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  Discussion on EPM??
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Member:
1sally

Posted on Wednesday, Jul 19, 2006 - 5:36 pm:

DrO,
I am not asking for a diagnosis, but would like your thoughts on this matter.

I have a 38 yr old arab stallion, which I have owned since he was 3. The only history of illness is strangles as a yearling and ulcers at about 32 (totally resolved). No history of serious trauma.

This horse was shown Park & jumping, and was a breeding stallion. Up until the age of about 32, he was very active (rearing and walking on his hind legs for about 10 mins. before coming down, and running were his favorite pasttimes). At about 32 or 33, he developed a slight uncoordination at the trot only and this developed in early summer. By the end of that summer, he actually fell at the trot on the lunge line. Although both hind legs are involved, he is worse on the left. He was seen by 3 different Vets and EPM was discussed. But because of his age and his probable exposure to EPM during his lifetime, all Vets believed that blood testing alone would be of no value and I was reluctant to have spinal fluid drawn. So, no tests for EPM were performed. He did not appear to be in any pain, but as a test, I put him on bute for several days with no improvement. I then put him on Corta-Flx with amazing initial results. But over about 2 yrs, the results faded. I then put him on adequan. After loading, he was given 1 shot every 6 weeks with good results and now 1 shot every 3 weeks with minimal results.

For the last 2 to 3 yrs, he has also shown mild signs of Cushings, mainly the wavy coat on his neck, and a slightly thicker coat in summer. He has had very mild gas colic twice in the past 5 yrs. He has not foundered, has no hoof problems and does not sweat. His weight is well maintained (not too fat or too thin) although he is showing some muscle decline around the hind quarters and has dipping in the back. He is 14.3 hands and weighs approx. 770 lbs. Since age 32, he has been on a cushings diet with added vits & minerals. I have recently added Evitex and and am considering pergolide.

This Spring, I noticed a shortness in his gait (front legs) at the trot and canter. I put him on bute for 2 days and this greatly improved. But after removing him from the bute, he now rarely canters on his own. He does move willingly around pasture at a walk, rarely at a canter, but will trot & canter willingly if asked. He still shows great interest in the mares and food, but a declining interest in other things. 2 vets have looked at him recently, but they only gave him the most cursory lameness test, so really I know no more now than before. He shows no obvious signs of arthritis (no heat, no swelling, no bony enlargements). He is still very correct in his leg confirmation. I am reluctant to keep him on bute at this point in time, both due to his age and history of ulcers. A complete blood workup was done, but I don't have the results as yet. Again, though, he was not checked for EPM.

I'm not looking for a magic wand here, but would like to keep this horse in the best condition possible for his stage of life. I am wondering if maybe I missed the boat on not treating him for EPM. There is little doubt that he has some sort of neurological problem. Could this be contributed to by the dipping in his back most likely from Cushings? Or could he be suffering from both. The time from first onset of visible symptoms to present is about 5 to 6 yrs.

I have read all the articles on both diseases. Cushings I am pretty sure of, but am still scratching my head on EPM.

Any input you've got would be greatly appreciated.
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Thursday, Jul 20, 2006 - 9:48 am:

All things considered I would have the blood test for EPM done and if positive try a course of treatment to see if there is improvement. It does not answer your "what if" questions (I don't know what could answer them) but then you know you have done all you can for this particular possibility. The dipping in the back has nothing to do with any of this.
DrO
Member:
1sally

Posted on Thursday, Jul 20, 2006 - 7:07 pm:

Thank you for your as always, good advise. I will have the blood test done this week. But I do have one more question. Vets that have treated him all stated that he will probably have a positive titers due to his age and probability of exposure to EPM. The last vet indicated that if he has had EPM for this length of time (5 to 6 yrs) his titers will be very high. Would you agree with this?
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Friday, Jul 21, 2006 - 9:34 am:

