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Discussion on Do I have a black or a grulla?
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Member:
dsibley
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Posted on Wednesday, Apr 15, 2009 - 11:33 pm:
My sorrel & white overo mare foaled the most unusual filly yesterday. The stallion is homozygous for black, and I have been given a color guarantee (which doesn't really mean anything to me, as I bred for other aspects than color). My vet told me that I might get a dark bay instead of black, but definitely no spots. He was correct about the lack of paint spots; she has a star on her forehead but nothing else.
Dancer looked black when she was born, but when dried, she is a silvery gray. She has a dorsal stripe, leg barring, and black points. Could I have a grulla? I know the color may change when she sheds out, but with the apparent dun factor here, I am wondering?? I'll post a pic as soon as hubby can get it resized...
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Member:
leslie1
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Posted on Thursday, Apr 16, 2009 - 12:21 am:
hi
Sounds beautiful! congratz and yes baby pics plz
L645
There is a fun coat caulculator tool at https://www.horsetesting.com/CCalculator1.asp
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Thursday, Apr 16, 2009 - 8:14 am:
Without evidence of a dun dilution gene grulla is out.
DrO
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Member:
jjrichar
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Posted on Thursday, Apr 16, 2009 - 9:08 am:
A lot of times, babies that are the color you described, shed out to be black. Several of my mom's foals (including my black gelding) started out grulla or dun looking then shedded out black. We would LOVE to see pics. Congrats to you! Whew and a black filly w a star... how nice! ;-)
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Member:
paardex
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Posted on Thursday, Apr 16, 2009 - 3:26 pm:
Color is certainly not my strong point but I once had a black TB mare bred to a black KWPN [though he could have been the black that get's brownish in summer] and the foal was a gorgeous mousy gray! He grew up to be what we ignorant warmblood breeders call black but could[again] not be a real black in 'professional' eyes.
Jos
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Member:
chrism
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Posted on Thursday, Apr 16, 2009 - 6:25 pm:
My younger horse is a fading black. Her foal coat was sort of a weird dark mouse gray. I was told black foals often are this color and turn black when they shed out.
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Member:
dsibley
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Posted on Monday, May 4, 2009 - 3:13 pm:
Here is one photo of Dancer; I'm having trouble getting the others resized, but at least you can get an idea of her color...(isn't this just the sweetest picture of a baby ever?) This was taken at three days.
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Member:
leslie1
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Posted on Monday, May 4, 2009 - 3:43 pm:
She's BEAUTIFUL!
Does she have blue eyes? Very lovely color IMO
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Member:
dsibley
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Posted on Monday, May 4, 2009 - 4:18 pm:
no, her eyes are dark. I love her color, but she will be black. The stallion, Indian Artbeat, is homozygous for black. (Ee). My first choice for registry with APHA is Indian War Dance. Maybe we should have called her cyclone with that funny star!!
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Member:
leslie1
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Posted on Monday, May 4, 2009 - 4:56 pm:
dieliz
Great baby daddy. I love that stallion and was planning on using him on Punky. LOL, I actually posted a picture of him on HA awhile back. I love the at liberty video of him and Marie.
Soooooo, can I have yur filly? LOL JK
Please keep posting photos of her. I like the name too.
Leslie
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Member:
dres
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Posted on Monday, May 4, 2009 - 5:36 pm:
CUTE CUTE CUTE..
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
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Member:
stek
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Posted on Monday, May 4, 2009 - 6:22 pm:
My eyes tend to glaze over when talking about color genetics so I'm no help there, just wanted to say what an ADORABLE photo!!
Also, IME foal coat color is not at all equivalent with the actual coat color when they shed out to their 'real' hair...
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Monday, May 4, 2009 - 7:18 pm:
With Arabs blacks are usually born this mousy brown/gray color and then shed out to black. I'm not positive on other breeds, but my bet would be that she's going to be black.
Great photo!
