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Discussion on How do you evaluate conformation of horses under 3 years of age?
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Member:
Canderso
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Posted on Tuesday, Jan 16, 2007 - 9:53 am:
Can anyone provide some advice and/or some good sources for learning about evaluating conformation of sport horses 0 - 3 years of age? (I am starting to get close to almost comfortable with adult horses, but babies? Yikes!!)
For example, I have heard you should look at a horse at 3 days, 3 months and 3 years... and ignore it pretty much any other time.
I have also heard all the same measures/ratios apply regardless of age.
So how do YOU evaluate the conformation of horses under 3 years of age?
What do you look for?
What do you ignore?
What are good things?
What are your 'run away!' things?
What do you look for in baby feet/ pasterns/ fetlocks?
How do you predict if adult will end up tall/short backed or short leg/long back?
How do you predict uphill or downhill?
How do you predict heaviness?
Do the fundamental angles (shoulder, hip) carry forward into adulthood?
Can you evaluate baby movement the same as adult movement? Are there things you can/should forgive?
I realize this is a huge topic in and of itself, but any help/advice you can provide is appreciated!
Cheryl
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Member:
Dres
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Posted on Tuesday, Jan 16, 2007 - 10:29 am:
https://www.equiworld.net/conformation/index.htm
https://petcaretips.net/equine_conformation.html
https://library.thinkquest.org/CR0215600/Conformation%20hyperlink.htm
Take a breeder with you if you are looking as well.. and pray... 
On the first day God created horses on the second day he painted them with spots..
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Member:
Stevens
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Posted on Tuesday, Jan 16, 2007 - 3:49 pm:
Cheryl,
There's an article on that subject in the latest USDF Connection magazine; I think.
Ann's advice to take a breeder with you is great. Someone who's seen many babies and actually knows how they turned out in adulthood would be worth their weight in gold.
Have fun!
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Member:
Dres
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Posted on Tuesday, Jan 16, 2007 - 6:54 pm:
finding a young horse is scary.. I am putting myself out on a limb here.. This is one of my home bred fillys.... she is 11 months old here, first impression WALK AWAY..
but then take a better look.. her angles on the hip are good, she has a long neck good throat latch, little heavy in the shoulder, long straight legs, good feet ..
This mare is now 5 and can jump the moon and floats like a butterfly...
Looking at the young horses takes skill and like i said above a prayer..
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
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Member:
Canderso
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Posted on Tuesday, Jan 16, 2007 - 9:39 pm:
Ann, you understand what I mean. Thank-you for making the point. (Though I quite liked your filly) Any chance you can post a '5 years later' picture?
Thanks for the suggestion about bringing a breeder with me (Karen, are you reading this???).
Keep the great advice coming guys! This is Gold!
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Member:
Dres
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Posted on Tuesday, Jan 16, 2007 - 10:19 pm:
Don't have a current confirmation shot of her..Her hindend is still slight, her shoulder is still 'massive' all tho that being said.. this mare has three ground covering strides, and a heart that will win...
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
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Member:
Canderso
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Posted on Wednesday, Jan 17, 2007 - 6:37 am:
So she kept her elegant body shape. What a pretty girl. Thanks, Ann.
How do you tell if the horse is going to grow the right feet for its size? (How many times do we see a horse with small feet, slender legs and massive body...)
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Member:
Stevens
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Posted on Wednesday, Jan 17, 2007 - 9:43 am:
Correction: the article I mentioned is in the Jan issue of Dressage Today.
Sorry for the error.
Chris
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Member:
Dres
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Posted on Wednesday, Jan 17, 2007 - 10:17 am:
CherylA , I have to say that in my line of breeding I have not noticed the small feet,>> All tho I understand the 1/4 horse are known for small feet / massive bodies.. I would image that you could tell very early on if the horses hoofs did not match.. I have a colt right now out of this mare above, he has the longest legs with what would seem to be small feet, but they look appropriate for the size of his bone now.. I have no concerns..
It is true that you look at the foal at 3 days / 3 weeks / 3 months.. It seems that most, not all, have a time in the growth period of balancing out.. They can really go thru the uglies, like I said above, I don't normally show off the 11 month old shots.. hehehehee
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
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Member:
Canderso
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Posted on Wednesday, Jan 17, 2007 - 3:38 pm:
Thanks Chris. I will look it up.
Thanks also, Ann. So you compare feet to bone? That makes sense.
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Member:
Imogen
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Posted on Wednesday, Jan 17, 2007 - 6:00 pm:
I think 6 months to 18 months is the hardest time to judge. I am not a judge but I am a show secretary and attend quite a few shows and like leaning on the rail and being my own "judge". Showing is weird anyway - it isn't about whether they will actually make decent sport horses.
I really agree about taking people who know with you (I seem to remember you have useful Irish relatives here Cheryl...). I will look at horses on my own but I never buy without advice from a friend of mine with a fantastic eye for conformation and excellent assessment of the horse's true scope.
