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  Discussion on How to tell if long-term bute is affecting kidneys?
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Member:
Brandi

Posted on Thursday, Dec 16, 2004 - 8:33 pm:

Dr. O,

I have a 21 yo QH with a plethora of arthritic/DJD type issues. At 8 he was diagnosed with pedal osteitis (I'm not exactly sure how to spell that), navicular "synDrOme", and some low-ringbone, along with a little synovitis. At 14 he started having some hock soreness and at 20 his rear fetlock joints began DrOpping. It all sounds awful, but all of the conditions have been well-managed, and along with Moon's excellent work ethic and his need to be doing something, he remained a busy pleasure, drill team, lesson horse and herd leader, until last year. I finally retired him to just weekend kid-lessons and herd leader.
He was on bute off and on for 10 years (before and/or after any strenuous work days), but only about 2 years ago did I finally put him on a daily dose of 1 g/day. He tolerates the drug very well.

Another important point is that this horse is a "heavy urinator", and has been his entire life--alfalfa is not allowed by me in his diet, since it increases both the already profuse quantity and the odor significantly, which I can't imagine is healthy for his kidneys.

My questions are:
1. What signs should I watch for to alert me that his kidney's might be having trouble with the bute?
2. If I wanted to let his system clear the bute, how long should I take him off of it?
3. I have been giving him Bute-less (B-L Solution) for years, even before the daily bute, and I read your post on not using the 2 together. Obviously this horse tolerates the products well, even given together. Is it necessary to stop if he's handling it well?
And lastly, why do you not like MSM for an anti-inflammatory? 2 of my vets support its use.

Please forgive me if you've answered these questions before, I spent a great deal of time scanning the posts and found tons of help--and got very caught up in all the info, but I'm sure I could have missed some of what I was looking for.
Thank you for your time and for such a great site
Brandi
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Friday, Dec 17, 2004 - 8:40 am:

Taking your questions by numbers:
1) In chronic toxicity cases, GI ulceration is usually the first sign and the article associated with this forum explains the type of monitoring suggested, see the Can We Detect Toxicity Before it Gets Serious? subtopic in the article.

If you wanted to monitor the kidneys the earliest signs of problems would be reflected in a decrease in urine specific gravity. This would require a small amount of very fresh or urine taken to the vets office to test.

2) Every 8 hours the amount of bute in the horses system halves.

3) It is not obvious that this is safe just because it has not resulted in problems yet. There is no scientific work that supports the idea that MSM is a effective anti-inflammatory medication in horses (or any species). Their support is not based on good science but purely anecdotal reports for more see, Care for Horses » Nutrition » Vitamins an Overview » Discussion on Information on MSM?. Though this discussion is 4 years old, nothing has been added to the scientific literature to change my opinion on MSM and I look frequently.
DrO
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