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Discussion on Local abscesses not from wounds
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New Member:
Pellis
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 12, 2005 - 1:45 pm:
Dr. O,
I have a 14 yr. quarter horse mare with some odd nodules. Currently there are 4 small ones and one large one shown in the pictures I will try to attach shortly. One is in the girth area just behind the right leg, one on the skin where the belly meets her left hind leg, and 2 small ones and the large one between her legs. If left alone these will open and drain a stringy, bloody pus. If pressed they will pop open (generally you can hear the pop). With some you initially get the same stringy pus and with others the first thing that comes out is like firm core followed by the stringy, bloody pus. You can see the contents on the pictures I’m attaching. (there will be several pictures) With all of them you eventually will get that same core type substance to come out. When I first pressed on the large one this morning I got about an 8 inch string of pus – just didn’t have the camera with me at the time. The only thing I’ve ever seen that is similar is a human staph infection of the skin that causes boils.
She and my other mare had these same nodules about 5 years ago only all of them were on their chest and all of them small. At that time they were in a different boarding facility. The vet looked at them at that time and didn’t have a clue as to what they were. Since at the previous pasture there were a couple of mesquite trees and some other trees/shrubs with thorns she suspected that they may have gotten some thorns. All of these cleared up over the course of about 2 weeks and I haven’t seen them again until now. In the previous incident, neither my gelding or any of the other horses in the same pasture had these nodules. Now, there are no trees or shrubs with thorns, no other horse has them and they aren’t in the chest area.
They are not sore as the mare doesn’t care if you squeeze them. In fact, when pressing on the large one today she acted as if it felt good because she was sticking out her upper lip as if we were scratching her in her sweet spot. Mare has no temperature and acts as if she feels great. Five years ago I simply would apply pressure to them daily to help them drain and then clean them with betadine. Am doing the same now, but was just wondering if you or anyone else has ever seen this type of thing before.
Thanks,
Patti
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Member:
Canyon28
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 12, 2005 - 2:36 pm:
sounds like a case of pigeon breast or pigeon fever to me, this is carried and spread by flies. I dont think you should be pushing on them, but Dr O will tell you the right thing to do, once they begin to drain some, then the area should washed out good with peroxide and water mixed together or another non burning antiseptic. Be very clean about this and wash your hands carefully before and after treating the wounds or else wear sugical gloves and throw them away each time. Do not come in contact with your other horses without cleaning up. Antibiotics are not usually given as this can cause the abcesses to go internally and bastardize. CA had an outbreak of this last year, and so did the Denver area in CO. I had several cases at my farm last fall, but only 3 or 4 out of almost 30 horses got any sores, and they were small and drained and healed quickly. I have not seen any of it this year. A good fly control program is a must. Make sure to put fly ointment around the abcess to keep flies off, as they are what helps spread it from horse to horse.. Flies Off, or a similar product works good. Chris www.canyonrimranch.net
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New Member:
Pellis
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 12, 2005 - 3:28 pm:
Here's a shot of the two small and large abscess between the rear legs
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New Member:
Pellis
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 12, 2005 - 3:29 pm:
Here's a shot of the discharge of the large one. Before I had the camera, a large volume of stringy pus came out of this one.
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New Member:
Pellis
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 12, 2005 - 3:31 pm:
One shot of the small abscess discharge
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New Member:
Pellis
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 12, 2005 - 3:32 pm:
This is not too clear, but shows the firmer core like material that comes out.
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Member:
Pellis
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 12, 2005 - 4:14 pm:
Thanks, Chris. I agree that it does sound a bit like pigeon fever. And it's funny, but I even asked my vet if that's what it was when this mare had these 5 years ago on her chest. Back then none of the nodules were bigger than a half inch. Perhaps it just wasn't common enough in Texas then for her to recognize it.
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Thursday, Oct 13, 2005 - 7:11 am:
Yes I think this looks like one of the 3 forms of pigeon fever, l would have one cultured to make sure, for more on these 3 forms and treatment see, Equine Diseases » Skin Diseases » Swellings / Localized Infection / Abscesses » Pigeon Fever, Dryland Strangles, & Distemper.
DrO
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Member:
Pellis
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Posted on Wednesday, Oct 19, 2005 - 2:42 pm:
Dr. O,
Just to let you know that we did culture the abscesses and it was/is staph. Those that opened have drained and are healing. There are only 3 that have not opened, but haven't enlarged or changed in any way. My vet has advised to use heat to see if those remaining will open and clear up. And, if anymore show up we're going to biopsy to see what's going on.
Thanks,
Patti
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Thursday, Oct 20, 2005 - 6:19 am:
How about that. I am at a bit of a loss to explain such a chronic staph condition...It would be interesting to go ahead and biopsy one of the unopened ones, if no treatment has been instituted, with a emphasis expressed to the pathologist on determining the initiating cause. Chances are fair however they will not be able to explain it. Perhaps if they could be biopsied at several stages, particularly one just starting.
DrO
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Member:
Pellis
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Posted on Thursday, Oct 20, 2005 - 9:37 am:
My vet and I agree with you that it would be great to know what caused it. At the time, though, the 3 remaining are small and slowly going away and no new ones have come up. We decided that if a new one appears we will biopsy. And if that happens, I'll let you know what we find.
Thanks.
Patti
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Member:
Gavet
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Posted on Sunday, Oct 23, 2005 - 8:43 pm:
I see these small abscesses with the funny "core" fairly commonly in horses here in Georgia in reaction to tick bites. I feel like there is a bit of a hypersensitivity component because I will often find other horses in the same pasture as an affected one have ticks attached and no inflammation, another horse will develop these nodules within 2 days of a tick bite in the areas you described.
FWIW.
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New Member:
Grindatt
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Posted on Thursday, Oct 26, 2006 - 12:09 pm:
I was just looking at old posts about pigeon breast. My brother recently had a real bad case of this on a gelding and another friend on her stallion- she said her vet suggested sulfur to combat this-she swears on the use of garlic for sulfur- what do you think of this, and do you think this could be effective?
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Thursday, Oct 26, 2006 - 7:34 pm:
Pigeon fever tends to be a self limiting disease connie so no matter what you spread on the abscesses they will eventually burst, whether this might speed them up I am uncertain and would tend to stick with the more tried and true therapies like we describe in Diseases of Horses » Skin Diseases, Wounds, and Swellings » Swellings / Localized Infection / Abscesses » Pigeon Fever, Dryland Strangles, & Distemper.
DrO
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