This is an archived Horseadvice.com Discussion. The parent article and menus are available on the navigation menu below:
HorseAdvice.com » Training, Behavior, & Conditioning Horses » Hunters & Jumpers »
  Discussion on Head between legs at canter
Author Message

Posted on Tuesday, Sep 25, 2001 - 3:31 pm:

I have a 4 year old TB mare who is off the track. I have been working with her for 18 months now. About 6 months ago we went through a stage where at the canter she would hold her head up high, grab the bit and run. I finally got her slowed down and light on the bit, and she even started to travel with her head lower and more rounded. Then, about 2 weeks ago, she started to travel at the canter with her head down really low and behind the bit (yes, i know this is an evasion of my aids). More leg and seat only gets me a faster canter with head still low. I also hold my hands a little higher to "help" her up but this is not sucessful as well. Her trot and walk headset have remained the same - she is very light and responsive.

I ride this horse in a jointed kimberwick because it gives me more control if necessary (she is a bit spooky still). Typically I have to have very little contact with her mouth and am very careful about not pulling on her.

Any help would be appreciated!

Marci

Posted on Thursday, Sep 27, 2001 - 12:22 pm:

Yes, it sounds to me like she is trying to evade the action of the bit.

If you ride western, you might want to consider using a mechanical hackamore (no bit) during your months of training until you have her mind at ease. Then try re-introducing a bit.

This helped tremendously with a horse some people had I knew. That horse would get so far behind the bit, his whole head/ chin would touch his neck! Needless to say, he was quite the runaway until they started in a hackamore.

Posted on Monday, Oct 1, 2001 - 1:20 pm:

Sounds to me like she is just experimenting with her head and mouth, trying to figure out what you want. She just went a little far!
My latest horse used to "curl up" especially while cantering when he was green. I found that if I kept doing transitions he would start to take more contact. It seemed to be harder to keep that curled frame when doing walk/trot, trot/canter etc. This might also help with her quickness.
Also, keep a soft elastic contact even when she curls so she knows she can't get away from it, but make it a soft elastic (inviting) contact so she will learn to appreciate it. Good luck and be patient!!

Posted on Monday, Oct 1, 2001 - 3:59 pm:

thank you Penner and Selley for your advice!

Penner, I am a little afraid to try a hackamore as I do ride english, and have no experience with one. There is a man at my barn who uses one, and I will try to talk to him tonight and take a better look at his.

Shelley, I think you might be right about her trying to figure out what I want - I will try doing more transitions as you suggest - if nothing else it will give her something else to think about and get her off her front end! This is the one thing that scares me as I don't want her to end up doing a sommersault!

One thing that could also be happening, is as she is still growing, maybe her balance is off - and her hindquarters have started to grow so her back end is higher than her front end which makes her more "downhill"..

Posted on Monday, Oct 1, 2001 - 7:59 pm:

A couple of stray thoughts, not sure if they're your situation but:

My quite experienced horse does this sometimes, and I think there are occasions when he's just stretching and others when he's evading. My dressage teacher gave me the following to think about: Getting him working from behind is what's called for, even if the horse is going a little quick. Don't worry about her speed -- get a rein length that gives you steady contact, and try visualizing you're holding the ends of strings tied to logs you've just thrown off a bridge, letting them take your hands as the current gently pulls them downstream. Wait the horse out, keep her moving from behind, let her settle into your hands which are offering steady contact (you can't give "light contact" that's steady, if by "light contact" you are trying to stay off the bit. Get this "on the bit" activity well established at the trot, both directions, and after she's moving nicely then ask for the canter. Maybe you can do your flat work in a snaffle, in a ring that will give you some comfort she won't run away. Now this is a warmblood I ride, not a TB, so I could be way off on getting the flat work right with a TB!

Also, have you had her teeth done? My dentist does "bit seats", and also thinks fat snaffles (which we use because they're gentle) can actually be unkind in some mouths that don't have enough room between the bars to accomodate them. A friend of mine's gelding had a lot of problems at the canter (much more evasive than your mare -- he would buck), that were alleviated when the dentist removed an impacted wolftooth. His trot walk was brilliant, it was just the canter, and mainly one direction (the one that jarred that poor tooth). Just to say a base to cover if you haven't already.

Good luck!
Melissa

Posted on Wednesday, Oct 3, 2001 - 4:13 pm:

Melissa, thanks for your advice. I tried your advice about getting her well established at the trot and then asking for the canter. I was very careful to keep the elastic contact that you mentioned. Any time she started moving her head down or pulling I just moved my hands up,sat deep, and pushed her into it with my legs and seat. I think you are right about her needing to work from behind, and the more I think about it that is probably why I sometimes have stopping problems - she is so on the forehand and almost leaning on me that she can't stop!

question, what kind of "snaffle with a ring to give you some comfort that she won't run away"" are you referring to? I have tried a larger hollow mouth snaffle and will tell you that you are right about it being too big for her mouth. I have also tried a french snaffle and that was just not enough for her. I have a slow twist and I could try that - maybe I will do that. What about one of those corkscrew full cheeks? have you ever used one of those? also, what about a bauche? that is less curb action than a kimberwick, so it might not encourage her to DrOp her poll so much - let me know what you think

thanks!

Posted on Thursday, Oct 4, 2001 - 10:53 pm:

Marci,
Sorry, I have no experience with any of these bits. My horse has always gone in a fat hollow loose ring snaffle, and a Dr. Bristol for cross-country where he got excited. Sounds like you're getter her to listen to you though. Are you sitting down and really leaning back for a big "whoa" when she starts to run away? Maybe you could use a hollow snaffle for your flatwork and something a little stronger for hacking out when she gets rowdy. Just a thought.
Best,
mw
Home Page | Top of Page | Join Us!
Horseadvice.com is a BBB Accredited Business. Click for the BBB Business Review of this Horse Training in Stokesdale NC