I don’t know Sally if I agree with the correlation between how high the titers are and length of exposure nor what the significance of the fact if true is. We know very little about the pathogenesis of naturally infected horses. Currently we are traveling and when I get back in my office I will see if there is any research on this correlation. It is true that in many areas of the country older horses are very likely to have titers to EPM and that having a titer diagnostic for the disease but if negative you know it is not. Your previous posts suggest you would like to know. Considering the costs of the test and treating with TMP/SMZ and pyrilamine some would just treat.
DrO
Member:
1sally

Posted on Monday, Jul 24, 2006 - 6:58 pm:

Sorry to take so long in getting back to you, but I was doing some research. I called MI State U parasitology and learned that MI is a very high risk state for EPM. The Vet I spoke to stated that a horse that had lived 38 years in MI would almost assuredly test positive for EPM due to exposure. So, I have decided to just treat the old boy.

I did find some information I think you and others will find very interesting. MI State U has an EPM test that significantly cuts down on false positives. You can read the news release at - https://cvm.msu.edu/news/press/EPMTEST.HTM

Additionally, there has been minimal but promising research, indicating continuous worming
with pyrantel tartrate may block the absorption in the bowel of sarcocytis neurona. The material on this research is at - https://cvm.msu.edu-news-press-EPM4-0302.pdf
Member:
1sally

Posted on Monday, Jul 24, 2006 - 7:10 pm:

Sorry about the url concerning EPM prevention with pyrantel tartrate. It should be - https://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:X8ojoh4QFcwJ:cvm.msu.edu/news/press/EPM4-030 2.pdf+EPM+in+Michigan&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=1
Member:
Djws

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 25, 2006 - 12:09 am:

Sally-

In this month's issue of THE HORSE, there is an article titled, SPINAL TAPS NOT NECESSARY FOR EPM TESTING?, that you may find interesting.

You may also go to www.thehorse.com. On the home page, go to READ MORE...scroll down to article title. Or, just type in EPM on the search window of the home page. Article headline will be under the current articles section. (I have tried to post the link, but have had no success-sorry). If you are unable to locate it, let me know.

Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Tuesday, Jul 25, 2006 - 7:51 am:

That's Ok Sally, the information is interesting but just last year further tests they talked about in the above article showed that pyrantel did not prevent natural infection.
Am J Vet Res. 2005 May;66(5):846-52.
Effect of daily administration of pyrantel tartrate in preventing infection in horses experimentally challenged with Sarcocystis neurona.
Rossano MG, Schott HC 3rd, Kaneene JB, Murphy AJ, Kruttlin EA, Hines MT, Sellon DC, Patterson JS, Elsheikha HM, Dubey JP, Mansfield LS.
Population Medicine Center, Department of Large Animal Clinical Sciences, College of Veterinary Medicine, Michigan State University, East Lansing, MI 48824, USA.

Concerning a more accurate test, I am uncertain what to make of this. The reason for the high rate of positives is believed to be that although many are exposed and develop a titer only a small percentage, I believe I have heard appx 1 % of those exposed, go on to develop disease. I went and looked for some support for the idea of cross reactivity being and cannot find it. In fact a very complete review and new information published suggest little has changed other than we seem to know better what we don't know.
Am J Vet Res. 2006 May;67(5):869-76.
Indirect fluorescent antibody testing of cerebrospinal fluid for diagnosis of equine protozoal myeloencephalitis.
Duarte PC, Ebel ED, Traub-Dargatz J, Wilson WD, Conrad PA, Gardner IA.
Animal Population Health Institute, College of Veterinary Medicine and Biomedical Sciences, Colorado State University, Fort Collins, CO 80523-1681, USA.
Summaries of both of these articles can be reached using the Scientific Report button at the bottom of the EPM article.

Let us know what happens Sally and we will keep our fingers crossed for Mark.
DrO
Member:
1sally

Posted on Friday, Aug 18, 2006 - 10:25 am:

Dr O and anyone else who had problems with Marquis?

