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Discussion on Badly cut foal
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Monday, Jul 31, 2006 - 7:43 pm:
Hi,
Has anyone had experience with really bad deep cuts? Our colt foal got entangled in a wire mesh fence a week ago (special stud fencing designed so as not to injure!!!!!)and must have been hung on the wire overnight as the wounds were dry and very dirty when he was found. His right hind had lost about 4 inches of tissue completely exposing a large area of bone on the outside of the pastern, and a deep wire wound also on the inside, this is the worst wound. His left front leg was literally skinned from knee to fetlock with a huge gaping wound under the knee. His left hind has deep wire cuts at the back of the pastern possibly involving ligaments, and he had numerous other cuts bangs and bruising and his eye was hanging out. He was practically dead from shock and blood loss when he was found and if it hadn't been my 13 year old daughter who found him I would have put him down. In all my years I have never seen such extensive injuries in an animal that was still alive (just). Amazingly he lived and is now in great form and feeding well from the mare (he is 2 months old) and is weight bearing on all 4 legs. However his week of antibiotics finished yesterday and I am worried about the two worst wounds. They are both very smelly and have plenty of discharge. I am using pressurized water to clean them daily, then crystalline penicillin, then fucidin on a melolin dressing, then bandaged. However the bone is still exposed and while there is some granulation tissue, after 8 days I would have expected considerably more. Neither of these wounds appear to be healing though everything else is healing well, though the other hind pastern closed too soon and I am now poulticing it but that is the least of his worries. Has any one ever seen a wound heal with bone exposed and how long did it take to cover the bone again? 2 days ago the bone looked covered but today it was all gooey and open again. I am reluctant to give him more antibiotics as he was getting a touch of diarrhoea at the latter end of the previous course. As long as he is not in pain I will try to save him but he will hate people when he is finished! This is a picture of him before injury, camera is new so date not set yet!
Thanks Catherine
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Monday, Jul 31, 2006 - 7:49 pm:
Here are the two worst wounds and the eye after it was replaced. Please do not look if you are squeamish,
sorry Catherine
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Member:
Image
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Posted on Monday, Jul 31, 2006 - 9:25 pm:
OMG! That poor baby! What did your vet say? Many moons ago my best friends gelding kicked at a stall door that was fastened with one of those old fashioned door hooks. The door opened just enough to allow the hoof through. His leg slid down until it was resting on the top of the hooks back and he kicked like crazy until he fell down with that back leg hiked up on the hook. He fractured through the hock (hairline) but the major injury was the missing tissue exposing a 5" section of bone and tendon along the rear cannon. It looked like an anatomy lesson. The vet was excellent and made it very clear that the bone must not be allowed to dry out. She called a researcher/nurse who had been looking for a way to test a new product that was to granulate tissue in burn victims. Leroy (the gelding) had nothing to lose at this point so my friend agreed. We were advised to hyDrOtherapy for 20 minutes minimum a day, using gloves we put a special gel-looking salve on the bone to keep it moist and living, cover all with gauze, wrapped with cotton sheeting, and a polo wrap. (this was before vetwrap) It took months to heal and I wish I could remember the meds we used. (they are used in human burn victims) Leroy had a god-awful scar but he was alive and sound most days. Sorry I don't have much to offer in the way of treatment but as long as the colt isn't in pain and the vet says it can be done, there is hope!
As for his hating people...most animals realize that you are trying to help them. If anything, he will learn to be handled all over and that should be done while he is young anyway. Through the years with the injuries all my animals have managed to inflict on themselves, they all took it much more stoically than most people I know, and they always forgive me afterwards. They really seem to know I am trying to help.
Take care and best of luck with your colt! Let us know how he is doing. (glad he was able to keep the eye! Can/will he be able to see with it?) Hopefully Dr O will be here tonight.
Charlayne
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 1, 2006 - 8:20 am:
Hello Catherine,
It is too much to expect a lot of granulation tissue to cover bone in 8 days. Bone cannot form granulation tissue and therefore it has to grow in from the sides. The wound above make take 3 weeks to cover the bone with granulation tissue, less if you can get some apposition when your bandage. If you are still getting bad odors and purulent exudate you need to be cleaning the wound twice daily.
I am concerned about the damage to the flexor tendon sheath seen in the images above and the joints of the pastern. Because of the involvement of these structures I would recommend you get a wider spectrum antibiotic by adding an aminoglycoside to the penicillin or perhaps switching to Naxcel. I would also check your dosage and frequency of penicillin to be sure they are adequate. The diarrhea alone is a caution but not absolute contraindication to your antibiotic use.
Good luck I have actually found foals, if handled firmly but with care, come out of these events better mannered and friendlier than those not treated.
DrO
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Member:
Bravo
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 1, 2006 - 9:22 am:
Goodness - babies are all the same! We had one almost identical this year - but she first got her head suck in the non climb mesh wire fence - then she put her front left leg in to help get the head out LOL - she was a mess - we had a 6 inch v shaped to the bone area of skin hanging on her face - had to stitch that up - don't laugh but we used honey on her face --- she learned to lick my hand and really enjoyed the experience. On the leg we used calcium alginate pads with cotton over and wrapped in vet wrap. We hydrated daily when we changed the dressing. She did not develop any proud flesh - it was amazing ---- after we stopped getting yuck on the bandage we changed to hyDrOsorb pads, cotton and vet wrap. It is still getting smaller every day and she is a doll to work with now. We moved her out of the herd in a big pen (she can see her buddies but is not able to rough around.) and stalled at night so she started to rely on us as her new herd. BJ is a yearling so old enough to do this with. We also used Naxcel - great stuff!
Our very best! JJ
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Member:
Sonoita
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 1, 2006 - 10:41 am:
When I give antibiotics I give probiotics. I also do the same for myself. My doctor told me to do this. And it does work. For me and my horses .
Happy Trails,
Wanda
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Member:
Hezajet
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 1, 2006 - 11:28 am:
Hello Catherine, Thank you for the before and after pics. What a lovely foal ! and I too give a thumbs up on the Naxcel and probiotics.
We have also used the human ointment for burns to help numb and ease pain. Hydrating as much as possible, I can not advise enough. Keeping the areas cleaned, salved and very important, wrapped (also supporting the other leg/s)..........Water is our friend and theirs, as it cleans, massages and helps with circulation and healing..... as this guy heals and grows the scarring will hardly be noticeable. The constant handling in a quiet yet firm manner will also help in giving this foal excellent manners and trust in it's human handlers/trainers.
