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  Discussion on Discomfort during collection
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Member:
Osakr

Posted on Sunday, Jan 21, 2007 - 5:48 am:

I have two stallions that have been collected numerous times over the last 8 years. No problems whatsoever. 10 days ago one of the stallion after mounting the dummy pulled back out of the AV . We changed all parameters (temp, liners, Av , pressure with no luck over the last week. When presented to a mare he covered her with no hesitation and showed no discomfort. 5 days ago the other stallion started doing the same and we went through the same routine but no luck. There is no sign of any skin irritation or any signs for anything for that matter. This is a disaster since it is the beginning of he breeding season. Have yo heard of anything similar.Thanks
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Sunday, Jan 21, 2007 - 8:41 am:

Hello Omar,
With both stallions behaving this way you would think it likely that there is something in common and since they breed mares with no hesitation, probably not something with the penis itself. But just because they mount mares does not mean I would rule out penis or even libido problems as I think it takes a bit more of it to mount a dummy. When all else failed sedation and careful examination would be on my list of to do’s.

I presume you have examined all the surfaces on the dummy and AV that the stallion comes into contact with. Have you felt it deeply maybe some sharp place has become a problem but only can be felt with deep pressure. How about the footing around the AV is it secure or is it slippery or shifts? Could he stallions feel unsafe? Have you checked your thermometer for accuracy? If it were reading low the AV may have been too hot or vice versa.

Though some guys regularly need an anvil up side their head, libido in easily handled stallions can be a fragile thing. Have there been any changes in handlers or handling technique? A little too rough in the barn may translate to hesitance in the breeding shed. This is a problem we frequently have with jack’s and have suspected in a stallion or two. How about the breeding area itself, is there anything different like other horses close by?

Are these stallions on or have they received any medications, particularly repositol forms of steroids, in the past 6 months? How about supplements.

I an just trying to come up with some not so obvious causes. And if I found nothing I would Until you figure this out I think I would procure a hand held AV and start collecting off of mares Omar. We also have a technique whereby you can collect a standing stallion but you will not get the sperm count of a more natural mount. Let me know what you find Omar. It is on the Horse Breeding & Artificial Insemination menu.
DrO
Member:
osakr

Posted on Sunday, Jan 21, 2007 - 3:08 pm:

Thank you for your timely response. To answer some of your question everything is the same as it was. We tried collecting them on mares and it also failed. The libido is fine and they are eager to mount the dummy but somehow through the process they rear and retract which ofcourse seems to point to the AV. I have three thermometers I use and the temp is fine. Chemical collection is definitely an option and both collect fine under this procedure but it is driving me nuts not to be able to identify the problem. It seems that the friction at some point irritates them maybe when they flower. Is there a disease that manifests itself in the skin . I will try an open ended AV and see if this makes any difference. In a mare the penis would not suffer the same friction and this may explain the discomfort. The fact that the two stallions within a week apart have shown this reluctance is what is baffling. It is like there some contagious disease that has affected both. the handler is the same and the routine is the same. I will rest both for a week and try collecting them again maybe they are sore for some reason/I just dont know
Member:
dres

Posted on Sunday, Jan 21, 2007 - 3:32 pm:

I have no experience in Collecting stallions... all tho in reading what you say... it appears the common denominator is the AV...? Are they expensive? Could you purchase a new one ? Maybe there is a slight irritant that you can not detect in it.. ??

Good luck , its a good thing you are exploring this now... and not when you have mares lined up for semen...

On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
Member:
eoeo

Posted on Sunday, Jan 21, 2007 - 5:43 pm:

My first thought would be trying a completely different AV, whether it be a new one or what. That would definitely help define where the problem lies.

EO
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Monday, Jan 22, 2007 - 5:08 am:

Omar are you using lubricant in the AV and does it contain anything besides methylcellulose? I wonder if they could have developed a sensitivity to the lubricant?

Certainly there are skin diseases that would make the penis sensitive but careful examination should reveal lesions.
DrO
Member:
osakr

Posted on Monday, Jan 22, 2007 - 2:03 pm:

Well I am using the same lubricant that I have been using for years which is the Priority Care non spermecidal lube. I will try the Missorri AV tomorrow and see how it works. I have a mare that showed symptoms of EHV 3 . I was wondering if the mare may have infected the stallions since I know the virus ishighly contagious. One of the stallions had covered this mare naturally 3 weeks ago and maybe the AV passed n the virus to the nex stallion although we use disposable liners.
Member:
osakr

Posted on Wednesday, Jan 24, 2007 - 1:31 pm:

Dr. Oglesby,
We may have found out what was wrong with the collection procedure. The AV was tilted downward during the collection which just before the stallion ejaculated was uncomfortable because of the increased pressure on the head of the penis .This made the stallions quit at the last moment. Today we tilted the AV upwards putting preesure at the base of the penis and removing the pressure from the head of the penis.The stallion ejaculated comfortably . Thanks for your help
Moderator:
DrO

Posted on Wednesday, Jan 24, 2007 - 6:01 pm:

Excellent Omar, glad to hear you are back in business.
DrO
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