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  Discussion on Sore girthing?
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Member:
Erika

Posted on Friday, Feb 24, 2006 - 9:58 pm:

Sorry, I posted this under "tack", but on second thought this is a more appropriate place...
My sweet, lovely,17 yo American Saddlebred mare has been reluctant to be girthed up for the past couple of years. I have had her since she was five. She jumps cross country in paces and a little hunting, trails mostly now, though.
I don't ride her often any more because I get the feeling something is hurting her.
She is fine bareback, and she doesn't object to mounting once she is tacked up. Seems to be no obvious soreness anywhere. Vet and Chiropractor checked her out. (Chiro found minor issues with her upper neck, but I don't see how that is related). She doesn't mind the placement of the saddle on her, but when I go to tighten the girth she is obvious in her objection. She once bit me HARD! Another time she reached around and pulled the saddle off, throwing it a good ten feet!
She had a custom made saddle, but after foaling in 2003, it didn't seem to fit as well, so I bought a new saddle that appears to fit her better. Doesn't matter which one I use, though, reaction is the same.
I have tried a fleece lined girth, very slowly tightening after rubbing the belly first (this helps), extended rest periods; consistent short workouts; various pads, etc.
She is rather flat backed, and long backed. Has a history of laminitis, but not for several years. She doesn't tolerate long vigorous rides as well as most other horses, which is why she doesn't hunt anymore. Carries her tail to the left side (always has). She shows no lameness, or reluctance to go forward. Jumps willingly. Only grouchy as @#$ when girthed.
She eats two pounds of Safe Choice feed, plus alfalfa-grass mix hay and pasture, 24 hour turnout. I give this info because of one of your articles discusses EPSSM as possible soreness source. She does occasionally walk stiffly at the end of a ride, but not very obviously or often. I usually just chalk it up to hard ground.
Sorry it's long, but I wanted to cover everything that might be relevant. She is such a lovely, soft and willing mare that I hate to just put her out to pasture, but I would hate more to cause her unnecessary pain. any ideas what to do next?
Member:
Cpacer

Posted on Saturday, Feb 25, 2006 - 9:12 am:

Hey Erika, hate to ask the obvious but is the girth too tight maybe? My horse had a phobia of cinch tightening when I got him, I think because he used to get done up pretty tight. He's getting over it now that he's learning I won't squeeze him to death.
Member:
Erika

Posted on Saturday, Feb 25, 2006 - 11:32 am:

You know, CP, it is possible. Since she is not very high in the withers I do have to do her up somewhat tighter or the saddle slips around. She's very athletic and can turn very quickly, so even a secure rider would need the saddle in place. Cross country I try to leave it a bit on the loose side and use a breastplate for more stability. The fleece girth has elastic at both ends and I do try to be aware of not over tightening, but maybe it is uncomfortably tight for her as an individual. Any suggestions as to how to keep the saddle in place without making it too tight?
It also still doesn't address why it is a relatively recent problem. If anything, I tighten it less than I used to when she was younger and I was riding her harder. Perhaps foaling has changed her conformation?
Member:
Cpacer

Posted on Saturday, Feb 25, 2006 - 5:18 pm:

I don't know if they have the equivalent in english tack, but for western a contoured pad has made a huge difference on the side-to-side slipping for me. I've also used one of those rubbery liners they sell at Valley Vet--you cut it into whatever shape you need and it prevents slipping. Cheap and it works.

Making sure whatever pad sits high in the saddle too, butted up into that front part (i'm not hip on the terms yet) rather than lying flat on the wither helps with the slip.

Whatever her issue is I hope you can figure it out!
Member:
Vickiann

Posted on Saturday, Feb 25, 2006 - 8:57 pm:

What is strange with my previously not touchy horse is how he stares backward with the "evil eye" while girthing up, for almost 2 years now with no previous girthing issues. I wondered whether he was having ulcer issues or saddle fit issues. He has been shown to have hock and fetlock pain due to joint degeneration, but don't know whether that is the cause or if he is reacting to something else. When riding in western saddles, the saddle fit issues are very real and fluctuate with changes to the horse's back on an on-going basis.
Member:
Canter

Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 10:40 am:

Erika, is it possible that the girth is pinching her skin and she's reacting to that? My mare has always been in the habit of making faces as soon as she sees the saddle coming up until I'm done girthing up. Just a bad habit from somewhere in the past so I never paid too much attention to it. However, this winter she started to get rubs from where the girth was pinching the skin. I bought a fleece cover and now I make sure I stretch out her front legs to eliminate any folds of skin that may be caught. It's the same equipment I've used on this horse for the past 3 years so I was pretty surprised that she got rubbed. All I could think of is that her skin is getting a little looser with age, just as mine is!
Member:
Mrose

Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 10:41 am:

Vickie - If the horse is having joint pain, the riding probably makes it worse, and he knows what follows when you put the saddle on. Have you tried giving him bute before riding him? Maybe it would make a difference. If his hocks are really bad, maybe you are riding him too much or too hard.