We will keep you and yours in our Prayers and hope the best for you & your charge. Please keep us updated.
Warm Wishes sent,
VL
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 1, 2006 - 6:52 pm:
Hi all,
Naxcel does not seem to be available here in Ireland as either a powder or injectable so I will start him on a potentiated sulpha drug tomorrow. He had been getting Gentamycin for a week as well as Neopenicillin, the crystalline penicllin was just used to flush the wounds out. They look a bit better I think tody but it is so hard to tell.The left hind wound which is not pictured but was a deep wire cut below the back of the fetlock is also causing problems now. Initially I think it was rather like a puncture wound as we did not see it when we were cleaning him up. That whole leg was stone cold and we thought that the circulation might be seriously compromised but it was not his worst problem at that time. However he did regain the circulation then 2 days ago the whole lower limb became very hot and inflammed so I poulticed it and another HUGE gaping wound has appeared, I suppose the good thing is that it is now open and draining but that leaves only one good leg!!!! Thank you all for your thoughts and prayers, I hope this gets easier because at the moment it takes two people to hold "splodge" and one to clean and dress the wounds and the whole procedure takes nearly two hours and is destroying my already dodgy back. I will take some photos over the next few days to update you.
Thanks Catherine
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Member:
Djws
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 1, 2006 - 10:23 pm:
Catherine-
Beautiful colt!
You, your family, and this baby are in my thoughts and prayers.
DJ
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Wednesday, Aug 2, 2006 - 6:38 pm:
Thank you DJ, your thoughts mean a lot at this time,
Catherine
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Member:
Mrose
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Posted on Thursday, Aug 3, 2006 - 10:47 pm:
Catherine, this is the first chance I've had to read your posts; a few problems around here have been keeping me too busy to get to the computer.
What a gem of a foal! Poor baby, and poor you. How is he doing? And you?
I've never had an eye injury thank goodness, but did have a foal tear his leg upon from inside groin area all the way to the fetlock with all the muscles, tendons, etc. torn. It took a lot of time, but he not only recovered, he was left with just the smallest scar on the inside of his hock. The healing ability the young horse has is amazing. Good luck with him! There are some good chats here regarding bandaging, etc. that might be of interest, btw.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 6, 2006 - 9:06 am:
Thanks Sara,
A brief update on Splodge. His eye is 100% better thank goodness, and and least one wound is healing well. All the wounds are hosed daily then I use Intrasite before rebandaging. I am also injecting him iv with Norodine daily which has really cleared up the residual infection and he is a lot brighter and more active now. It is strange though, he will only let me hold him and even falls asleep when I am holding him for his hosing and dressing change. With anyone else he is impossible. He has his quirks though, the front leg seems to be the sorest and he will only allow it to be dressed if he is lying down! The wound with the bone exposed still looks gruesome but there is a lot of healthy granulation tissue even though the bone can still be seen. My biggest problem curently is that he had a lot of "minor" scrapes as well, but as they form scabs he chews the scabs off and reopens them. I cannot put a cradle on him as he is sucking, so the best I can do is put Sudocreme on to try and keep the scabs soft and flexible and hopefully not itchy, has anyone any other suggestions? Thank you all for your help, reading other accounts here of horses that have survived terrible injuries has given me hope where at the beginning there really was none. Catherine
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Member:
Erika
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 6, 2006 - 12:55 pm:
Oh, sweet baby trusting you like that! For the small scabs Neosporin tastes bad and will keep scabs soft and uninfected. I don't know if that will help or not, depends on how sensitive he is to the taste, I guess.
Keep up the good work, it sounds like he is well on his way.
Erika
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Member:
Hwood
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 6, 2006 - 1:13 pm:
Catherine, I just now looked at your original post and the photos. What an awful ordeal for all of you. You have done wonderfully with your baby. Good for you. Please, if you can, post new photos of the little fella.
I have a question that I don't see asked in this discussion . . . What kind of stud fence did you have? I know you said "woven," but there are lots of kinds of woven fence.
Thanks and best wishes on the colt's continued recovery.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 6, 2006 - 4:38 pm:
Hi Holly,
We totally refenced the farm this year with stud fencing especially designed to be safe for foals! It cost thousands to do and I could not recommend it now. Previously we used bull wire strained between wooden posts, which is just a plain wire with no barbs and we never had any problems. We changed to diamond mesh fencing with white tape on top. Foals are supposed to bounce off it if they hit it but apparently if they get their legs through the diamonds it slices them like cheese wire. We are going to plant mile of white thorn hedging along it now to prevent a reoccurence. I will look up Neosporin, thanks Erika.
Catherine
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Member:
Hwood
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 6, 2006 - 4:55 pm:
Thank you, Catherine. I, too, have heard that Diamond V-Mesh Fencing is one of the safest kinds. Will the manufacturer pay for the vet costs of your foal's accident? Maybe if you told them that you are a member of HA and that hundreds of other horse owners read and discuss these kinds of issues, they will reconsider their advertising. I know that wherever horses are, accidents will happen, but it is a shame to put your trust in a manufacturer and then have such a terrible, scarring accident to one of your dependents.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 6, 2006 - 6:46 pm:
Hi Holly,
I phoned the manufacturer on the day of the accident and he said he would send a team out the following day to investigate and repair the damage (we actually had to cut the foal out as the wire had tightened onto his legs with his thrashing). Needless to say they have not arrived and it is 2 weeks later. These people are agents for the fencing system and a friend who saw the fences thinks that they have used a cheaper finer wire and not the expensive one we paid for!!! This will be an ongoing saga I think.
Catherine
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Member:
Sureed
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 6, 2006 - 11:19 pm:
Catherine, you need to document everything with photos and get back to the original manufacturer and seller of the fencing to you.
This is just not acceptable!! We will all protest to the company if they do not respond appropriately!