I have treated Mark now for 3 weeks on Marquis with increasing symptoms. He now appears to be almost lame on all 4 feet. No laminitis or other leg problems are apparent. He can now ambulate at a walk only, whereas before he could canter. Plus, he has been on bute now for 3 weeks.

I understand that the treatment can sometimes worsen the symptoms, but shouldn't he be showing some signs of improvement by now? Has anyone else had this problem? I'm wondering if I should discontinue the treatment.
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Saturday, Aug 19, 2006 - 7:31 am:

Though Navigator has a history of a large number of adverse effects, Marquis has been pretty well tolerated with digestive upsets most often seen.

Though you would have hoped for improvement by now the course of treatment can be variable Sally and some have continued to see improvement for 4 months following treatment. It all depends on where the horse was damaged, how severe the damage is, and whether the medication is effective in that particular horse we know that a significant percentage of horses with EPM do not respond to therapy because it is not effective at controlling the organism in them.

Has the horse been reevaluated since worsening clinical signs? Note that lameness from pain is not a symptom of EPM.
DrO
Member:
1sally

Posted on Saturday, Aug 19, 2006 - 9:26 am:

This horse was not on bute prior to starting treatment. On the 3rd day of treatment, his symptoms worsened and that's when I started him on the bute as I was of the understanding that the dying off of the sarcocyts may produce an inflammatory reaction.

From other posts, I was prepared for a worsening in symptoms but thought that this would be relatively short term with gradual improvement. Unfortunately, I am seeing no improvement.

I am treating him at 1 1/2 times the regular dose and had planned on running him for 2 months. Of course, that is out the window and I am considering taking him off of it altogether.

I have a vet coming out this following week, but don't expect much to come of that. Exams in the past have been the vet stands there and looks at him, gives him a laminitis check, and tells me he is uncoordinated in the rear which looks to be neurological (gee, like I didn't already know all of that!). If I had listened to the vets, I would have buried this horse years ago. In the last 6 years, any treatment for him has come from me (with help from this site and others) not the vets.

Now that I have gone through my tyrade on veternarians, you of course excluded, I will get back to the problem at hand.

Prior to starting Mark on Marquis, I had a blood workup done which showed the following.
Total bilirubin - 1.2 (ref range 1.9 - 3.7)
Direct bilirubin - .8 (ref range .0 - .5)
glucose - 70 (ref. range 75 - 115)
TCO2 - 23 ( ref range 25 - 34)
Potassium - 5.4 (ref range 3.0 - 5.3)
NA/K - 25 L03
Equine endogenous ACTH - 57.8

The rest was within normal ranges and these results were on one blood test taken mid-day with feeding done approximately 6 hrs prior.
I don't know if these results Have anything to do with anything other than to point to Cushings.

PS. Regarding the new Indirect fluorescent antibody test (IFAT) developed at Colorado State. I did call them and talked with a tech in the parasitology lab, who had never heard of it. I tried contacting one of the vets that had been working on it, but she is in Europe until the 23rd of Aug.
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Sunday, Aug 20, 2006 - 8:17 am:

I don't know Sally, though we know most of these type cases are probably not EPM, and we treat on the off chance it is, a worsening incoordination following beginning therapy increases the chance this might be EPM. I think such a prolonged worsening does decrease the prognosis however.

Let's see what the examining vet says and if it does find this is a worsening of the incoordination consider these thoughts.
DrO
Member:
Ryle

Posted on Sunday, Aug 20, 2006 - 7:45 pm:

Generally the onset of the "die-off" increase of symptoms with Marquis is around 10 days to 2 weeks with the horse tending to have good and bad days but overall improvement by the end of the first month's treatment (though not necessarily a huge improvement). I would be concerned that your horse has something other than EPM since he is continuing to get progressively worse. Further diagnostics (as possible) might be a good choice at this time, including x-rays of the head/neck so that you can focus on appropriate treatment rather than guessing and possibly wasting time.

Whatever the cause, if the neurological deficit is getting so severe you may need to discuss either treating with Banamine or IV DMSO to see if you can decrease the inflammation and thereby lessen the severity of symptoms.