What I do look for in young horses is basic correctness. I don't mind forearms looking weak or hips/shoulders appearing narrow, that usually sorts itself out, or about feet that look mildly turned out because as the frame grows the whole limb will turn in slightly. I do worry about apparently twisted or out of proportion anatomy. I do like to see a neck that looks generally "set the right way up".
I'd be interested to know if Ann's mare is now what Reiner Kleimke would call "swan necked" ie very flexible neck with a tendency to go behind/above the bit if given half a chance?
To use Ann's first picture above (hard, as the horse is moving...) what worries me there is that the hind legs look slightly turned in - but look at the second picture, to see either it's an artefact of the first picture or it hasn't caused a problem in reality...
The other thing that is always important as with all horse purchases is to ask informally about accidents, illnesses, care even for young horses. The horse can look wonderful and be a psycho because of the way it has been treated. Or it may have great bone but eg unmanageable sweet itch. Or perhaps it had an accident which hasn't had a physical effect (like it fell in the box because someone DrOve too fast, and will never travel right again). Or maybe mom is mad-dominant and baby's going to turn out the same.
It's amazing what people will tell you if you just ask...
Happy horse hunting!
Imogen
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Member:
Dres
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Posted on Wednesday, Jan 17, 2007 - 6:35 pm:
'''I'd be interested to know if Ann's mare is now what Reiner Kleimke would call "swan necked" ie very flexible neck with a tendency to go behind/above the bit if given half a chance?
To use Ann's first picture above (hard, as the horse is moving...) what worries me there is that the hind legs look slightly turned in - but look at the second picture, to see either it's an artefact of the first picture or it hasn't caused a problem in reality... '''
Imogen, you have a very good eye... Her hind end has always been slight, and even with muscle will never balance the front end..we have never noticed that she turns in, I think its the photo, the lucky thing tho is that she comes under herself well and even with little training I am not to concern about her being heavy on the forehand .. ''Swan neck?'' the little dip you see as a 11 month old is gone.. she has a long neck /very elegant /set nicely out of the shoulder, and easy to place her in a 'frame' .. The long neck can be hard to ride for a not so experienced rider as it can be very flexible (is that what you mean by swan neck?)
A good point in looking at the young ones is the temperament of the mother and sire.. My filly that I am rehabbing I bred for high performance and well she is high octane as well..
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots..
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Member:
Canderso
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Posted on Thursday, Jan 18, 2007 - 8:19 am:
Thanks for the specifics,Imogen. As always, your advice is wonderfully practical and straightforward!
Ann - Gotcha re checking out temperament through Sire and Dam.
Imogen, you are right about the 'useful relative', but he thinks the only valid use of a horse is for point-to-point racing ... and judges horses accordingly(!).
Here's a tip given to me by my barn owner: look at how the horse reacts when startled: you want the first reaction to be to round, and not to invert.
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Member:
Imogen
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Posted on Thursday, Jan 18, 2007 - 3:04 pm:
Yes, another friend of mine who's not a professional, but a serial nice sport horse owner with plenty of money for Goresbridge horse sales would agree with your barn owner, Cheryl...
I consider this friend to have a very good eye, but he will not buy any horse which moves away from you when you go to the stable door to look at it for the first time - he insists they are bright and alert and take an interest in you without being pushy or spooky. He thinks that attitude to something new and strange is a crucial pointer to the horse's underlying temperament and general state of mind. It works for him (although I'm sure the wallet helps too)!
Imogen
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Member:
Maggienm
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Posted on Saturday, Jan 20, 2007 - 8:06 pm:
I found both of these very interesting.
The first one is actually three parts, the end of part one will link you to part two etc.
https://www.americantrakehner.com/SportHorse%20Conformation/SHCpart1.htm
https://www.conbriofarms.com/pdfs/Evaluate300.pdf
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Member:
canderso
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Posted on Monday, Jan 22, 2007 - 1:21 pm:
Just back from a weekend skiing. Snow at last. Yay.
Lori thanks for the links to the articles. They are great.
Imogen - funny, that is a criteria my uncle has also (I'd forgotten!). Do you suppose it indicates a brave horse? (I suppose it also shows ones who have been hand-fed treats)
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Member:
leslie1
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Posted on Wednesday, Jan 7, 2009 - 8:06 pm:
Ann or whomever
What does that mean "heavy in the shoulder"? Too muscular or wrong angles? Or?
Thanks
LeslieC
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Member:
dres
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Posted on Thursday, Jan 8, 2009 - 10:30 am:
Leslie, heavy in the shoulder can mean several things to different folks.. you must see the horse to know what they are talking about.. it can mean that the shoulder is larger then the hindend thus not a balanced picture, it can mean where the shoulder comes out of the wither and connects with the chest??
I used the term above on the young horse becus she was and still is not balanced , her shoulder is stronger / thinker then her hindend.. again this is not always a bad thing.. A horse does not have to have perfect comfirmation to perform well.. but it sure does help and can make it easier on horse and trainer..
On the first day God created horses, on the second day he painted them with spots.
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