Suzanne
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Member:
Paul303
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Posted on Monday, Aug 7, 2006 - 12:32 am:
Ooooooh....Catherine, call the company and tell them that you want the name of the company's president (CEO, head hancho, whatever ). Explain that the people you worked with were so wonderful that you want to write a letter to the TOP, no middle man. Tell them you want to make sure the head of the company gets the letter personally, because it's important HE knows when he has exceptional employees. If you lay the praise on thick enough, you usually get an "inside" address. That is, the address that makes it to the top person. Just mark the envelope "personal" or "attn". Sending it registered or certified return receipt doesn't work so well. It makes them nervous.
Then just tell your story....pictures and all ( just make sure it fits in an ordinary business envelope - larger envelopes are a "red flag"). Don't threaten anything, or place any blame. Let them wonder at the purpose of your letter. Just state the facts and maybe ask politely if they realized that their product could cause this kind of damage. No need to state your anger or upset, it will be apparent from your pictures.
Then let us know what happens.......since we all buy fencing, I'm sure we'll all be interested.
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Member:
Hwood
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Posted on Monday, Aug 7, 2006 - 8:39 am:
How awful for you and the foal if fraud is the cause of this terrible accident. On the other hand, if a cheaper product is the culprit, then that means that Diamond-V Mesh might be safe, after all. I would cut a sample of the fence that you have on your property, too . . . and measure it and write down the specifications . . . along with all your photos, and take it to a distributor to compare with Diamond-V Mesh. Would the Better Business Bureau be a good resource at this point?
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Monday, Aug 7, 2006 - 6:16 pm:
Hi,
I live in Ireland and the fencing is just called Diamond Mesh here and the distributor did send a team out today while I was at work, however my husband was here luckily. They said that it was not their mesh but a cheaper copy and that this was not the first complaint that they have had. They said that they will not use the guy who sold it to me anymore and that if I take legal action against him that they will back me up. They seem to think that just threatening action will be enough! I am not sure if it will but I will set the process in motion. Thank you all for your support, Catherine
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Member:
Hwood
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Posted on Monday, Aug 7, 2006 - 9:30 pm:
Hopefully, the true Diamond-V Mesh would have kept your foal safe. For all the money you spent to have the genuine brand, you should at least get that and the vet expenses for your foal. I know that court cases can take forever, but if the company will back you up, maybe it will help with the outcome. I don't understand why the company doesn't take the fellow to court since their reputation and product's reputation has been damaged.
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Member:
Tipper
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 8, 2006 - 10:26 am:
Hi,
I'm glad the company came out but I am wondering if they are simply trying to pass the buck. If they already knew the guy was substituting cheaper mesh why were they still using him? I would definitely talk to a lawyer before deciding who should be sued.
We have the plain bull-wire fence but ran a single strand of horseguard tape around the top. It was fairly inexpensive and very easy to install. I wouldn't trust it as my only fencing but did teach ours to respect the bull-wire.
Here's their website:
https://horseguardfence.com/
How is the foal doing?
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 8, 2006 - 7:27 pm:
Hi Martha,
I really am regretting replacing the bull wire now. I am not well myself at the moment and really do not relish a fight with a fencing company but I will see what happens. The foal is holding his own, he is losing weight but I think that the antibiotics are not really agreeing with him as he is sucking well and is in good form otherwise. His wounds are healing slowly but on two of his legs abscesses have formed and are near bursting now which must be very sore. These are away from the original injuries so I presume infection may have tracked up to them or else some original bruising may have become infected and is now clearing out. It is disheartening though as it seems as if we will never be finished dressing wounds every night. I reckon it is costing about 35 euro every day for his dressings, intrasite and antibiotics. Claiming the vet expenses for the foal could be tricky Holly as I am actually a vet myself though I do mostly government work, I do not think I could have afforded to save this foal if I had not been able to do a lot of it myself and buy all the dressings and drugs at cost. I will try and take more photos but it is usually dark by the time I get a chance to do his legs as it literally takes hours to do when you include the hosing down.
Catherine
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Thursday, Aug 10, 2006 - 7:48 pm:
update pics of foal,
Sorry about the quality but took them tonight. Have finished antibiotics and hoping not to have to do another course. Lots of granulation tissue but still some exudation. Bone barely visible now.
First pic, worst wound with bone exposed, lateral left hind
Second pic, front right leg, an abscess has just appeared and burst behind the knee too.
third pic, behind left hind pastern, this was the hidden wound which only appeared later, initially there was nothing to be seen but when it opened up the ligaments were exposed, however foal appears sound on it so we are hoping for the best.
fourth pic, inside right hind wound
fifth pic, not a pair of hindlegs for dancing! see how he nearly severed the left hind completely!.
Catherine
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Member:
Paul303
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Posted on Friday, Aug 11, 2006 - 1:16 am:
Thank you so very much for the pictures. It's pictures like these that let us know the truly amazing healing properties of horses, and that sometimes, seemingly impossible wounds do heal. Love to see some more if possible - it'd be great to see how it all turns out.
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Friday, Aug 11, 2006 - 8:04 am:
Very good Catherine,
It is amazing how quick foals granulate in. However more important than these pictures is whether the foal remains lame and how is the lameness changing? And what is your current daily treatment regimen?
I do not stop antibiotics until all the exposed tissue, expecially bone, is covered with granulation tissue.
DrO
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New Member:
Vwhite
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Posted on Friday, Aug 11, 2006 - 11:48 am:
Hi,
I also had a mare that was in a terrible pasture accident. She had a six inch laceration on her right hind with total bone exposure and a broken leg. She was at Ohio State for three weeks and when I brought her home she was still on SMZ-TMPs, Rifampin, Bute for pain and Probiotic paste at 15 grams orally every other day per my request. You must keep that good bacteria in her that your anti-biotics are killing off. Do not administer them at the same time. Wait 2-3 hours after the antibiotic to give probiotics. I would also watch the hosing. There is bacteria in water and you could be washing off new tissue. I would instead use a sterile saline solution and a syringe also a wound cleaner from your vet. I never touched my horses wound in fear of taking off new tissue or introducing infection.She was on antibiotics until she had a healthy bed of granulation tissue. That took about six weeks.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Friday, Aug 11, 2006 - 6:18 pm:
Thanks Dr O, I am thrilled with his progress. I am hosing for 20 minutes every evening then using Intrasite in the wounds and covering with Melolin, Fibrogee then Vetwrap. I gave a 7 day course of Trimethoprim sulpha but he HATES being injected so I felt that I would give him a break for a while and monitor closely. He has had Gentamicin, Penicillin and TMP-S now and presumably after 7 days of each they would have reached maximum efficacy, what antibiotic would you suggest next?