I hope you can find something that works for your guy.
Member:
1sally

Posted on Monday, Aug 21, 2006 - 9:32 am:

Thanks for your input Dr. O, Cynthia & DJ

Cynthia, if Mark was a younger horse, I might consider doing the x-rays. But at this point in his life (38), I am unwilling to ship him to a facility that could do this which would be at least a 2 hr drive. Too much stress on the old boy, especially now. Plus I might get a better diagnosis, but the question would be would there be any treatment?

On the plus side, Mark cantered into his stall this morning and looked good. I will ask him to trot for a few strides today, as this has been the gait that he has shown symptoms the worst, and evaluate him at that time.

As I am on the last week of the 28 day treatment, I have to make a decision as to whether or not to continue him on Marquis for another 2 weeks to 28 days. I have a call into my vet and we will discuss this later in the day.

I will keep everyone posted. And if anyone has any input at all regarding any of this, I am all ears.
Member:
1sally

Posted on Monday, Aug 21, 2006 - 2:18 pm:

I had Mark trotted off this afternoon. He initially went into the pace. But later did trot with exaggerated hock flexion (almost like stringhalt but not as severe. Note, this is a new symptom). However, it is an improvement from the last time (about 2 weeks ago) I saw him trot, when he trotted in the front and hopped in the back. He also appears to be brighter today and the handler did comment on this without any mention of it from me (I had thought the same thing this am, but am trying to be very careful not to read in any improvements I want to be there, but in actuality, are not). He is also walking normally. This is also an improvement, as a few days ago he was walking as though he was foundered on all 4's.
Member:
1sally

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 22, 2006 - 6:27 pm:

Dr O and anyone else who wants to make a comment or suggestion, as I am in unfamiliar territory here.

The vet came out today and evaluated Mark. He estimated that he is about the same, maybe slightly worse, as when we started treatment. We did discuss the worsening and then the improvement. Today, there was no exaggerated hock action and no pacing. The trot was uncoordinated in the rear, as was the canter (this is somewhat worse than yesterday). He demeanor was bright and responsive. He has been off bute for 36 hrs.

The vet suggested that I continue with Marquis for the last 3 days and then put him on one of the sulfur drugs for 6 weeks, with re-evaluation at that time. I am still wondering if I shouldn't continue the Marquis for another 2 weeks now that I am finally seeing some improvement. Currently, he is on Marquis at 1 1/2 his weight. What do you think??
Member:
Djws

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 22, 2006 - 9:11 pm:

Sally-

Our trainer (pacers) had 2 geldings that were being treated with Marquis. He treated them for 2 months, and had improvement with both. Another horse in the same stable was treated for 1 month, and regressed. These horses are younger than your Mark (don't know if that makes a difference). I asked various owners and trainers their opinions...they all said 2 months is what they go with (90% see improvement). We have a lot of EPM in Ohio. Since I read your post earlier, I just asked people...don't know whether it helps you or not! I know Marquis is very expensive, but if it helps, it's worth it! I wish you both a good outcome!
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Wednesday, Aug 23, 2006 - 6:53 am:

Sally I don't think there is a problem associated with the switch per se. The article carefully compares these medications efficacy and you should review them and then using this information apply it to your resources and goals to arrive at a decision.
DrO
Member:
Cheryl

Posted on Wednesday, Aug 23, 2006 - 8:02 am:

My TWH mare was diagnoised with EPM from a spinal tap done at Wa State U. This was after two and a half years of trying to find out what was wrong with her. For six months prior to going to WSU she was put on whatever was being used at the time to treat EPM - with no effect. I contacted Dr. Tobin at Gluck Equine Clinic U of Kentucky. He was doing research using diclauzuril (sp) It's a chicken feed supplement which we had to purchase from Canada. The dosage worked out to about 1-2 cups 2X day (it's been so long I don't remember exact dosage) She was on this for 28 days during which time the majority of her symptoms disappeared. She has some residual nerve damage, probably because it took so long to get an accurate diagnosis, but other than stumbling with her rear feet occasionally, she is fine. I have not kept up with the research on EPM so don't know what new meds there are - just know the diclauzuril worked for Fox. The dicauzuril was $700 for a 40 pound bag and it took most of it for the treatment.
Member:
1sally

