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Discussion on Laying down in the saddle
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Member:
Quatro
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Posted on Monday, Mar 28, 2005 - 3:21 pm:
Well, Levi is finally going back to work. I saddled him, bitted him, tied his reins to the stirrups, and we did a nice easy workout in the roundpen. Has not worked all winter. He did great, trotted, walked,whoa'd on command. We did some stretches before we worked. Then after lavishing praise on him. we were walking out of the roundpen and he just DrOpped. Headed for a roll. I had a hold of the lead rope and tried to yell at him to stop. He yanked the clasp rein off one side. He was not able to roll, but then he would not get up. Just laid there on his side. At first i was mad, then I thought, Oh No, what now! I unhooked the bridle, he just laid there, so I stood back, clicking at him. He finally got up, stood there while i took off the saddle. He then started chewing on the blanket and the saddle. I lead him on the lead rope, he walked around just fine. So i lead him out of the round pen to the his pasture. He walked slowly around till he spotted his buddies, tucked his butt and took off galloping. This horse is gonna be the death of me. I must assume that this was a behaviour problem, but I was a bit worried. He did this 2 other times, it was always when we first started to work after a rest. The first time was in my brand new tucker saddle, and he made it all the way over. What should I do to nip this in the bud. I only had a long line on him so I just yanked on it and reprimanded him, to no avail, as he weighs in at 1180.
Would you all agree this was a behavior problem, and not something physically wrong with him?
thanks
suz - My friends told me he thinks he is a dog, since I am a dog trainer, so he was just playing dead!!!!
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Member:
Hwood
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Posted on Monday, Mar 28, 2005 - 3:42 pm:
Pretty smart horse ;) . . . When work is done, he wants out of his work clothes and into his sweats . . . and wants to play with his friends!
Seriously, did he work up a sweat under the blanket? My first thought is that he was sweating under the blanket, felt itchy and wanted to roll.
If I had a horse that I thought was going to roll on me, I would hole my right hand with the lead rope up by his eye . . . with no tension on the lead, but with such a slight amount of slack that when I needed to hold up on the lead, I would only need to move my hand up and back a tiny bit . . . Horses most often lower their noses to the ground before they lie down or roll, so if you can keep your hand on the lead ready to pull him toward you to bend his neck and lift his nose to the inside . . . maybe that would "nip it in the bud?" If you suspect he is going to ignore you, then try getting in an "attack mode" with your body language (couch toward him and stomp your foot and move in toward his chest), and make lots of loud, ugly noises at him . . .
Other folks will think you've gone nuts . . . and maybe, after a few times, your horse will figure it's not worth it to even THINK of lying down when on the lead.
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New Member:
Dtjb
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Posted on Monday, Mar 28, 2005 - 9:50 pm:
Hi Susan,
I caution you about this behaviour(rolling or going down whilst at work), especially because after Levi completed did it you "rewarded" him by letting him stay down, and then taking off the saddle.
I have a mare with a bad & dangerous habit (and a LOT of issues from a previous home)...when she has "had enough" or is being pushed a bit, she simply lays down. Her previous owner (a child) would jump off her, and at that point she would stand up again~voila freedom! I suspect it started because she was hot & sweaty and wanted relief (like your boy),and it escalated when she figured out that laying down meant no work.
I'm not sure if your horse is going down for the same reasons, but he IS getting the same reward for the behaviour...laying down=no work.
My mare did it while she was being ridden. She was quick about it, and worked as a western pleasure horse, thus her head was not kept "up" all the time. Eventually, I figured out that if I did not get off her, she would grow tired of this type of evasion. So, I brought a book with me and whenever she was down (or even just "sitting down"), I'd read the book.
Uncomfortable with the saddle & a rider on, she eventually would stand back up and figured not to do it any more...that behaviour no longer "rewarded" her with freedom.
Now that I have spent some time with her, we have gone back to the basics and worked out almost all of her resistance. What a great little horse she has turned out to be!
Anyways, best of luck!
Jackie
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Member:
Vickiann
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Posted on Monday, Mar 28, 2005 - 10:02 pm:
Yesterday when I was riding with a friend, her horse was hot and sweaty and the insects were bothersome. Suddenly he just laid down on his side. First time this horse had ever done that, but yesterday he seemed so sensitive to whatever was making him physically uncomfortable he simply couldn't cope. She got off, grabbed ahold of the reins as be was backing away, and after a brief moment of thinking he would flee, the horse settled down. Years ago riding in Costa Rica my daugher had a horse that when he got tired and had enough, he just laid down, not on his side, but just down with his legs under him. My husband and I laughed and laughed. Eventually my daughter got the knack of pulling him up before he would go down. Over the course of the day each of our horses also tried to lay down! I think you can learn to anticipate this is going to happen and pull the horse back up unless you get a horse like another friend of mine had (she gave him away) who was a bad actor all around. Laying down when he didn't want to work was just one of his bad tricks, and he wasn't too careful about whether he hurt the rider in the process, so horses who do this can do it at degrees that are funny or dangerous. My paint horse will sometimes try to lay down and roll if we riding out in the lake, but he is responsive to my cues. Hope you can get this under control! Good luck.
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Moderator:
DrO
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 7:23 am:
When the horse starts to go down I would take a light whip and urge him to keep moving forward with it.
DrO
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Member:
Canderso
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 7:40 am:
Susan,
My buckskin has gone down to roll with me on top twice. A previous owner sold him on because he kept DrOpping under her.
After I got him we found out he had some pretty serious lameness issues - with her, I suspect he was avoiding the pain (as well as being a brat).
With me, both days were bright sunny winter days with about a foot of fresh new snow and he had not had turn out for a few days. I think he just forgot I was there.
But the other part of the story is that this horse LOVES to roll. So we have agreed on a compromise:
(a) I am EXTREMELY vigilant when leading him and either make it clear he may roll, or he may not (as Holly mentioned, watch for the head DrOp - it is a pretty specific move); and
(b) I get his tack off as quickly as possible after each ride and then invite him to roll. He will ask by putting his head down and kind of dragging his nose in the footing; if I allow his head to go down, he knows he can roll.
Since I have started doing this, there has been no problem.
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Member:
Kthorse
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Posted on Tuesday, Mar 29, 2005 - 10:11 am:
Hi Susan,
My tooooo smart arab did that to me for the first time a few weeks ago. He was all hot and sweaty from walking 2 miles up hill on the mountain near us. He has his winter coat and I guess was feeling uncomfortable. He has never done it before so he took me by suprise. He walks with his nose to the ground to stretch a little after climbing the mountain, so this was nothing out of the ordinary. He forgot I was on his back, my mistake for relaxing also to much. Now I can tell he thinks about this all the time. I made the mistake of getting off because I thought he would crush my leg. I hope he doesnt think he trained me to jump off now. Smart horses, I dont know they just keep you working, you cant take your mind off them for a second>  .
I will be not allowing the nose to go down and if I do let him stretch I will have that crop handy. Good luck.
Katrina
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