I am amazed at how rapidly he is healing and he is actually sound at the walk and has remained so, as he is confined to his stable he only walks from the washbox and back but, touch wood, he has a normal stride and elevation of each leg.
Thanks Vickie, I am doing a lot of those measures already but I am using pure water from our own well which is tested and exceptionally pure and I am using a new hose. Any bacteria that are living in clean water would not be pathogenic anyway but I find I can clean the wound much better with a hose.
Catherine
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Saturday, Aug 12, 2006 - 10:59 am:
I would continue with the oral TMP-SMZ Catherine. I am unfamiliar with what you are putting on the wounds however, what are the active ingredients. Vickie there is no concern about washing away healthy tissue with a hose. If it is healthy it will adhere to the underlying tissues. The main place where there are pathogens is on the open wound and a hose under pressure does an amazing job of cleaning such a wound. For more on this see the article associated with this discussion, Long Term Deep Wound Care. You can access it off the navigation frame at the top of this page.
DrO
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 13, 2006 - 7:05 pm:
Thanks Dr O, Intrasite is a wound debriding and desloughing gel
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Monday, Aug 14, 2006 - 6:50 am:
What are the ingredients and concentration Catherine? Debriding and de-sloughing are really opposite aspects of wound care and I wonder what product does both? If your photos are any indication it certainly seems to stimulate granulation tissue.
DrO
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Monday, Aug 14, 2006 - 5:42 pm:
Hi, sorry I meant to type slougher but put the "de" in front accidentally. Intrasite is a human ulcer medication and contains water, propyline glycol and starch co-polymer in a gel formulation. This evening the bone has completely granulated over and that wound looks really healthy now. The other wounds are actually healing as in shrinking and flat and ndry (as in not oozy or shiny). My only concern is that a couple of abscesses have tracked under the skin but at least they have burst now. Strangely enough the fetlock on his one good leg is inflammed and I would say I have another abscess there so I am poulticing it to encourage it to burst out and not go into the joint. The foal is putting on weight and even tried to buck tonight!! Thank you for your help, the water therapy has been a revelation and I think the intrasite has also been a turning point,
Catherine
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Member:
Paul303
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 15, 2006 - 1:07 am:
Oh!, My goodness! Can't believe I'm so excited! Any chance of pictures? Any chance the good leg is reacting to the extra usage?
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 15, 2006 - 7:57 am:
The one thing that has been unusual about your case is the trouble with abscessing. I do not usually see such problems with large open wounds of this type. Researching the Intrasite it is a sterile preparation similar to what we use for lubrication when we do rectals or what you might find in KY jelly but without a specific antimicrobial. The propylene glycol is probably bacteriostatic. I wonder if the lack of specific topical antimicrobial therapy contributed? I notice on their site they talk about mixing antimicrobials with their preparation. It may be that there were many small wounds that sealed up and would have occurred no matter what.
One consideration might be that once the wounds are granulated in, you do not want to promote further granulation and propylene glycol is thought to stimulate it. If you start having lots of trouble with proud flesh you might consider other topical therapy.
DrO
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New Member:
Vwhite
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 15, 2006 - 10:01 am:
Catherine,
When my mare had her similar injury I used a product that is a growth hormone called Lacerum and another product called Kymar. It is important that you use them at the correct time in the healing process. My mare had no problem with proud flesh and she had to grow all new skin across the front of her leg. You could ask your vet about them or maybe Dr.O could comment.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 15, 2006 - 6:19 pm:
Thanks Dr O and Vicki, I will look those up tonight. I was worried about proudflesh too so I have continued with the hosing but am only using the Intrasite from yesterday on the worst wound and then only every second day. The hind leg which is abscessating at the moment was the one he had lain on all night and circulation did not return fully to it for a good 24 hours. This is the leg which produced the surprise deep wound on the posterior fetlock, therefore I presume that their was at least pressure necrosis and every little bruise is potentially another abscess- in -waiting. However on the plus side his pulse and sensitivity reflexes etc are normal on that leg now so I am hopeful that it will be ok. I will take more photos on Thursday as that will be a week after the last ones and any advice is deeply appreciated.
Catherine
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Member:
Hwood
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 15, 2006 - 6:36 pm:
Great job on the care of your little one . . . and thank you for the photos. How is his eye healing up? Any other developments with the fencing company?
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 15, 2006 - 7:51 pm:
Hi Holly, his eye is perfect thank you. No word on the fencing yet either way as letters are being exchanged, will keep you posted. Found the Lacerum website and it sounds a really good product. Does not seem to be available in Ireland though and as EIA was brought in here recently through foal serum I cannot see them allowing me to bring a blood product in. Has anyone any experience of importing it? I cannot find Kymar in any of my Vet compendiums or on the 'net, does it go by any other name or who makes it. Thanks Catherine
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Wednesday, Aug 16, 2006 - 5:34 pm:
more pics of the foal. One wound, the right hind posterior pastern wound has healed so well that I did not bandage it this evening. I just hosed it and then used a wound spray on it. I am using Fucidin cream on the other wounds now to slow down the granulation tissue. The wounds look a little red and bloody because I had a client come into the yard while I was hosing him, he was left for 20mins and he chewed the wounds! Dr O, do you think that this is adequate at this stage or is there anything else I should be doing? He feels so well that he trotted out of the stable today and he looks sound to me. I will keep my fingers crossed. See the ruptured abscess above the knee, nasty but draining well.
Catherine
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Member:
Hwood
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Posted on Wednesday, Aug 16, 2006 - 6:17 pm:
Great news, Catherine, about him feeling well enough to trot . . . Those abscesses are pretty gross, aren't they? Glad they are draining, though. What a relief for the foal. It is hard to tell what kinds of scars will be left behind from all of these injuries. I hope they will be minimal with all your good care.
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Member:
Sonoita
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Posted on Thursday, Aug 17, 2006 - 3:00 pm:
Man oh man what what a mess that fence made of that baby. I hope his progress continues and with little or no side affects. Thanks for the learning experience. GOOD LUCK !! What does splodge mean? Is that his name?