Ericka - If your horse has pain in her neck it could affect her muscles in her back as well as her shoulders.
Member:
Vickiann

Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 11:55 am:

Girthing up in stages helps with the "evil eye," but when I get to the point of tightening it the last time before bridling him he often dances around. Maybe in part he is getting anxious to get going, but I believe the behavior originally developed as a result of the pain. I've recently had his joints injected and have also put him on Adequan. His performance and willingness under saddle plus his improved ability to back up makes me think he is now comfortable, but once a behavior has set in I think they can continue with it even after the problem is eliminated. I am giving him more time off now and want to do everything possible to maintain his quality of life. I haven't tried giving him Bute before riding but that is an interesting suggestion. I don't plan to ride him unless he is sound but I do use this horse for performance (drill team) riding. Thanks, Sara.
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 12:19 pm:

As you can see by the above posts this is a very common problem with horses and often there appears to be no reason for the behavior. First carefully check the skin, girth, and saddle for problems, once we found that the piece of plastic from an incompletely removed sales tag was poking the horse. Certainly many of these horses respond to slowly tightening the girth. You know start loose, put on the bridle, tighten a hole, lead out, tighten a hole, clean the feet, tighten a hole, etc..

If it all checks out and the slow hole at a time does not work, this is a job for behavioral modification. For more on how to approach this see, Training Horses » Training Your Horse's Mind » Modifying a Horses Behavior: Conditioned Responses.
DrO
Member:
Erika

Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 12:22 pm:

Hi all, thanks for the ideas. As I said at the top I originally posted this under "tack". Dr. O gave an interesting answer about horses just getting cranky sometimes about routine stuff, and he suggested the article on "training your horse's mind". After playing around, I found that my mare does not object if I do the girth in reverse--attach it first on the near side, then actually girthing up on the off side. If it were pain, I think I would get the same reaction whatever side was first. But I think she didn't have the cranky reaction because it was different than her usual crank-making stimulus. I will try the conditioning methods and see how it works out. But for now we are reversing the order of tacking up.
Dr. O , you are very clever to have pointed this out and I do believe that , at least in my instance, you are correct in the assessment. Thanks.
Member:
Erika

Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 12:26 pm:

By the way, CP, I love the idea of the sticky pad liner. My friend has one and swears by it. I had forgotten about them and it makes sense that you would not have to overtighten if there was more grip to the pad. Anybody have any problems with the nonslip pad causing rubs due to the increased friction, though? I would love to hear more about how satisfied users are with those pads. I also heard that you can make a cheap version by buying the nonslip liner that is made for are rugs and cutting them to size.
Member:
Vickiann

Posted on Sunday, Feb 26, 2006 - 2:57 pm:

Those are great for keeping the saddle pad cleaner and drier and also for helping keep the saddle from slipping. I had used them (the type that you can buy and cut to fit under whatever type of saddle you have) very successfully for years, but during the past couple of years they have not worked well on my one horse whose back has become increasingly swayed. This makes it hard to get the pad to lie flat without bunching up, and if it bunches up under the saddle pad it will cause discomfort and can even mark the horse's back. I bought a heavier-weight, precut one (can't remember where, but out of a catalog)and that works better for that horse because it will lie down without causing pinching. Interesting discovery, Erika, about tightening from the off side. My horse also seems to do better if I tighten a little on the girth side and then go to the other side and pull it tighter, alternating if necessary until it is tight enough! Thanks to all for the good suggestions.
Member:
Cpacer

Posted on Monday, Feb 27, 2006 - 10:21 am:

Cutting a 'V' out over the wither helps whatever type of liner lay flatter too. I recently got a sheepskin to line the inside of a western pad that was rubbing at the edges, of course it slipped so I ended up sewing it in on each side so there's nothing sitting along the spine. It's worked great so far and really didn't ad much thickness, just softness.
New Member:
soday

Posted on Saturday, May 12, 2018 - 1:48 pm:

I aplogize for this post. Please disregard. I cannot figure out how to delete it.
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