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| HorseAdvice.com » Diseases of Horses » Skin Diseases, Wounds, and Swellings » Bumps / Nodules / Warts / Tumors » Hives, Wheals, and Urticaria in Horses » |
| Discussion on Chronic hives | |
| Author | Message |
| New Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Sunday, Jan 1, 2006 - 10:15 pm: I own a 7 year old Paint mare whom I've owned for nearly 2 years. One day this past August, she suddenly broke out in hives all over her body, resembling a "bag of popcorn". My vet treated her with an injection of antihistamine and steroid and her hives disappeared, only to return about 4 days later, when the vet repeated her shots again and then added a tapering dose of dexamethasone and antihistamine for the next week. Her hives subsided, then would flare-up again despite having been maintained on her oral antihistamine. Sometimes, she'd even develop mild cases of hives while still receiving a very low dose of dex (=4or8mg). This scenario continued through the entire month of September, then abruptly STOPPED entirely in the month of October, despite my not changing her environment or feed/hay or bedding, go figure?By November in Ohio, we had cold, freezing weather with snow, my mare was still being turned out daily on frozen or snow-covered pasture and stalled at night. Nevertheless, she developed hives again by mid November and they have persisted through December. The hives were a bit different this time (November) than in the summertime. They were wheals, but then turned crusty and scaby that if you picked them, a tuft of hair with scab came off. My vet performed a fungal culture = Negative. Blood tests = normal. Several skin biopsies were performed which came back "consistent with superficial pyoderma likely secondary to allergic reaction". Briefly, this skin infection seemed to be subsiding all by itself (I couldn't give a good iodine bath like I would have wanted to due to it being winter)but, just this week, her hives have returned. My mare has had chronic hives since August 22, 2005, except for one single month where she was hive-free. I've tried to rule-out hay (hives persisted), feed (hives persisted), pasture (hives persisted despite not being turned out). Currently, I'm trying a different bedding for her stall, but don't know what kind of success I'll get since the barn owner uses his regular bedding in all the other horses' stalls surrounding her? Interestingly, this is the same supplier of bedding that the barn owner used in October while she was okay. Today, I had to give her 12 mg Dexamethasone orally to help prevent her hives from getting any worse. The hives are dime-half-dollar-sized on her back, sides, flanks and upper legs, neck. Her lower eyelid was swollen too. Does anybody here have any additional suggestions of things that I might consider as possible allergens for my mare? Does anybody here have a similar situation with hives lasting this long and if yes, what are you doing to manage it? Thanks so much! Theresa}} |
| Member: Angel77 |
Posted on Sunday, Jan 1, 2006 - 11:18 pm: Dear Theresa,At our barn we have an Arabian mare who breaks out and looks like a bag of popcorn every time she is in heat. I am not sure what they do for her. It seems they do nothing at all and it goes away on its own when her heat is over. I have never seen anything like it. Sorry I am not much help on this one. I thought I would share the story just the same as they are very similar. Good Luck, WTG |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Monday, Jan 2, 2006 - 7:39 am: It sounds to me like your horse is suffering from chronic low grade Dermatophilus, for more see Equine Diseases » Skin Diseases » Hair and Coat Problems / Itching / Irritated Skin » Rain Rot and Rain Scald: Dermatophillus.The air in the barn contains significant allergins and should be high on your list of possibilities. Turn out into a pasture with a 3 sided shed should be your next step. It may take 3 or 4 weeks before improvement is seen and just brief exposures to the barn air result in symptoms if this is the cause. Also the allergin may be the horse itself, autoimmune disease is not uncommon in horses. DrO |
| Member: Mrose |
Posted on Monday, Jan 2, 2006 - 11:46 am: We have a horse that gets bad cases of hives. The outbreaks seem to come every two years. When he got the first out break, about 6 or 7 yrs. ago, we tried everything to figure out what was causing the hives, including blood work. We did not do allergy testing as our vet felt it was unreliable. When ever he gets the outbreaks, we try changing bedding, moving him outside, no blankets, bathing with cool water, changing hays, etc. with no difference noted. The outbreaks always occur in late summer through fall. Once we get a frost, they usually clear up. While he has the outbreaks he is treated with anti-histamines and steroids. He needs a steroid shot every 3 - 4 days to keep the hives under control. Because the outbreaks occur at the same time of the year, I think it is vegetation related. However, if that is so, why doesn't he get hives every year? Or just years when we have a lot of rain and all the plants are really "out?" He got his first outbreak while at a show about 100 miles from here. Over the years he has been at different barns, but in the same geographical area. The hives are "true hives" with no crusting or soreness, and they start on his neck and back then spread. |
