave this on for several days, which is nice if you are busy. So it is not so labor intensive.

The ointments won't let any dirt get to the skin.

Now if the mud is reaching the areas, you may want to wrap the legs to protect them from the mud/water washing off the above.
Member:
lsweeney

Posted on Monday, Apr 2, 2012 - 6:16 pm:

Also, my mare that gets rain rot has had it in different places every year, and it looks like they can get it on the face as well:

The constant dampness of the skin (usually over the withers, back and rump, where the water tends to pool, as well as on the face and lower limbs) causes damage to the skin, which allows the bacteria's spores ("zoospores" -- dormant state) to germinate, much like watering seeds to stimulate growth.

https://www.petplace.com/horses/rain-rot/page1.aspx

I would think with multiple horses involved that it eliminates most of your immune diseases, allergies, etc.

Another thought is Onchocerciasis.

https://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/71804.htm
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Monday, Apr 2, 2012 - 8:24 pm:

Hello Anne,
I disagree with the thought that Staph cannot cause skin disease, in fact I think it is a common cause of grease heel and that there are two mechanisms by which this happens. One is damage to the tissue by the organism and the other is a allergic reaction to the metabolites from non-infectious staph. With as many horses as you have affected allergic reaction seems unlikely. Considering the conditions a bacterial skin infection seems likely. I do think white skin is more prone to infection and problems, though some scientist disagree with me on this.

I think dermatophilus should be considered. We have a description of this disease which could be used for the basis of a diagnosis at
HorseAdvice.com » Diseases of Horses » Skin Diseases, Wounds, and Swellings » Hair and Coat Problems / Itching / Irritated Skin » Rain Rot and Rain Scald: Dermatophilus.

As to the possibility of plant induced photosensitivity I too feel a UV index makes this seem unlikely but I don't think it rules it out all together if only white skin is affected. The key here is to id the plant.
DrO
New Member:
annes77

Posted on Tuesday, Apr 3, 2012 - 2:31 am:

Thank you for your fast answers.

Laurie, luckily my two do not have it on the pasterns this year. They had it last year. Since washing was not possible in the cold of the winter (we had down to -22 dgr C) I just put on zinc oxide cream and it cleared after a while.

Dr Oglesby, I read a lot about dermatophilus (also your article) and staph infection and I think both are plausible. I am just not so sure what caused it the first time. Back then it was not rainy, only very cold and usually the air is dry.

How contagious are these infections?
In fact I wanted to move my horses to another barn in beginning of March but could not do it due to the skin issue.
How long should I wait with moving them?
Is it ok to move when the scabs are off and the skin gets normal colour or should I wait until the hair grow back?
Should I wait until all the horses in the barn are ok again or can I move already when mine are ok?
What precausions are recommended? I will disinfect everything and my horses will go isolated in an own pasture for 3 weeks after moving.
Sorry for asking so many questions but I really want to move since I do not agree with the conditions in the barn and I want to do everything to not take the disease with me.

Best regards
Anne
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Sunday, Apr 8, 2012 - 3:16 pm:

I would wait until there are clear signs that the infection has resolved, normal skin and the hair beginning to come back in.
DrO
New Member:
annes77

Posted on Sunday, Apr 8, 2012 - 6:00 pm:

Thank you, should I wait until all horses are 'ok' again? Mine are much 'better' than some of the others and I fear they can get it again. I am not allowed to isolate them.
Best Regards
Anne
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Thursday, Apr 19, 2012 - 7:36 pm:

I am sorry Anne, I thought my previous answer covered this question. Can you explain further what you are asking?
DrO
New Member:
annes77

Posted on Wednesday, May 23, 2012 - 6:53 am:

Hello Dr Oglesby, sorry I was not in here for a long time.
Back then, what I meant was if I can move my horses (who were healthy again) even if the other horses in the old barn still had symptoms.
I did it anyway and they are fine. After 1 month in the new barn we will introduce them to the new herd now(they were isolated from the rest).
I really hope that this does not appear again.
Best regards
Anne
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