Happy Trails,
Wanda
And quick healing.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Friday, Aug 18, 2006 - 2:12 pm:
Hi Wanda, yes splodge is his nickname, the kids called him that because his white blaze is more a splodge of paint than a blaze,
Catherine
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Member:
Qh4me
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Posted on Friday, Aug 25, 2006 - 1:14 pm:
Hi Catherine,
Just wondering how Splodge is doing? I hope he is continueing to make good progress! He is such a beautiful foal.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Saturday, Aug 26, 2006 - 9:51 am:
Hi Shawna, I will post more photos later. He is doing really well, in great form, bucking around the stable and he has fallen in love with my daughter and follows her everywhere but he hates my husband because he has been the one doing most of the dressings etc. It is a long slow process and I think that we might have proud flesh issues so I will be grateful for input when I post new pictures later (have to go and buy batteries for camera)
Catherine
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Member:
Corinne
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Posted on Saturday, Aug 26, 2006 - 11:26 am:
Great for Splodge! Keep up the good work being his nurse. Can't wait to see pics when he is finally healed up and while I hope you find resolution with the fencing company maybe brining the bad dealer to light is the best you can do if litigation, which might be costly and lengthy and stressful is too much. You do what you can....and you have warned over 2000 people and however many who google this site to be prepared for possible frauds! Good on you too for brining this scammer to light!
All the best luck with the rest of the healing.
v.r
Corinne
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 27, 2006 - 7:32 pm:
New pictures, Hi all, really pleased with progress, all the wounds are healing well. Can you believe the one that had bone exposed, it looks fantastic. The strange bump behind the knee is a bit nasty still but we can live with that. Apologies for the shaky pictures but two hound puppies were trying to knock me over at the same time!
Catherine
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Member:
36541
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 27, 2006 - 8:54 pm:
Utterly amazing and impressive - so many congratulations! Its been said here before that the ones you really fight for usually turn out to be something extra special. That is certainly my hope for you guys. Stacy
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Member:
Paul303
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Posted on Sunday, Aug 27, 2006 - 10:58 pm:
Hooray for you and hooray for Splodge! He's got to be quite a healthy guy to heal that rapidly and that well. A real testament to your daily care and your medical care. Kudos to your husband!
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Monday, Aug 28, 2006 - 8:17 am:
Hello Catherine, I apologize I missed your earlier request for feed back, but I think your questions have been answered by the results. You got great contraction of the granulation bed.
A problem with the wound behind the knee is excessive granulation tissue, this needs trimming back so as to get the skin closed ASAP to lessen the size of the knot forming under the skin.
DrO
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Member:
Mrose
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Posted on Monday, Aug 28, 2006 - 9:00 am:
Catherine, such good progress! I'm so glad your foal is progressing so good. He's had good care.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Sep 3, 2006 - 5:27 pm:
new photos.
Hi Dr 0, Seems to be some excess granulation tissue on the lateral left hind. As this was the wound that went to the bone I am reluctant to interfere too much in case I stir up any latent infection. How long should I give it until I trim off the excess tissue?
The abscess behind the knee is still draining so I am poulticing it every second or third day at this stage but it still looks nasty.
The foal has begun to grow again and is in really good form, he now thinks he is a little stallion!
Catherine
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Member:
Canter
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Posted on Sunday, Sep 3, 2006 - 8:07 pm:
Wow, Catherine. It's amazing to watch the progression of the photos. You've done an incredible job doctoring this little guy. Kudos to you!
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Monday, Sep 4, 2006 - 3:26 pm:
Thanks Fran but it is such a long haul. I would love to be able to let him out into a paddock for at least a little while every day but I think he would only undo all our work. Shame as summer is over.
Catherine
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Monday, Sep 4, 2006 - 4:46 pm:
There are no special issues because it went to the bone, the longer you wait to trim it the larger the scar will be. You should consider having the wound that continues to drain checked for complications like, poor drainage from a pocket of infection, a foreign body, or possible a piece of broken and dead bone. This might include a thorough exploration of the wound and radiography.
DrO
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Member:
Luvmyqh
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Posted on Tuesday, Sep 5, 2006 - 12:09 am:
Hi Catherine -
I can not even begin to tell you how much I can sympathize with your situation - in March of this year, we pulled a severely injured yearling filly from a feedlot in Colorado. Both of her back legs were gashed straight to the bones. The good news is that it is now September and she is fully healed with no resulting lameness, but the haul was hard and long for her and for us. The whole situation is documented on our website www.celticreinrescue.org (Trinity - Injured Filly Page) and recent and updated pictures of her wound now are in her online photo diary that you can see at:
https://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v617/luvmyqh/Trinity/
As Dr.O said, we kept her on antibiotics until the bone was covered, and I don't know how he feels about this, but once the bone was covered, we did not wrap any longer - as long as the swelling was kept to a minimum, and it was. She was allowed in a small turn out which really helped her not to swell. We also hosed her 2x's a day, keeping the areas free from any debris on or around the wounds, and using a aluminum powder based spray that adheres to cuts, scrapes and wounds and helps to keeps dirt and bacteria out while allowing the wound to heal and breathe. I have to say that this stuff was amazing, and after the initial procedure to remove the proud flesh, we didn't have to do it again - it was kept at bay and she healed wonderfully. I can ask my vet exactly what it was if you'd like, or maybe Dr.O knows of it? You can see the silver on her wounds in the pictures.
Also, I have to say that she is now one of the easiest babies I've ever had to handle - she had so much hands on care that there is nothing that phases her now and nothing that you can't do with her.
Best of luck with your little guy, I hope he heals well and goes on to do great things!
Stephany
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Saturday, Sep 9, 2006 - 7:28 pm:
Hi Stephany, sorry it has taken so long to reply but the monitor went funny on my computer and I had to replace it. I am dong very much as you suggested, as the woulds have healed I have left them unbandaged and just used Aluspray on them which is probably the same spray you talk about, you can just see it on the wound below the heel on the last two sets of pictures. My biggest problem is that he is inclined to chew the wounds and I have to keep any that seem to irritate him bandaged.