Posted on Wednesday, Aug 23, 2006 - 12:44 pm:

Thank you Dr. O, Cynthia, DJ and Cheryl. Your input and advice has been greatly appreciated. This am, Mark trotted and galloped at will. While his gait in the rear is not normal by anyone's standards, it was less uncoordinated and more a shortness in steps. His alertness and attitude are greatly improved from before treating with Marquis. For these reasons and because he has not yet experienced any of the normal side effects to Marquis (no mouth sores, loose stool or hives), I have decided to continue him for at least 2 more weeks on the Marquis. After that, I am considering further treatment with either the sulfa combination drug, or as Cherly suggested the dicauzuril.

I read the article on EPM treatment, but did not note the side effects listed for either drug other than malabsorption of folic acid with the sulfa drug. At 38, this horse would be more prone to side effects, which is a main concern. Dr O, what would the side effects if any, of the 2 drugs be? What would the dosage for dicauzuril be for a 780 lb horse be? Also, in your estimation, would continued treatment after 6 weeks on 1 1/2 dose of Marquis even be warranted? Cheryl, did your horse exhibit any side effects while on this drug?

Again, many thanks for all your kind responses.

PS. A suggestion. With all of the people who have treated for EPM on this site. I think it would be highly beneficial, if not totally scientific, to do a brief survey on the age, sex, treatment used, side effects encountered, and outcome of treatment. I am a firm believer in field studies, and this would certainly involve at least as many animals as the drug companies studies (which haven't been all that scientific either). Just a thought to ponder.
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Thursday, Aug 24, 2006 - 5:09 pm:

If you feel you have a response to the treatment yes ongoing treatment as outlined in the article would be recommended.

Concerning the sulfa drugs we have an article which includes side effects at Treatments and Medications for Horses » Antibiotics and Antimicrobials » Trimethoprim -Sulfa. I have seen no reports of ill effects attributed to the pyrilamine nor have there been any toxicity studies that I am aware of other than the folate problem described in the article referenced above.

Though there have been several pharmacokinetic studies of diclazuril I have not seen nor heard of any reports of adverse effects. On the other hand as the article states, there still have been no investigations into the toxicity of this drug in horses.
DrO
Member:
Cheryl

Posted on Friday, Aug 25, 2006 - 9:15 am:

Sally - will try to answer all your questions. Fox was 2 1/2 when I bought her. For two years I had the vets out on numerous occasions re stumbling on her rear feet. I was told on every visit - she's lazy, she needs to have her butt ridden off. Nothing wrong with her. Over this period of time the stumbling had become progressively worse. I was working with a Parilli trainer who told me to get the vet out to do a neurological evaluation and that if they couldn't do it to get another vet to check her out. The next vet did a few simple tests - pulling her to the side with her tail while she was walking - which almost sat her on her butt. I insisted on the blood test being done although the vet didn't feel it was warranted. By now she was almost 5 and in my opinion had been suffering from EPM since before I bought her. The blood test was positive - the vets recommended the current drugs for treating EPM - sorry I can't remember what they were - but rather than killing the protozoa they simply suppressed them. This went on for three months with the only change being a progressive worsening of her symptoms. She also foundered twice during this period of time and this, Dr. O, was when I was told that foundering was a side effect of EPM. I was told by all three of the vets treating her to put her down. That treatment was too expensive and probably wouldn't work. I went on a search for new treatments and found Dr. Tobin at Gluck Equine Clinic. He suggested having a spinal tap completed to make sure we were dealing with EPM. Arrangements were made to send her to WSU. Even there I had to argue with them about doing the spinal. They had determined that she was probably a wobbler and would require absolutely horrendous surgery to correct it. They did the spinal the last day she was there and it was positive for EPM.
The diclauzuril available from the US was a liquid. She was put on that for two months with very little positive effect. I again contacted Dr. Tobin and was told the liquid was not strong enough to be effective and told me to have my vet order the diclauzuril from Canada. It should be noted that by that time her vet bills were in excess of $14,000 and climbing. It was during this time she foundered again and the vets all concurred she should be put down. My farrier told me to contact Dr. Macomber to see if I couldn't talk him into treating Fox. She had been confined to her stall for months. He wanted her turned out, wanted the EDSS shoes put on her and wanted her on a strict diet. The only way I had been able to get the diclauzuril down her was mixing it with sweet feed, and ground up apples and carrots. Her weight had gone up at least 100 pounds on the treatment and I think was the reason for the founder. He gave my farrier the exact angles he wanted her at and the EDSS shoes were put on. She walked off sound. Two weeks before was when I had been told for the zillionth time to put her down. Since she completed her last diclauzuril treatment she has been sound with just occasional stumbling on her hind feet. If she is shod with the natural balance shoes she doesn't stumble and actually gaits really well. I am currently using a natural barefoot trimmer -she has had one trim and is rescheduled for the end of September for the next one. She is insulin deficient and is on a treatment of 4 teaspoons of Thyro-l for a period of three months. Her weight has DrOpped from 1200 to 1076 so still has between 75 and 100 pounds to loose. Due to injuries to myself she has not been ridden. She started the thyro-l treatment July 17. My personal opinion is that she had EPM, without treatment for so long that it caused permanent nerve damage and that she will always do some stumbling. About two weeks into the treatment with the powdered diclauzuril the majority of her EPM symptoms went away and have never recurred. She is now 13 - and other than her weight is totally healthy. She still wears her toes off between trimmings but most of her stumbling is on the front feet now as opposed to almost falling from stumbling on the rear feet.

Sorry this is so long but it was a really long road to where she is now.
Hope some of it is helpful.
Member:
Hwood

Posted on Friday, Aug 25, 2006 - 10:01 am:

Cheryl, thank you for sharing your story. You and Sally have an amazing commitment to the good of your horses. I am inspired, to say the least.
Member:
Cheryl

Posted on Friday, Aug 25, 2006 - 11:02 am:

Ah, but Holly, if you could see that sweet face you would have done the same. You mentioned a new horse you are purchasing in a different article. You might want to consider EPM, worn off toes was one of Fox's main signs.
Member:
Ryle

Posted on Saturday, Aug 26, 2006 - 6:24 pm:

Sally,
What area are you in? Are you currently experiencing high heat and humidity? If so, this could be the cause of the continued severity of symptoms. Horses with EPM often do not do well with heat but improved once the weather cools down or if they are kept in a cooler area/condition (stalled under fans or with access to a mister).
Many horses (even senior citizens) have been treated with the sulfadiazine/pyrimethamine combo treatment for months at a time with no ill effect. I would not be hesitant to treat my own horses with it.
Just keep in mind that you may see improvement for many months with your horse and don't get too discouraged by the ups and downs you are seeing. Many things can stress a horse that has a neurological condition and cause symptoms to worsen during the time of the stress, but once those stresses are removed they return to their pre-stress deficit level. I know many women who have horses that have been treated for EPM and months or years after they often see increased neurological deficits during high heat/humidity, if the horse has been over-worked or if he has some other disease process going on like a resp. condition and once the stress is removed the horse's neurological symptoms return to whatever is "normal" for them in the un-stressed condition.
Member:
1sally

Posted on Thursday, Aug 31, 2006 - 10:14 am:

Sorry it took so long to get back. Had out of town company and they just left yesterday. After reading all of your posts, I have decided to treat concurrent Marquis and sulfa trimethoprin for 2 more weeks, and then continue with the sulfa drug for 1 month total.

