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  Discussion on Head flipping/ducking up and down
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Posted on Tuesday, Aug 10, 1999 - 8:09 pm:

Hello everyone!!Actually this is Debra's daughter-Rachel.I recently started working with a 10 year old thoroughbred(never raced) that hasn't been ridden very consistantly for a long time,although is in pretty good shape and weight. She has a great personality and seems happy when being ridden. It seems that she has had some training in the past since she is balenced and knows how to give and go on the aids nicely. However,when she does accept the bit after about 10 minutes of riding,she ducks up and down every few strides. She's worse to the left, but stays soft and on the bit longer and more consistantly to the right.The owner claims her teeth were floated recently-whether they were or not I don't know. Could it just be that her muscles aren't developed enough to stay down and use her back for a longer period of time? How can I be sure that she did get her teeth done? I forgot to mention that I ride her in regular -fairly wide snaffle. Also -for a while a beginner type rider attempted riding her and the mare quickly learned that she could yank her right out of the saddle by pulling at her hands. Could it be that this is just a habit and she will realize that it won't work with me?Thanks for any sugestions and input.

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 10, 1999 - 8:31 pm:

My suggestion would be to lunge her in side reins to see if the behavior still occurs without a rider. In that case I would guess her back is relatively weak and needs strengthening. I would strenghten the back with a lot of lunge work and shorter riding times. Check her back before and after every ride for soreness. If she is sore, do not even use side reins when you lunge, use a thick western pad under your saddle when riding and don't sit the trot. Limit your riding to 10-15 minutes until the soreness disappears.

If the behavior does not occur during lunging and her back is not sore, then I would guess it is a learned behavior. Once she learns all she will encounter when she pulls is a resistant hand and she can't unseat you, she should stop the behavior.

As for being sure it is not her teeth, my only advice would be have a vet check her out. :-) I do know that a thick snaffle may not often be the best for some horses...if your horse has a small palette a thinner bit may actually be more comfortable.

JMHO- not a horse trainer just a backyard dressage horse owner!
Jaime in Washington

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 10, 1999 - 8:46 pm:

Thanks for your suggestions. I checked her back today and she didn't appear to be sore at all. I've used a thinner bit and she still shook her head, and her bridle was also adjusted well-the bit wasn't too high or anything like that. I'll try longing her to see if I can figure anything out. I'm 14 and have been riding for over 5 years.I've ridden and helped train and saddle break a LOT of different horses-including ones with similar problems. However, this horse seems like it might be more of a weakness issue more than anything.
I recently had to put my own own horse down-a Thoroghbred mare that I had been working in the children's jumpers with. She came down with an unknown virus after being brought to Rochester clinic for a severe colic and they are still testing tissues over at Cornell to identify it. It's been really tough and I have just started riding this mare and others to keep myself riding.I'm hoping her problem isn't serious as she seems like she has a lot of talent and supposedly has jumped 5 feet.(who knows with her owner!)Thanks for your help-Rachel

Posted on Tuesday, Aug 10, 1999 - 10:23 pm:

I hate it when that happens! I dunno but it sounds to me like the mare is yanking to get her head back out of your hands. If your hands don't have too heavy a grip which I think should be looked at by someone who knows... then (I know some will condemn me for sayin this but....)I would bump her mouth to say "stop that" every time she does it till she stops

Posted on Monday, Aug 16, 1999 - 3:31 pm:

To supplement Jaime's approach and Ever's comments -

If the horse is quiet on a lunge with side reins, this would suggest the rider's hands may be causing some fussiness. To help the rider, it helps to think of having hands like side reins - a length is chosen and they are kept quiet, with the same rein length.

If the horse starts out lunging okay, but begins to fuss after a short while, this would suggest the musculature isn't developed enough to support continued work "on the bit."

As a strategy for undersaddle, I would work the horse lightly for a short period, before she becomes fussy, then reward her with a stretch break at the walk. Then I would ask her to work, again. Over time, the working periods can become longer. The idea is to show the horse what she can do and give her breaks for doing it.

Since she hasn't been ridden for quite some time, I would put her on a program that would gradually improve her fitness over a period of two months. To expect her body to adjust to work in a shorter time is unfair.

This assumes the bit is correctly fitted and her teeth are okay. The bit could, indeed, be too thick.

Sometimes horses start fussing because their tongue gets over the bit. You might want to use a DrOpped or flash nose band if you think this is the case for a while. Be sure not to adjust it too tight - you should be able to slip two fingers in between the strap and the horse's chin.

You've also described a classic horse challenge - one side is hollow and the other stiff. This is your challenge as the rider - to help the horse move straight such that it is equal in both hands, both seat bones and both legs. Lots of figures, riding correctly through corners, leg yields, serpentines and directional changes will help, too. It is easy to think the "soft" side is good, but it really isn't honest. You want the horse to take a bite of the overly soft rein and become more honest.

Hope this gives you some ideas.
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