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Member:
dsibley
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Posted on Monday, May 4, 2009 - 8:26 pm:
Leslie, I am definitely breeding to him again this year. His barn name is 'Stilts'. I went to see him, as he is only about two hours from me. What an incredible horse! Marie is an awesome trainer, but this guy is just so good. He's 17.2, and acts like a Labrador. I sound like an ad for the stallion, don't I? But the mind is soooo important.
BTW, Dancer will (sob...!!) be for sale...
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Member:
kpaint
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 8:18 am:
Such a beautiful baby. I am not near smart enough to have foals around here, but sure wish I was! Maybe someday.
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Member:
paardex
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 3:52 pm:
Beautiful pic and what an eye!
Could you tell me why a black foal would be APHA[isn't that paint] and why the daddy is nearly TB?
What does he do for a living? And what is your foal bred for?
Just curious and trying to learn..
Jos
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Member:
sooke
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 4:09 pm:
Dieliz - what a pleasant sight when I logged in today and saw that beautiful kid of yours front and center! Such a "knowing" look in that eye!
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 4:41 pm:
Jos, Paints allow solid colors as "breeding stock." They are still considered registerd Paints. I think they allow a certain percentage of other breeds in the pedigree,but a Paint person can answer this better.
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Member:
stek
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 6:12 pm:
Yes Sara is right, a solid colored horse can be a breeding stock paint. To be a registered paint, the horse must be Quarter Horse or Thoroughbred, anything else can't be registered with the APHA. Often 'painted' non-QH/TBs are called pintos.
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 7:20 pm:
Back to that confusing color stuff again, Jos! Are you wishing you were back in Europe where everything seemed to be bay,black, chestnut or gray? 
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Member:
leslie1
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 7:54 pm:
Jos, daddy is an Appendix Qh. Alot of Appendix/Qh are used as hunters now in the AQHA classes.
Here is his website and if you get a chaNCE check out his sire too. An AQHA World Champion in Hunter under Saddle. veeery nice horse!
https://www.oewequinecenter.com/artbeat.html
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Member:
dsibley
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 11:46 pm:
Just to clarify, Indian Artbeat is an own son of Indian Artifacts, who is indeed an AQHA world champion. Artbeat (aka Stilts) is registered as an Appendix QH, as his dam is thoroughbred. AQHA rules allow an Appendix to be registered as a full QH when they have earned ten (? I think) points in AQHA open classes, which he has done.
My mare, Jane's Warpaint, is unshown. She is a beautiful mover, and a natural jumper. She is good sized, at nearly 15.2, good bone and big feet. She has a very sweet disposition, and good conformation. While I really like Indian Artifacts, I couldn't justify the stud fee on an unshown mare.
Then I saw the son, 'Stilts'. He really has better conformation than his sire, and his dam's side is blue-blooded. Her grandsire was Horse of the Year in England!! Stilts is registered with the American Warmblood Society, making his get eligible as well. So...I have a breeding-stock paint as well as (I hope) a warmblood.
I have a couple of other pics that I will try to post as well...one shows Dancer jumping a barrel in the roundpen at three days old!!
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Member:
dsibley
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Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 11:58 pm:
Here's another photo of Dancer. Still trying to get the other one resized....grrr....
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Member:
dsibley
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Posted on Wednesday, May 6, 2009 - 7:18 am:
Last one...
I think she's gonna be a lot like her daddy. She was three days old here...
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Member:
mrose
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Posted on Wednesday, May 6, 2009 - 9:23 am:
Love those long legs! Nice filly. Good luck with her.
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Member:
jjrichar
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Posted on Wednesday, May 6, 2009 - 9:44 am:
Yes, as others have said, I do believe you have a black filly on your hands. She is very nice (and mama too) Congrats to you. My Black gelding was born the same color.
In order to be Grullo they have to have the dun gene like Dr. O said, and a dorsal stripe.
Congrats again!
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Member:
canter
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Posted on Wednesday, May 6, 2009 - 10:02 am:
Adorable filly! Enjoy.
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Member:
leslie1
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Posted on Wednesday, Jun 10, 2009 - 9:39 pm:
Hey Dieliz
Hows the stilts baby doing?? More pics plz
Leslie
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