| New Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 5, 2006 - 11:24 pm: Dear Dr. O and others,First, thank you all for your prompt response to my email. I'm about at my wits end trying to figure out what my mare must be allergic to? After nearly two years of being "normal", is it possible for her to suddenly develop allergies? Her first outbreak of hives occurred quite suddenly on August 22, 2005. She was "normal" one day and broken out the next. As I said previously, she suddenly went "normal" again in October 2005, only to experience hives again in November which are continuing as we speak in January in Ohio! The hives have occurred whether she's turned out or kept indoors. And in October (her hive-free month), she was on pasture and stalled overnight indoors as she always is. Also, Dr. O, I too, thought it sounded like dermatophilus, but the skin biopsy reports failed to mention it? If I have to go the route of skin testing and hyposensitization shots, can you or any others explain how this test works and how the vaccine works? What sort of allergens are horses tested for and how often will the vaccine need to be given? Thanks so much!! Theresa |
| New Member: Echoval |
Posted on Friday, Jan 6, 2006 - 5:20 am: I have a paint mare that I have had since birth and she did not have any allergic reactions until the age of 3 she also looked like a bag of popcorn never could figure out what was making her do that .I now use a product called cough free I give it to her and no more bumps all natural ingredients. Give it a try . Good luck Pat |
| New Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Friday, Jan 6, 2006 - 8:32 am: Dear Patricia,Please tell me more about this product "Cough Free". I found it in my horse catalogs. Has it really managed to keep your horse hive-free without doing anything else? How much did you give to start out with and how much is a "maintenance dose"? Did your mare get hives as frequently as I describe my horse's? How long did it take for you to see a positive result from the "Cough Free"? Thanks so much, Theresa |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Friday, Jan 6, 2006 - 8:33 am: Yes allergies do develop quite suddenly. While the negative biopsy makes the dermatophillus diagnosis less likely, just a little exposure can set off an allergic reaction sometimes distant to the exposure. The key to is did the horse develop typical lesions of rain rot? We discuss the usefulness of intradermal skin testing and desensitization in horses at, Equine Diseases » Skin Diseases » Hair and Coat Problems / Itching / Irritated Skin » Culicoides Hypersensitivity: Sweet & Queensland Itch.DrO |
| New Member: Echoval |
Posted on Friday, Jan 6, 2006 - 2:26 pm: I give one scoop a day for a week than after that I give her one scoop every other day or you could give your horse a half of a scoop every day then try not giving it and as soon as bumps come back give your horse what ever amount it needs to keep the bumps away till what ever is in the air or ground or plants has gone away till next year at the same time . My Mare has had less of a reaction from what ever is giving her the hives each year since I have used cough free I don"t have to give it to her in the winter she starts about the first of April till august.might have to give it a little at a time till your horse gets use to the taste or mix it with apple sauce and shoot it with a turkey baster in your horses mouth what ever it takes to get it down |
| Member: Eoeo |
Posted on Friday, Jan 6, 2006 - 4:51 pm: A turkey baster wouldn't last long with our horses. What I have done is clean a tube that has had bute in it after it is used up. The end of it is large enough that it will suck up applesauce mixed medicine with ease. You just squirt that in the horse's mouth like you would bute. Works like a charm. If they get rough with it, there is always more where that came from. EO
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| Member: Christel |
Posted on Friday, Jan 6, 2006 - 10:58 pm: King, nice idea, if you don't have a bute syringe, use a 60cc syringe, cut the tip off and spoon the mixture in. I give all my oral antibiotics this way.The only reason I mentioned this is, until recently I wouldn't have had a bute one
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| Member: Eoeo |
Posted on Saturday, Jan 7, 2006 - 1:40 am: Been there, done that, too. EO |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Saturday, Jan 7, 2006 - 10:16 am: Patricias experiences are interesting, the active ingredients of Cough Free / 0.5 oz. are:Ginger Root . . . . 3970 mg Elecampane Root . . 544 mg Kelp . . . . . . . . 1488 mg Fenugreek Seed. . . 1418 mg Ferrous Sulfate . . 992 mg Sulphur . . . . . . 992 mg Gentian root. . . . 496 mg I have researched the ingredients in the Herbal PDR and none seem to have antihistimine properties, histimine is what causes hives. Most of the ingredients are used for dyspepsia (stomach upsets) except the elecampane root which has been used by herboloigist also as a treatment for cough. It may have some expectorant action through irritation. We have had other members who both have seen benefit and seen no benefit for the use of this product for cough. I am always afraid horse owners will attempt to use this product rather than addressing the real problem of most coughs: dusty hay resulting in permanant damage to the lungs. My personal experience with it is equivocal (no better than no treatment) and I have never tried it for hives. DrO |