Hi Dr O, i X-RAYED the ever increasing lump behind the knee but nothing showed up other than soft tissue inflammation. I am poulticing it with a cold poultice every second day and it is still draining. I will have to be brave I think and explore it and remove the granulomatous tissue on the other leg at the same time. I find it so hard to dispassionately treat my own horses, I have no hesitation with anyone elses but I worry that mine might not like me anymore! Am I a wimp or what. Let me know what you think with todays picures. The wound below the knee is incredible, it is virtually closed now. The pictures were taken before I hosed the leg down so they look a bit gungy,
Catherine
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Member:
Djws
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Posted on Saturday, Sep 9, 2006 - 11:09 pm:
Catherine-
You can take care of my horses anytime! What a great job you have done (amazing)! Keep up the good work!
I keep you, and your little guy in my prayers.
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Member:
Mrose
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Posted on Saturday, Sep 9, 2006 - 11:47 pm:
Catherine, Splodge is looking so much better. I'm so glad that he is healing up so good. I'm sure that all the time you've spent on the little guy has built a special bond between you. I'm glad he's feeling like a "little stallion." He should at his age; he's feeling good again. Hooray!
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Member:
Erika
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Posted on Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 - 12:18 am:
WOW, Catherine. You are amazing getting this foal through all this.
I think of you both often, and am hoping for the best of outcomes!
Erika
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 - 9:08 am:
Has the wound behind the knee quit draining Catherine?
DrO
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 - 5:26 pm:
Fantastic news! Splodge went out today for the first time since his accident and he appears sound. We let him out into the paddock for a few hours and he really enjoyed himself, when we brought him in he lay down and slept as he was exhausted with all the excitement!
Dr O, that wound is still draining and appears to be the exit point for a tract that I would say started around the original wound below the knee which was really filthy when he was found. The first photos don't actually show clearly just how deep or nasty that wound was.
I am only bandaging the hind leg at night now with Fucidin cream to slow down granulation but I am leaving the leg to the air during the day, though being hosed twice daily of course.
I think there is a bit of laxity in the ligaments of that left hind though I think they will strengthen over time.
Thank you all for your thoughts and prayers, they mean so much to us.
I am coming to the states next month to go to the Fairhill 3 day event in Philadelphia so if any of you live nearby I would love to meet up!
Catherine
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Member:
Paul303
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Posted on Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 - 5:40 pm:
Gosh, what a job! Would love to know how the knee turns out....is it tender to the touch?
I've got to check Fairhill, I'm near....my problem is I'm tied to my farm right now. My neighbor is ill and I'm trying to care for both our places. What a treat it would be...
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Sep 10, 2006 - 6:16 pm:
Hi Lee,
Yes the knee is tender but no more than you would expect. Before it burst it was extremely sore but now it just seems to irritate him, he wants to scratch and bite at it so we keep it covered.
Fairhill is on from the 20th to 22nd October if you are free!
Catherine
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Member:
Erika
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Posted on Monday, Sep 11, 2006 - 7:13 am:
Hi Catherine, will you be riding at Fair Hill?
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Monday, Sep 11, 2006 - 7:59 am:
Catherine it behaves like there is some nidus for infection and whether it will clean itself up by itself is anyones guess. In the meantime it generates increased amounts of granulation tissue and possibly could back up infection into deeper tissues. The radiographs did not help, I would consult with my vet about further possible diagnostic/therapeutic procedures available: flushing with antimicrobials? injecting radiographic contrast media? surgical exploration following staining of the tract? other?
DrO
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Monday, Sep 11, 2006 - 1:17 pm:
Hi Dr O, kind of embarrassing for me as I am a vet but I always find it hard to be logical with my own animals. As Splodge so nearly died several times on me when I was patching him up that first day I have a morbid fear of anaesthetizing him now in case anything went wrong. Believe me I would not be forgiven at home by my thirteen year old daughter!! I may bring him over to a colleague this week and let them do it (I am a chicken). He would need a short acting general as he is very sensitive about the knee area and very insensitive to sedatives.
Hi Erika, no I am not riding but there are a couple of horses we bred and a couple we broke and sold competing apparently. Are you going to be there?
Catherine
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Tuesday, Sep 12, 2006 - 6:42 am:
I know what you mean. It is hard when the animal is your own and not a specie you work with regularly, I send my dogs and cats up to my small animal associate and I take care of her horses, but then again I have since she was a preteen in 4H.
Unfortunately xylazine / ketamine is a bit shorter acting in foals than it is in adults do to more rapid metabolism, but hard to beat for safety. I have found adding a touch of torbugesic to the xylazine really can add profoundly to the degree of sedation in foals to the point that they will often lay down with sedation alone. However if you cannot get the area blocked well, I would go ahead and knock them all the way out.
DrO
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Tuesday, Sep 19, 2006 - 6:41 pm:
update on Splodge. News is mostly good! His original wounds are completely healed, I took pics but the light was bad and only the one shown here came out. This was the wound on the inside of the bad leg and since this photo the scab has dried up and fallen off. The worst wound that was open to the bone is completely healed and has healthy fresh pink skin and no proud flesh and the knee is completely healed too. The original injuries happened on July 24th this year so that is only 8 weeks for complete healing, amazing. The abscess behind the knee is a bit more troublesome. A colleague of mine, Liz, came to stay at the weekend and so we anaesthetized Splodge and excised the abscess. We got quite a bit of drainage and it was very swollen and sore for a couple of days but he is sound on it now and there is no more swelling. However it is a large wound and though deflated looking it is still quite disfiguring. It is an awful shame as he would be back out in the field by now if it wasn't for this, shame I did not act sooner! I am on the right of the photo and Liz is on the left. My son took the picture as he thought it was hilarious that instead of going out on a saturday night as two NORMAL old friends would do, instead we play doctor and nurse.
Dr O I read on one of your posts that you suggested using Baytril. I would like to give a blast of a really strong antibiotic as I am afraid of cellulitis or even infection of joint sheaths here but I have never used Baytril in a horse before. What dose would you use in a 175kg foal and by what route and over how many days. It is only licensed for cattle in Ireland so I have never been brave enough to use it.
Thanks Catherine
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Member:
Djws
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Posted on Tuesday, Sep 19, 2006 - 11:04 pm:
So happy for you, and Splodge! Isn't it wonderful how babies bounce back? Don't beat yourself up over his abcess...he'll be out in the field racing around soon!
Cute picture! How old is your son? Sounds like something my youngest would say-LOL!
Friends have all things in common-PLATO
Take care...will you keep you both in my prayers!