Mark is moving about more each day, trotting, cantering and even a gallop at will. He is significantly improved in brightness and interest in things. But his gait per se, has improved only minimally from before we started the Marquis with some days being better than others. I did not expect a magic bullet when I decided to treat the old boy. My main goal was to stop the downward progress of the disease and if we have accomplished that, I am pleased.

Cheryl, thank you so much for all of your input. If I run into any relapse's after this, I think I will give the diclauzuril a try.

Cynthia, I also thank you for all your information and you are right. When Mark went through the worst of it, it was for the 3 weeks that was in the high 90's. I didn't think much of it at the time as Arabs can take plenty of heat. I have many shade trees and the barn, especially his stall, is very well ventilated. Mark also has cushings and because of all the other treatment he is currently getting, I have only treated him for this with chasteberry and, of course, body clipping. Once he is off his current meds, I plan to start him on Pergolide with concurrent chasteberry.

Dr O, as always, I thank you for your input and good advice. I feel that the treatment is successful in that this horse is trotting and cantering at will more each day. While his movement is still definately off and probably always will be, I have no worries that he will fall. The most significant improvement has been in overall attitude. He is bright and alert and seems to have regained his joie de vie.

Thank you all.
Member:
1sally

Posted on Monday, Sep 18, 2006 - 11:40 am:

Short progress note
Mark has completed week 7 on Marquis and week 2 of Sulfa-Trimethoprim. As he continues to exhibit no side effects, I am continuing Marquis through the 8th week with the sulfa drug continued for another 2 weeks.

For a 38 yr old horse who apparently had EPM for up to 6 years, his recovery is amazing. He trots, canters and gallops at will almost daily and exhibits minimal neurological symptoms. Actually more of a shortness of gait in the rear.
I have actually had to bring him in from pasture because he was running too much.
Member:
Hwood

Posted on Monday, Sep 18, 2006 - 12:50 pm:

Fantastic, Sally. What a great relief for you and what a wonderful, hopeful anecdote for the rest of us who are dealing with or may have to deal with EPM in our horses.
Congratulations.
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Tuesday, Sep 19, 2006 - 6:44 am:

That is great Sally. Though I have counseled treatment for EPM it is important to remember this could be some other problem, viral encephalitis(?), and treatment just coincidental with recovery. Keep an open mind to the issue so as not to miss other possibilities.
DrO
Member:
Djws

Posted on Tuesday, Sep 19, 2006 - 11:45 pm:

Super news for you, and Mark! Congrats!
New Member:
Cath10

Posted on Monday, Dec 25, 2006 - 6:08 pm:

I recently purchased a 4 yr old TB mare that I started training.(not OT)After 2 weeks she locked her back stifle as I pulled her out of the stall. After some bute/banamine it was able to unlock. She was fine for another week & a half, then locked the OTHER stifle ! Again, after I pulled her out of the stall.(She's on 8 hr turnout ). Now, another week later I wake up & she has BOTH rear stifles locked after being in the ROUNDPEN overnight with another horse ! Bute/banamine didn't work.Called vet out to unlock. By this time one was unlocked...so we started on the other. We got it unlocked after about 30 minutes of trying after a muscle relaxer shot....to where she stumbled & fell down. The vet was very worried about the neurological symptoms she displayed.Saying that she had no fight or tension at all, and seemed stumbley & would just fold & fall. He also thought her whole rear end seemed rotated...looking "disconnected". He seems to think it's all neurological. This horse is only 4, and I'm thinking of putting her down, as she may relock anytime...which leaves her totally immobile. Any thoughts on it ? She seems to have a bit of a head tilt also. Trying to find where she may fit.What are the costs of treatments vs the results of any success's & failures.
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Tuesday, Dec 26, 2006 - 7:17 am:

Catherine the locking stifle is a very treatable problem for more on this see Diseases of Horses » Lameness » Diseases of the Upper Rear Limb » Diseases of the Stifle » Stifle Lock: Upward Fixation of the Patella. I would suggest having the horse evaluated for neurological problems but wait until he hasn't spent the last few hours stuck.
DrO
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