| New Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 26, 2006 - 8:03 am: Hi again. I'm back to give an update on my mare with chronic hives. (Please see my original post dated January 1st)My mare continued to have hives throughout the first part of January, despite being on a different source/type of hay and having a different type of bedding (baled pine shavings) in her stall (other horses around her had the same old stuff, though). Her numbers of hives increased on January 8th, necessitating me to give her 12mg dexamethasone orally. The welts or wheals diminished, but not the scabby crusts. I finally moved her to a different barn entirely on January 22. Upon arrival, I was able to give her a warm water/iodine shampoo bath. I allowed it to soak for 5-10 minutes before rinsing. Later that evening, the barn manager phoned me to say that the "bumps" on my mare where gone! Another phone call the following morning, reported that the "bumps" were still not visible! Unfortunately, by that same evening, I could see several areas of small wheals, but certainly not as bad as she had been. Now, my mare has been at this new barn for 72 hours so far, and slowly her hives are returning. In conclusion, with this new history, does anybody have any ideas or suggestions as to what they think her allergy might be to? I'm thinking the bedding? How can a single bath reduce the wheals for ~16 hours or more if not for a contact allergy? Any ideas? (The new barn uses a wood shavings for bedding, but not all pine) Thanks so much from desperate & hivey in Ohio! Theresa |
| Member: Mrose |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 26, 2006 - 11:17 am: One thing that makes allergic reactions so hard to figure out, imo, is that once the horse's system becomes extra sensitive, it seems like almost everything sets it off, even if it is something the horse normally wouldn't have a reaction to. Is the horse blanketed? If so, were his blankets and sheets also washed? His halter or anything else that he is in contact with? Good luck resolving this. It's tough. |
| Member: Echoval |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 26, 2006 - 1:56 pm: The cough free did not work ? I don"t see anything in your post about trying it. |
| Member: Suzeb |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 26, 2006 - 4:50 pm: If it is a low grade form of rainrot, one bath is not going to cure it. You might need to do the 5 day in a row of betadine bath to remove the bacteria.On another suggestion, has anyone considered the possibility of mites? |
| Member: Lovemytb |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 26, 2006 - 5:08 pm: When my horse had mites it was just a large, bare area he kept scratching. Occasionally he would have sores from all of the scratching that would heal quickly with some antibiotic cream. My vet suggested Ivermectin for six weeks and it cleared right up. And with rain rot you can peal off clumps of hair and there will be pus underneath. What about ringworm? It's very hard to get rid of. |
| New Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 26, 2006 - 10:07 pm: Thank you to everybody that responded to my plea for Help!I am going to give her more frequent bathings to see if this "iodine shampoo test" really works again to make her bumps temporarily disappear. Does anyone think it may be a contact allergy to the bedding since she likes to roll a lot? She also ingests some bedding while eating her hay off the ground. Dear Patricia, My mare got really sick over Christmas (a reaction to SMZ-TMP that my vet had started my mare on for her hives that had turned into crusty/scabby lesions), since then and her new move to a different barn, I've been a bit "gun-shy" about adding anything different to her feed, including the Cough Free (which I ordered!)until she feels a bit more comfortable at her new barn. I don't want to make her not eat her grain. I hope to start it soon. Has it a bad taste? Dear Susan, you think my mare's condition sounds like chronic rain rot? I thought that too for awhile, so I'll keep bathing her repeatedly to see if that helps. Dear Lisa and Susan, the skin scrapings that my vet took and skin biopsies failed to show any mites. She isn't itchy either, nor has she any patches of hairloss, thank goodness. Thanks again for any and all suggestions for my mare's skin condition! I'm getting so depressed that I can't seem to help her. We're going on 6 months now! As soon as my mare reaches 30 days without having steroids, I can plan to have her skin tested for allergens at the OSU Equine Hospital. Anybody have any experience with that? Theresa |
| Member: Mrose |
Posted on Thursday, Jan 26, 2006 - 11:48 pm: No experience, but I'll be very interested to see how your experience goes and what they say. Our horse that gets hives periodically - about once every 2 yrs. - never gets scabs, just plain hives, like I have gotten in the past from different things. We have yet to figure out what causes them, but think it's a reaction to some area plants, like a type of rabbit brush maybe. He didn't get them when he was in California. I haven't taken him to one of the university clinics as the closest would be a 2 day drive.I know from my own experience with my allergies that once you get sensitized it seems like everything in the world bothers you, then it just seems to go away after a few yrs. I take meds to control it when allergies are bad. My horse seems to be the same way. With the scabs, Theresa, it sounds like the hives on your horse could be more than just "hives." I hope the tests are some help. Hang in there! btw-after the iodine bath, I would tend to just use a plain water rinse next time instead of another iodine bath, unless the vet instructs you other wise. I'd be afraid of drying out her coat and skin and maybe causing other problems. |