DJ
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Wednesday, Sep 20, 2006 - 9:37 am:
Catherine, any indication why this abscess did not resolve on its own? Concerning Baytril or any of the fluoroquinolones, they should not be used in indiviuals that are still growing. We have more on this at Treatments and Medications for Horses » Antibiotics and Antimicrobials » Baytril (Enrofloxacin) and the Fluoroquinolones. On the antibiotic page you will find other recommendations. Maybe I am old-hat but I still like pen / aminoglycoside preparations for foals with serious infections, using the once daily therapy regimen for the aminoglycoside. Many of the younger vets are reaching for the cephalosporins for use in foals.
DrO
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Wednesday, Sep 20, 2006 - 11:36 am:
Thanks Dr 0, I agree with you, that is my favourite regime as well and I am currently using Gentamicin with Pen/strep. I am probably being overcautious as the infection does seem under control now. I will take some photos this evening and see what you think.
Catherine
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Wednesday, Sep 20, 2006 - 8:27 pm:
Hi DJ, my son is 11. I have not taken a picture of the knee abscess as the batteries keep dying in the camera. I should have posted this picture the other day, amazing isn't it. I think that there will be hardly any scarring at all and Splodge is 100% sound. Now that he is getting to the paddock every day he has really strengthened up and the ligaments do not seem lax anymore. I am also giving him 20mls of Megabase daily just in case.
Dr O I have sent a draft for a presentation on this case for the Irish Equine Veterinary Conference, I hope that is ok with you as I have credited you for the pressurised water treatment which has caused a miraculous recovery. I think that a regime based upon the water therapy and including the use of Intrasite, Fucidin cream and Aluminium spray at the appropriate stages is a very easily followed regime to treat contaminated wounds that gives rapid healing with little granulation tissue and scarring. I hope that you do not think that this is too presumptious of me (and the presentation probably won't be accepted anyway). I cannot thank you enough as without your help I think the outcome would have been very different.
Catherine
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Wednesday, Sep 20, 2006 - 8:31 pm:
oops forgot to post the picture of the worst wound, look at this in awe at the power of the HA site!!!!
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Member:
Mrose
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Posted on Wednesday, Sep 20, 2006 - 10:37 pm:
This looks great! Now, how about another picture of the whole foal?
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Member:
Paul303
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Posted on Thursday, Sep 21, 2006 - 3:12 am:
I'm so happy! What a job! What a job!
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Member:
Imogen
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Posted on Thursday, Sep 21, 2006 - 5:32 am:
Catherine you are awesome! I have to say having read this whole thread for the first time today that I suspected about half way down that you were a professional of some description... but the key thing for me is that you combined the best attributes of a dedicated horse owner and patient nursing abilities with your veterinary knowledge and the resources of HA to get these results. Sounds like your husband was pretty dedicated too!
I hope you will talk about HA briefly in your presentation at the conference. I think that a lot more Irish horseowners would use it if they knew about it. There have been one or two in the past but I'm the only "regular".
Dr O will confirm that my own vet (I'm sure you know him, John Hyde) has also been saved quite a few annoying telephone queries by the fantastic information available, so tell them that getting their clients to use HA will also cut down on those time consuming query calls from worried owners!
I hope you find the time and energy to go after the fence contractor. I am of the opinion that good old stone ditches with tough brambles are the best fencing for horses but that's not realistic in a stud situation.
All the best
Imogen
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Thursday, Sep 21, 2006 - 8:02 am:
I feel honored Catherine, thank you very much. Concerning the use of topicals, as long as they are tissue friendly and effectively bacteriostatic (though I prefer cidal meds), I don't think it matters that much what you use. I get the same results that you have above with straight Povidone ointment or chlorhexidine creams. I am convinced it is the ability of the hose to deliver water at pressure that is critical to these good results.
DrO
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Member:
Green007
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Posted on Thursday, Sep 21, 2006 - 9:27 am:
Outstanding! Three cheers for Splodge!
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Member:
Tangoh
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Posted on Thursday, Sep 21, 2006 - 11:02 am:
And for Catherine likewise! What a lucky foal to have you administer to his injuries. I haven't posted on this thread before but I have been following it and I am continually impressed with the knowledge and advice given by Dr. O and other members and the persistence and dedication that Catherine had towards this foal's recovery. This entire thread was like a mini equine education to me. Thanks everyone.
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Thursday, Sep 21, 2006 - 5:57 pm:
Thank you all so much, it is not much good being a professional if like me you fall to pieces when it is your own horse. The site has been great, until I read about Dr O'S water therapy I was in deep despair as the wound seemed to be basically rotting away but from the 10th day when I decided to give it a go I have been amazed at the results and I would not use anything else now, so once again Dr O, a huge big thank you from both Splodge and I. If my presentation is accepted I will mention HA as well of course. I have to say I liked the Intrasite though as well, before I used it I was just using damp sterile swabs to keep the exposed bone moist without much good effect. The Intrasite did seem to encourage healthy tissue cells to slide over the defect as it were though as you suggest something bacteriocidal would probably have been better and next time I may mix something with the Intrasite. I think if I had used the correct treatment from the start he would not have got the abscesses, but then again if that was the case he would be out in the field now and I think I am happier with him in the stable in this Hurricane!
Hi Imogen, I know John Hyde by reputation (the highest) but I live near Mullingar, quite a distance from you. Maybe we should have a mini HA gathering over here?
I will take a picture of all of Splodge over the weekend and post it. Oh by the way Dr O I keep meaning to look at the Spot On box in the yard but of course forget about it when I am there. will look tomorrow. Thanks again, Catherine
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Member:
Ajudson1
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Posted on Thursday, Sep 21, 2006 - 9:18 pm:
First time I read ALL of this, and was brave enough to look at the pictures.
You and Splodge are both brave and did a great job.
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Member:
Imogen
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Posted on Friday, Sep 22, 2006 - 12:22 pm:
Catherine are you trekking to the Ploughing Championships in Carlow next week? I'm at a trade stand there if you are... by the way the initial picture of Splodge before the injury really caught my eye in terms of handsome foal - what is his breeding?
Best wishes
Imogen
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Friday, Sep 22, 2006 - 1:49 pm:
Hi Imogen, Not sure about Carlow, I intend to go but you know how things can be, depends on kids, horses work etc. What sort of stand do you have?