| Member: Shirl |
Posted on Friday, Jan 27, 2006 - 12:34 am: Theresa, Yes, I've had experience with my now deceased horse having the allergen tests. When I got her the former owner kept her on prednisone 6 months out of the year. My barn manager had a fit and contacted her vet who just learned of allergy tests for horses. Blood is drawn sent to a lab where it is tested for several different types of possible allergens. Hays, grasses, dusts, insects, you name it. Well, as luck would have it Sierra was allergic to a LOT of things. If you are interested I can give you an idea of some of the things in the morning when I'm fully awake and find her list. :o) Once you get past the initial doses (tiny bit each day for so many days, then increases for a few more days, etc.) Once you get to the maintenance dose it's a snap as I only gave her one injection a month and it did help her considerably, though she was still bothered by gnats at times. Hope this helps, sure would be worth it I'd think. Any more info you'd like, let me know. Shirl |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Friday, Jan 27, 2006 - 7:02 am: The bath induced improvement is easy to understand Teresa. I myself suffer from recurrent hives. Being too warm makes my skin very sensitive and any slightly irritating contact, like tight fitting clothes (think socks), causes remarkable hives. The best cure for me is a cool shower. I know you put the water on warm but unless you have much different weather than we have the water quickly cooled and the skin cooled along with it, cooling out the hives. Almost any cause of hives improves with cooling the skin. There may also have been a cleansing effect: what if some dust component on the skin causes the problem, you rinse it off but then it accumulates back over the day. I strongly believe the former explanation.Skin testing in horses is really problematic and the blood test Shirley describes without any value. The problem is that in experiments it has failed to identify known allergins and frequently identifies non-allergins as a cause of problems: frequent false negatives and false positives. I suspect Shirley's improvement is due to other factors than the skin injections she gives or perhaps their is some general effect of decreasing immune response with the shots unlikely. I can understand the frustration that takes you there but when it comes back he is allergic to air, water, and feed don't be surprised. DrO |
| Member: Dres |
Posted on Friday, Jan 27, 2006 - 10:00 am: Have you shown us a picture of this yet.. ?On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots... |
| Member: Rose15 |
Posted on Friday, Jan 27, 2006 - 5:50 pm: Theresa.....had exactly the same experience last year with our 8 year old bay mare. I did so much research my vet had his clients call me. He had 10 horses break out in hives in the middle of winter, each had different living conditions. different bedding, some lived outside some inside. He did all the things you have done for your horse. After 2 1/2 months on dex our mare started losing some hair on the buttocks I was at my wits end. We were giving shots about every2 days just to make her comfortable. We did the bathing, bedding, hay change, grain change, meds put her outside, then kept her inside with not much improvement. if you want to e mail me do so. It has been 9 months and so far no hives. |
| Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Friday, Jan 27, 2006 - 9:49 pm: Thanks again to everyone who took the time to answer my email: Sara, Shirley, Dr.O, Ann and Rose.New piece of info: When I checked up on my mare this past Wednesday, she had visible hives on her neck and right shoulder and both flanks. Just this evening (Friday) when I visited, I saw no signs of hives whatsoever! Go Figure? I would say that tonight was the best she's looked since last October's "hive-free" month. The only alteration within the past 48 hours has been 1) turn-out for several hours both days,(my mare is nearly always outside, except for really muddy conditions) 2) changing from sweet feed grain to just straight oats. I've not even given her any more baths since the first day she arrived about a week ago but nevertheless, I've noticed a real diminishing of her crusty/scabby-type of hives or bumps too. What's everyone's opinion to this new development? I'm trying hard NOT to get my hopes up! Rose, I would really like to hear about your experiences with your mare. Can you describe them in a separate email to me? Ann, when her hives return, I'll attempt to get a digital photo of them to show everybody. I really appreciate everyone's time and help with my questions! Theresa |
| Member: Shirl |
Posted on Friday, Jan 27, 2006 - 11:20 pm: Theresa, Great news!! So happy for you and hoping it stays that way. Was she nervous being penned up? Otherwise probably something in the sweet feed she was allergic to or the environment at her prior place of board. Good luck, Shirl |
| Member: Paul303 |
Posted on Saturday, Jan 28, 2006 - 2:16 am: Boy, Theresa, you just jogged my memory! Back in the seventies, at a stable I boarded my horses at, a horse ( not mine ), suddenly developed bumps all over his chest, shoulders and part of his neck. It looked like rain rot, but it had been very dry, and the rest of the horse was pristine. We searched in vain for a bee's nest. The bumps ranged in size from tiny to quarter sized. Some of the small and medium bumps had a crust on top - but I think that was from the horse rubbing on the fence, the trees, the stall door - anything he could get to.Then along comes the ubiquitous "Old Timer", the oldie boy, born and raised on a horse and spent a lifetime in the saddle. Now, doomed by his countless years to remain earthbound on his two bowed legs, he is approached for some insight - which is all he has left from a lifetime of horses. You know him, or you will. He eventually turns up at all barns. "They's feed bumps", he says, "gotta change 'is feed". "But", we say, "he's always had sweet feed". "So, don't change it - what'd ya ask me fer?". The feed was changed - the bumps went away. Allergy to the feed? Or to something in that batch of feed? I don't know. But I'd like to thank you for jogging that memory. I have my own place now, so I don't see the oldie boy anymore. I miss him. If he turns up at your place...tell him "Hi" from me. |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Saturday, Jan 28, 2006 - 8:47 am: Rose, you can't leave us hanging, what did you do that you believe relieved the hives?DrO |
| Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Saturday, Jan 28, 2006 - 7:32 pm: Thanks everyone! Rose, please do share what happened with your mare!I'm hopeful this "new" tread towards less or no hives or bumps continues. So far, the crusty/scabby stuff has nearly 100 % resolved. I felt so good about how her skin looked this afternoon that I rode her for the first time in about 3 months. You bet I had already disinfected all her tack, not once, but twice. We'll see what happens. I did go ahead and shampoo/"spot" scrub two large areas on her right neck and flank that used to have the worst welts or bumps on them. I just wanted to be extra-diligent. I'll keep everyone posted. Oh, one other question: Is it possible to get wood shavings tested for the presence of any glue or other wood preservative/chemical? I wouldn't think that the intradermal skin tests would be very specific in regards to allergens from wood shavings or not? Thanks ever so much! Theresa |
| Member: Echoval |
Posted on Sunday, Jan 29, 2006 - 7:34 am: Maybe what ever was bothering her is out of the air or ground see if it happens next year at the same time good luck |
| Member: Rose15 |
Posted on Sunday, Jan 29, 2006 - 2:50 pm: Theresa....If you can get a copy of The Horse Journal issue December 2004. The articlewritten by Eleanor Kellion D.V.M. should help you if your hives come back. Rose |
| Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 8:15 pm: Dear Dr. O, and everyone,Well, I'm back. I'm the owner of the Paint mare suffering with chronic hives. Despite my very optimistic posts dated January 28, 2006, for instance, I am here to report that my mare's hives have returned. In reading my previous posts, you'll see that I've changed my mare's boarding facility, changed her hay from alfalfa to grass hay only and stopped ALL grain, in an attempt to single out a culprit. On February 8, 2006, I hauled her to OSU Vet Hospital for a dermatologist to look at her and to have an intradermal skin test conducted, 4 biopsies and skin scrapings and culture. She's very reactive to alfalfa, surprisingly. But she also is reactive to molds, storage mites, and most pollens and insects. Well, it is still deep winter here in Ohio, so there really isn't a source of pollen from weeds, no insects either, so I've got to think that her allergy stems from either her food or immediate surroundings. The change in barns helped initially (my previous posts described that), but now, the change seems negligable. Any thoughts? I'm scheduled to start my horse on allergy vaccines (two different kinds-pollens and molds), but I'm told that I'll have to "pre-treat" her with a low-dose of Prednisolone before each injection. I hate to have to give her steriods every other day for the next 2 months while getting these vaccines started, but do I have any other choice? My mare must get the Olympic Gold Metal for the longest lasting case of chronic hives- started in August 2005!! The # of hives fluctuate from barely a few to hundreds, sometimes in the same week. As a desperate move, I am contemplating starting Cough Free to see if I can achieve some success as some other members? Any and all thoughts welcome. I NEED HELP! Theresa Burke |
| Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 8:29 pm: Dear Dr. O,I have a question for you, if I may? I have read your article regarding the use of "Alternate Day Therapy" as it pertains to steroid usage and I am wondering what your thoughts are regarding use of a steroid once a week? I am currently using a 50mg/ml apple-flavored Prednisolone paste that I have specially compounded for my Paint mare with those chronic hives, in a dial-a-dose syringe. Recently,when her hives get real bad, I began with her first dose of 0.5mg/lb (=500mg). I was intending to give this same dose EOD and begin tapering, per your instructions in your paper, but surprisingly, I found that this single dose maintained her well for approximately 6-7 days before she'd needed another dose. Our goal is to achieve the lowest dose possible, but what about trying for the longest interval possible? If my mare doesn't need EOD therapy, but say, 1x/week, is that still okay? Of course, next time, I'll try a smaller dose; say 0.2-0.3mg/lb prednisolone and see if that's sufficient to hold off her hives. Thank you, in advance, for your comments! Theresa Burke |