The foal is by Cruise On out of a Touchdown mare. The dam is a half sister to a stallion we bred called Special K who won the Boomerang and then the 5 and 6yo classes at the RDS. He was sold to Cornelia Guest in the states and jumped Internationally so we had high hopes for poor Splodge. Hope I see you next week,
Catherine
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Member:
Imogen
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Posted on Saturday, Sep 23, 2006 - 10:31 am:
That figures (Splodge's breeding) - no wonder you didn't want to put him down whatever about your daughter finding him so horribly injured!
I see Special K II in the IHB book, born 1992 with 203 showjumping points, by Glenagyle Rebel, dam by Celtic Barge, is that mare Splodge's grandam?
Anyway, I do contract admin work for the Chiropractic Association so you'll find me there, Duhallow tent (from the entrance, 3 tents after the ICA on the right hand side) I am hard to miss as I am 6 ft tall, shoulder length brown hair, 45 years old, distinct BBC accent, I'll be the one in charge of the computer and the complaints and I'll be there all week, love to meet you if you do make it.
All the best
Imogen
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Saturday, Sep 23, 2006 - 1:57 pm:
Hi Imogen, yes the Celtic Barge mare was Splodge's granddam. Her name was Camagh Lady and I bought her when she was 8yo because a farmer wanted her put down as she had laminitis. She was a lovely mare and repaid me so many times with great foals. Another daughter of hers Lets Cruise is a Grade A in England (sold to there as 3yo so not in IHR) and a full brother to Splodges dam is eventing very well over there too. As you work for the Chiropractic Association do you know a good friend of mine, Sean Wall (an american) he works in Dublin and does horses too? Hope to see you Catherine
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Member:
Imogen
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Posted on Monday, Sep 25, 2006 - 2:59 am:
Yes, I am not Sean's favourite person at the moment as I had to tell him and one other lady in Donegal recently that, as you may or may not know, the new Vet Act effectively makes all chiropractic treatment of animals illegal in Ireland.
I gather it is going to take an Oireachtas vote and therefore several years to amend the Act but the Vet Council registrar and the physios are on to it with the Dept of Ag... It seems to have had zero effect on how many physios and chiros are treating animals in practice. Do you know what the Veterinary Ireland view of it is at all? I'm assuming that they managed to get the ban into the Act but I have no idea of the history.
Sean isn't going to be there (we asked the Carlow/Kilkenny/Kildare chiros to man it) unfortunately.
All the best
Imogen
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Monday, Sep 25, 2006 - 1:49 pm:
Hi Imogen, yes I am aware of the new legislation and it is really putting the cat among the pigeons as it also means all those stud owners that do scanning and AI are also on the wrong side of the law. I thought that Equine chiropractors were ok as long as they were referred by a vet and had a proper degree ie not the weekend course kind of one, but a university degree, but I stand to be corrected on that one. Sorry to hear that Sean took that badly, he is very good at what he does though, I like him and think he is very skilled. Hope to see you next week,
Catherine
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Member:
Imogen
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Posted on Sunday, Oct 1, 2006 - 11:44 am:
Hi Catherine, sorry for the long gap due to a dodgy internet connection at the Ploughing...
According to the registrar of the Veterinary council ALL treatment and diagnosis of animals is now reserved to qualified vets - the situation you describe regarding qualified chiropractors or physiotherapists working under the direct supervision of a vet is what was in place up to 1 Jan 2006. I rang her (the registrar) to clarify the point a couple of weeks back.
I wonder what the farriers think? Since the Irish Farriery Authority is now established in law to comply with the relevant EU directive on farriery, presumably there is a little legal conflict there too... ?
Fond as I am of the excellent horse vets that I use, I would always start with the farrier's opinion and treatment of lameness unless I was absolutely sure that the lameness was not in the foot, and only move on to the vet if the farrier recommended it. That's not because I don't think that only qualified people should treat animals, it's because I think hooves and shoeing and a large proportion of lameness treatment are best handled by a farrier who specialises in that field.
Sorry to have missed you at the Ploughing - but the weather was appalling except for the middle two days, no fun if you were trailing kids... I saw Eurogenetics advertising for farmers to become AI technicians at the ploughing - presumably that whole profession is also now illegal since even scanning is strictly speaking diagnosis too! What a mess... it's not going to stop anyone doing anything but it will invalidate everyone's insurance which may prove problematic.
Imogen
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Member:
Kstud
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Posted on Sunday, Oct 1, 2006 - 3:05 pm:
Hi Imogen, sorry I did not make it to the ploughing. I had intended to go yesterday but the rain was torrential so I am afraid that I snuggled up under my duvet for a second much deserved sleep!I am not sure how the new veterinary legislation will pan out but a friend of mine on the Vet Council says that vet nurses and other ancillary workers eg Chiropractors are allowed under the new legislation. They cannot make a diagnosis, only treat under the direction of a vet. Farriers are dealt with under a different section. I agree with you about farriers but with one proviso, there is always a speciality bias and I have seen farriers insist that the problem is in the hoof when sometimes it is not. Fetlock problems and pastern problems can often cause confusion with the hoof and sometimes navicular problems are misdiagnosed as abscesses when an x-ray should be done. That said if it is a hoof problem then I would rather talk to my farrier first too. Mind you it is so hard to find a really good farrier. I am thinking of kidnapping one, plus a plumber, electrician and carpenter and keeping them locked up here!!!!
Catherine
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Member:
Imogen
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Posted on Tuesday, Oct 3, 2006 - 1:52 pm:
I was asking my farrier (I am extremely lucky to get Brian Williamson) last week why there aren't lots of Hungarian (for example) farriers moving into Ireland. He says that Irish and English farriery is so much better than what you find in Eastern Europe that they wouldn't survive here, and that in fact it is a reasonably well paid occupation in Eastern Europe so they don't have the pressure to emigrate of other trades.
I actually think that it's because the Eastern Europeans haven't yet noticed that unlike the UK they can shoe legally in Ireland without qualifications...
I am going to ring the Vet Council registrar again regarding your friend's comment above. As I said, I thought that the same situation had continued that your freind describes, but if you actually read the legislation there appears to be a drafting error and that is what the registrar said last time I spoke to her - maybe no-one has dared tell the vet council members yet!
Imogen
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