| Member: Shirl |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 10:08 pm: Theresa, Only my experience. My horse was given daily injections, very, very small dose for a week, then it was uped a small amount, given 3 times a week, uped some more, got weekly shot, then bi-weekly till she reached the appropriate dose for once a month. She got this maintenance dose till her death. She was never involved with the Dex also. I'm wondering if they are beginning with the appropriate dose without gradually increasing it? Be interesting to know.My horse was allergic to everything in the planet also, but never had actual hives, just itched, itched! Hang in there, Shirl |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Monday, Feb 27, 2006 - 7:16 am: Hello Theresa,First concerning your experience on moving, it suggests either:
Wow from a simple therapeutic view once a week is very good. The less often given the less it effects the adrenal glands. However you need to discuss this with OSU, I have never seen this steroid suggestion given with anti-allergy regimens. I don't think the cough free could hurt but again discuss this with OSU and how it might integrate with what they are doing. DrO |
| Member: Julesfav |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 28, 2006 - 4:10 am: Dear Dr.O.,Our TB has had hives severall times this year, with all the usual symptoms & treatments as mentioned in other mails. Now hives on skin are nearly gone, just a few scabs which we can gradually wash of, BUT: he now has wheals in his mouth, gums & tong??? The vet has taken bloodsample, do not have results yet. Any ideas on this??? Els |
| Member: Vickiann |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 28, 2006 - 4:34 pm: Be sure to look around and see what your horse may be eating if out in the pasture, and check your hay for weeds. A friend of mine's horse had chronic hives that did not respond well to treatment, but the hives would disappear when the horse was removed from his pasture for camping trips. We discovered he was eating large quantities of Woodbine (Virginia Creeper) that was growing on his fence. When the vines were removed, his hives disappeared and did not return. |
| Member: Echoval |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 28, 2006 - 6:57 pm: Did you ever try that coughfree that I tod you about last year It works for my paint mare and it is all natural |
| Member: Tmb2006 |
Posted on Wednesday, Jun 28, 2006 - 9:31 pm: Dear Els,If you've read the postings prior to your own, you'll see that I, too, have a horse with chronic hives. I now consider myself practically an expert on horse hives with everything my mare and I have been through, so I'll try to help you or at least offer some suggestions of things that I had to do. First, Switch your gelding to grass hay, NO alfalfa whatsoever! Look for "dehydrated alfalfa" in horsey treats too! Second, Do a "test trial" with just plain oats for feed, not any sweet feed or other concentrate for the next 30 days. Third, limit your use of fly spray to just a single brand Forth, check your bedding. Consider a "test trial" with those baled pine shavings. Fifth, walk your horse's pasture to familiarize you with all the varieties of plants and weeds. One or more of those is probably what your horse is reacting to. Els, allergy skin testing was performed on my mare too, by the folks at the University. The results were interesting. While she reacted somewhat to all the "usual culprits", some of her skin reactions were quite surprisingly significant. I now have two seperate allergy vaccines for her. My mare has also been receiving Cough Free (member here recommended it)going on 4 months now. My mare's hives started last August and lasted through till April of this year, so I'll keep this site posted if she reacts again this summer. Time Tells All! |
| Member: Julesfav |
Posted on Saturday, Aug 19, 2006 - 7:46 am: Thanks a lot for your advices! He's now been free of visible hives etc. for some weeks, but seems to be itching a bit again, so I'm defenitely going te try out your ideas!And Dr. O.: recently read article about fairly new method of allergy tests for horses trhough bloodsamples ( intravenous......)? Els |
| Member: tmb2006 |
Posted on Monday, Jan 28, 2008 - 1:14 pm: Hello Everyone!I am the owner of the unfortunate Paint mare (see lots of background info above) who suffers from chronic hives. Well, I can say that my mare went on to have a hive-free entire year 3/2006 - 1/08 !! She was housed at the same exact barn where the hives all started, but she underwent allergy testing and receives two different "allergy" vaccines per week (one for pollens and one for molds) She also eats nothing but grass-only hay (no alfalfa and No grain whatsoever). So, I can say that allergy vaccines may indeed have their place for helping some horses? Anyway, the BAD news. Recently, I had to move my mare to a new location (Jan 08). She's been there about a month now and unfortunately, her hives have returned  . They started to erupt as early on one week after moving. This barn is different in that it more closed up resulting with diministed ventilation which I believe is contributing to her problem as well as the possibility of more molds or pollens in the air as this is an older barn and not brand new. I've restarted her on oral Dexamethasone which she gets 8mg every 6-7 days to keep them away, in addition to speeding up her allergy vaccine (for the molds) to every 5th day instead of every 7th day. My questions are these: 1) Does anyone have any experience with HyDrOxyzine use in horses, or should I say, "successful" use in horses? And at what dose or schedule? 2) Does anyone have any experience feeding the "special" supplement made by Platinum Performance called Platinum Performance Equine and their companion product meant for "allergic" horses? These products may be a bunch of "phooey", but if it works, I'll be their best spokesperson. Afterall, I was told that her allergy vaccines wouldn't work in horses, and it sure did until we moved. Thank you, Theresa Burke |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Tuesday, Jan 29, 2008 - 7:58 am: Hello Teresa,it is not at all clear the allergic vaccines (immunotherapy) had a effect. Episodic hives is a common presentation and often there are no or infrequent recurrences after a bout. With disease of this type you often have folks, including veterinarians, who will try one thing after another and when the problem abates, the last thing tried becomes the "remarkable cure". I have seen presentations like yours dozens of times where an episode of hives stopped and did not recur for a year or often never again. This is without immunotherapy injections (allergy shots). You have to keep in mind the normally episodic behavior of this disease when interpreting the results on any therapy especially therapies with little support for both the diagnostic (skin reactivity testing) and therapeutic (immunotherapy) arms of the disease. It would be wrong for anyone to say it can't work but we are a long way from knowing this is useful therapy and other what situations. A few other notes about your post that is important: 1) In humans, where the therapy is adapted from, it is not considered effective for preventing hives according to some references I can find. 2) Important: dexamethasone will likely block any beneficial effect to allergy shots (immunotherapy) and the two should not be done together. I do agree with you that the increased exposure to barn air may be an inciting cause and getting the horse out with NO exposure to such environments may return your horse to a hive free state. In the case of COPD (Recurrent Airway Obstructive Disease) where the allergic reaction has been carefully studies, exposure for 20 minutes to the barn air resulted in 21 days of hypersensitivity. The take home message here is that very short exposure may cause you problems up to almost a month later with some allergy problems. DrO |
| Member: tmb2006 |
Posted on Tuesday, Jan 29, 2008 - 4:38 pm: Dear Dr O,I appreciate hearing from you and learning from your experiences. This frustrating condition has made me more prone to hope that there's gotta be some medication, vaccine, etc, that is known to work reliably in horses. Thank you again for getting back with me. Theresa |
| Member: sryder11 |
Posted on Wednesday, Jan 30, 2008 - 10:28 pm: Theresa, there are some posts about hyDrOxyzine in some of the other hives threads. I tried my horse on it last summer and found that it tranquilized him, but other people have had good results with it.I have been giving my horse the Platinum Vet Skin and Allergy supplement from Platinum Performance you asked about. He has been on it since October and he is doing really well on it. He is a very sensitive horse and I can hardly give him any supplements but this one seems to be working, his hives are gone, his weight and coat condition have also improved. A friend of mine who is a vet assistant and very knowledgable about nutrition and natural supplements read the ingredients, and said the mix of the three ingredients was very supportive for allergies. |
| Member: gailkin |
Posted on Saturday, Feb 2, 2008 - 1:39 pm: I sympathize with you Theresa. I posted to Suzanne's thread when my horses broke out in hives this spring due to grass hay. My 9 year old had never had hives and the 13 year old had them once at 5 years old from oak mites. They were covered with popcorn welts as you described. This was grass hay bought from a grower in CA valley. I bought two types of grass hay from him. I had fed the first type with other grass hay a few days and had no problems. We then traveled to our ranch where I took a bale of the other new grass hay. They have 15 acres of natural pasture so I only feed a flake at night. The next morning, they hadn't finished the hay and both were covered with the hives. They have been on the ranch many times so I know it was the new hay. Not only that, I removed their hay from the feeding area where I always feed them at night, burned it, bought new hay from a local grower and put that out after a day. My older horse would not go in the area where the hay was to eat!! He would eat the hay outside the feed area, but would not enter it. This went on for days. It was as if he knew that he got sick when he ate in there. The hives lasted all week and were better when we got home. I fed the new good hay and they were fine but then fed some of the first hay the next day and hives on the older horse again. So we dragged all 20 bales out of the hay barn, removed it all, etc. I had my vet do acupuncture and massage for the hive guy as she does not support giving prednisone as it lowers the immune response. He got better and we have had no problems since. She figured even a piece of the bad hay on the other hay in transporting could have triggered the hives the second time. I have gone back to feeding ground flax seed with their beet pulp mash in the winter which I think helps their immune systems and seems to make my more sensitive horse not react to bug bites, etc. I really can't imagine how awful you must feel seeing your horse covered with hives so often. It could be allergic or from food. You said they got better after removing sweet feed. I just wanted you to know that even grass hay can be a problem too. I really hope you solve your problem and your mare remains hive free. Keep us posted. |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 3, 2008 - 7:10 am: Hello Gail,A few comments on your post. Thank you for emphasizing that horses also get hives do to bug bites. However simple removal from exposure to the mites would be curative without steroids, massage, or acupuncture. Prednisolone (important note: prednisone is not effective in the horse nor effects the immune system of horses) does modulate the immune response but many diseases of humans and horses are do to hyperimmune responses. There are some of these conditions that seriously maime or even kill without the use of corticosteroids so I am uncertain about your vets position on no steroids. Their use should not be casual do to possible dose and "time of treatmen"t dependent side effects. You should note the way flax is supposed to help is by "interfering" with the immune response though this is not clear this form of a nutraceutical is effective in the horse, for more on this see Horse Care » Equine Nutrition, Horse Feeds, Feeding » Fats and Oils in the Diet of Horses. DrO |
| Member: tmb2006 |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 3, 2008 - 10:41 am: I want to thank each and every one of you who took the time to respond to my posting. I really appreciate it.For the time being, I am giving my mare 250 mg prednisolone orally every 6 - 7 days which seems to keep her hive free. How does this dosage regime sound to you, Dr O? Sadly, I am trying to find yet another barn to board with, but as everyone knows, a "good" facility is hard to find, especially in my area and not extremely expensive. Most places, interestingly enough, don't even offer pasture board? Even if I do move my mare, there is absolutely NO guarantee that she won't react to something ELSE in that new environment too, right? For what it's worth, I am going to try my mare with daily HyDrOxyzine. I just had it specially compounded into an oral paste which will be very easy to dose. I also am willing to try the supplement made from Platinum Performance. I'll keep the message board posted. Thanks again, Theresa |
| Member: tmb2006 |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 3, 2008 - 10:47 am: Another question for Dr O,In your response to my previous posting (1/29), you mentioned that you had seen cases like my horse "many times". Is that true? Wow! Sadly, misery loves company, so I didn't know that some other owners had experienced a similar presentation as my mare. Having an "episode" of hives last, not a couple of days or weeks, but a total of EIGHT months, then suddenly disappear and stay away for 1 1/2 years seemed so odd to me, but you've seen this happen before, Dr O? Theresa |
| Moderator: DrO |
Posted on Sunday, Feb 3, 2008 - 10:49 pm: Theresa my quote is, "I have seen presentations like yours dozens of times where an episode of hives stopped and did not recur for a year or often never again." Hives is a common disease problem in horse and yes, I have seen this recurring scenario happen dozens of times. To answer your direct question, I have not seen a case last eight months but then again I have treated them in the manner you have found successful for your horse. I rarely see individual cases have hives much beyond 24 - 72 hours.I think your dose quite tolerable long term by a horse but the question is can you get lower? DrO |
| Member: tmb2006 |
Posted on Tuesday, Feb 12, 2008 - 5:10 pm: Hi Dr O and Everyone,Here's a brief update on my Paint mare with chronic hives. It has now been 11 days since her last 250 mg Prednisolone dose. This is the longest that she's gone since her hives started on January 1st. In the meanwhile, I've started giving her 250-500 mg HyDrOxyzine orally once a day for the past week. Could it be that the HyDrOxyzine is making the difference? Nothing that I can see has changed in her new home since she arrived. I tried my mare on the specific Skin & Allergy supplement made by Platinum Performance and she refuses to eat it. She'll eat their Platinum Performance Equine Wellness supplement (general supplement), but I don't want to "overdo" my mare on supplements as that can be harmful too. She already has access to a mineralized salt block, and a "hay-balancer" supplement recommended by the University. Thank you for any of your thoughts! Theresa |
| Board Administrator Username: admin |
Posted on Wednesday, Feb 13, 2008 - 6:33 am: It is possible the hyDrOxyzine is helping but uncertain. Another possibility is she may not be experiencing any allergic events. You will have to discontinue the hyDrOxyzine to know.What is your horse missing in the regular diet that you need to supplement for? DrO |
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